History Headscratchers / PercyJacksonAndTheOlympians

15th Apr '17 7:50:07 AM Adam9011
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* this counts for actual Greek mythology as well but Athena's mother was supposed to have a child stronger then the father ,but Athena is always said to be weaker than the big three. Why is that? Did Zeus "technically" give birth to Athena so it doesn't count?
8th Apr '17 2:52:54 AM Robotech_Master
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*** But, you see, he ''was.'' It's just that the Mist twisted them into things that seem ordinary, commonplace, or even apocryphal. For example, perhaps Washington's battle in his youth against a powerful cherry tree dryad only survives as a made-up story about how he couldn't tell a lie.


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** And then there's the fact that [[spoiler:Thalia and Jason Grace]] are siblings, coming from two separate visits by two different aspects of the same god.
8th Apr '17 2:44:55 AM Robotech_Master
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* Why is Zeus such an idiot? Seriously, I know he is supposed to have deep character flaws, but for the ruler of the world he comes across as a complete moron. Every time he is mentioned or shows up it only makes a situation worse, screwed up, or acted like a complete jerk (putting it very nicely). If he cannot bully his way out of a problem or use a thunderbolt to solve it he comes across as useless. Under his rule in recent times we have had two near civil wars in the first book of each series (the first being his fault), two crisis he has ignored when they are obvious allowing them to grow in strength (both threats), and such dislike of his rule that he basically gave both Kronos an army with the demigods and minor gods. All in all he comes across as something worse than a massive jerk being paranoid gullible, incredible arrogant even for gods, and all around unlikable. Add on his general disregard for others (including wanting to put off saving his own wive) he insipirs little to no loyalty in anyone except his wife and perhaps Athena. About the only purpose he serves is to keep the gods somewhat under control with a WMD and one wonders what that says about the Olympians as a whole. Is this really the only way to portray him? Wouldn't it be easier to destroy Olympus by turning them against each other? It comes across as fairly easy thing to do.

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* Why is Zeus such an idiot? Seriously, I know he is supposed to have deep character flaws, but for the ruler of the world he comes across as a complete moron. Every time he is mentioned or shows up it only makes a situation worse, screwed up, or acted like a complete jerk (putting it very nicely). If he cannot bully his way out of a problem or use a thunderbolt to solve it he comes across as useless. Under his rule in recent times we have had two near civil wars in the first book of each series (the first being his fault), two crisis he has ignored when they are obvious allowing them to grow in strength (both threats), and such dislike of his rule that he basically gave both Kronos an army with the demigods and minor gods. All in all he comes across as something worse than a massive jerk being paranoid gullible, incredible arrogant even for gods, and all around unlikable. Add on his general disregard for others (including wanting to put off saving his own wive) he insipirs inspires little to no loyalty in anyone except his wife and perhaps Athena. About the only purpose he serves is to keep the gods somewhat under control with a WMD and one wonders what that says about the Olympians as a whole. Is this really the only way to portray him? Wouldn't it be easier to destroy Olympus by turning them against each other? It comes across as fairly easy thing to do.





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\n** As with all the Greek gods, being larger than life means that Zeus's flaws are also larger than life. He was created out of storytelling, and it's worth noting that ''unflawed'' heroes make for terrible stories. (See also MarySue.) Also, power corrupts, and when you get right down to it Zeus was not exactly given the best upbringing as a child. Who exactly is going to be able to smack ''Zeus'' down and teach him a lesson when he does something stupid?
8th Apr '17 2:34:02 AM Robotech_Master
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*** I think it's stated that [[spoiler: she]] felt awful about it from the beginning, but as soon as she provided any information at all, [[spoiler: Luke]] threatened to expose [[spoiler: her]] as TheMole to everyone and [[spoiler: she]] didn't want people to find out. So at first it was a poor decision, and then [[spoiler: she]] was blackmailed into staying as the informant. Given that the more experienced campers were also [[taken in by Luke]] and mostly have pretty low expectations of [[spoiler: the children of Aphrodite]]'s decision making ability, it's easier for them to see [[spoiler: her]] as [[spoiler: Luke]]'s dupe than a traitor in [[spoiler: her]] own right.

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*** I think it's stated that [[spoiler: she]] felt awful about it from the beginning, but as soon as she provided any information at all, [[spoiler: Luke]] threatened to expose [[spoiler: her]] as TheMole to everyone and [[spoiler: she]] didn't want people to find out. So at first it was a poor decision, and then [[spoiler: she]] was blackmailed into staying as the informant. Given that the more experienced campers were also [[taken [[spoiler:taken in by Luke]] and mostly have pretty low expectations of [[spoiler: the children of Aphrodite]]'s decision making ability, it's easier for them to see [[spoiler: her]] as [[spoiler: Luke]]'s dupe than a traitor in [[spoiler: her]] own right.



** Cognitive dissonance is a powerful psychological tool, and in fact is frequently used in real-life brainwashing techniques. Get someone to do something totally against their own moral code, and they'll convince themselves after the fact that what they did is so unlike them that they ''must'' have had a good reason for it, or they wouldn't have done it. Because obviously they ''did'' do it. In that light, you could say that having contributed to Beckendorf's death actually ''reinforced'' her commitment to Kronos's cause. Her aid to the enemy camp had led to the death of her boyfriend...so it ''must'' have been a worthy cause if she was willing to sacrifice her boyfriend for it.

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** Cognitive dissonance is a powerful psychological tool, and in fact is frequently used in real-life brainwashing techniques. Get someone to do something totally against their own moral code, and they'll convince themselves after the fact that what they did is so unlike them that they ''must'' have had a good reason for it, or they wouldn't have done it. Because obviously they ''did'' do it. In that light, you could say that having contributed to Beckendorf's death [[spoiler:Beckendorf's death]] actually ''reinforced'' her commitment to Kronos's cause. Her aid to the enemy camp had led to the [[spoiler:the death of her boyfriend...boyfriend]]...so it ''must'' have been a worthy cause if she was willing to sacrifice [[spoiler:sacrifice her boyfriend boyfriend]] for it.
8th Apr '17 2:32:32 AM Robotech_Master
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** Cognitive dissonance is a powerful psychological tool, and in fact is frequently used in real-life brainwashing techniques. Get someone to do something totally against their own moral code, and they'll convince themselves after the fact that what they did is so unlike them that they ''must'' have had a good reason for it, or they wouldn't have done it. Because obviously they ''did'' do it. In that light, you could say that having contributed to Beckendorf's death actually ''reinforced'' her commitment to Kronos's cause. Her aid to the enemy camp had led to the death of her boyfriend...so it ''must'' have been a worthy cause if she was willing to sacrifice her boyfriend for it.
8th Apr '17 2:25:44 AM Robotech_Master
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**** Greek mythology was largely an oral tradition. There were as many different variations of the stories as there were storytellers. The mythology we have now, and on which Riordan bases his stories, represents ''the tiniest fraction'' of stories of the gods that were told--the ones that were lucky enough to be written down by someone. In altering the myths to suit his own stories, Riordan is just following tradition.
8th Apr '17 2:18:54 AM Robotech_Master
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** The Gods look human, and act human in some ways, but they ''aren't'' human. They're embodiments of cosmic forces, given shape by the hopes and dreams of mankind ''as a whole.'' This leads to a sort of "uncanny valley" effect in which the various ways in which they ''aren't'' like humans are thrown into sharp dissonance by the ways in which they are. Even in the original mythology, their various failings were often used in parables to try to teach humans to be wiser about things. Small wonder they continue to have far ''more'' of those failings than most humans.
3rd Apr '17 12:16:09 PM QuarrelsomeChevon
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** No one said that Percy telling off Hera was a ''smart'' thing to do - he was doing it because it was the ''right'' thing to do, calling her out for the way she treated people she didn't consider perfect enough for her family, like Hephaestus or Nico.
31st Mar '17 6:52:19 PM seekquaze1
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*** I would say a large degree of ProtagonistCenteredMorality along with Gabe being an AssholeVictim along with him alone suffering the consequences. With the gods, it is not uncommon for them to do worse for far less even in modern times, but the people who suffer is not limited to the transgrissor, but anyone unlucky enough to be near them. Zeus cheats on Hera so Jason is given to her and Thalia thinks he is dead. Halcyon Green angers Apollo so he lures other demigods to their deaths. Hades is angry at Zeus so he takes it out on the Oracle. Poseidon is angry at Minos so he takes it out on his wife. Hera is angry at Zeus so she torments Hercules. Triptolemus is angry at an old grudge and temporarily turns Nico into a flower. Aeolus is mad at the gods so he orders the Wind Gods to kill any demigods they come across. Etc. Etc. Etc. Sally did it to a single person who actually wronged her. Does it make it right? No, but it not close to how bad the gods often do for more trivial actions.



* {{Percy Jackson's Greek Gods}} kind of addressed this by stating while Zeus has his moments of kindness and has responsibilities he has always been irresponsible which is why Greek kings tended to get away with abusing their power though I do admit Riordan's portrayal is one of the most stupid and jerkish portrayals I have ever seen. But I don't see your empathic moments working. He let Percy live because it would have looked bad killing a mortal who did him a service, shown favoritism for his own daughter which Zeus claims he is supposed to avoid, and to maintain peace with Poseidon which he explicitly stated why he let Percy live. And while he did offer to let Nico and Bianac go to Camp Half-blood it was the general mistreatment of Hades that caused the latter to distrust Zeus. Hephaestus stated Zeus excels as being a jerk, Hera confirmed he has a long history of letting his pride make wrong decisions and refuse to change unless he had to, and Achelous confirmed major Olympians are rarely punished for their crimes. Truth is, this version of Zeus is just a poor king whose positive traits are overshadowed by his negative ones especially when compared to other Riordan god-kines like Ra, Horus, and Odin. Hence, why Khione only needed to push him slightly into closing Olympus.


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* *** {{Percy Jackson's Greek Gods}} kind of addressed this by stating while Zeus has his moments of kindness and has responsibilities he has always been irresponsible which is why Greek kings tended to get away with abusing their power though I do admit Riordan's portrayal is one of the most stupid and jerkish portrayals I have ever seen. But I don't see your empathic moments working. He let Percy live because it would have looked bad killing a mortal who did him a service, shown favoritism for his own daughter which Zeus claims he is supposed to avoid, and to maintain peace with Poseidon which he explicitly stated why he let Percy live. And while he did offer to let Nico and Bianac go to Camp Half-blood it was the general mistreatment of Hades that caused the latter to distrust Zeus. Hephaestus stated Zeus excels as being a jerk, Hera confirmed he has a long history of letting his pride make wrong decisions and refuse to change unless he had to, and Achelous confirmed major Olympians are rarely punished for their crimes. Truth is, this version of Zeus is just a poor king whose positive traits are overshadowed by his negative ones especially when compared to other Riordan god-kines like Ra, Horus, and Odin. Hence, why Khione only needed to push him slightly into closing Olympus.

31st Mar '17 6:39:01 PM seekquaze1
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\n* {{Percy Jackson's Greek Gods}} kind of addressed this by stating while Zeus has his moments of kindness and has responsibilities he has always been irresponsible which is why Greek kings tended to get away with abusing their power though I do admit Riordan's portrayal is one of the most stupid and jerkish portrayals I have ever seen. But I don't see your empathic moments working. He let Percy live because it would have looked bad killing a mortal who did him a service, shown favoritism for his own daughter which Zeus claims he is supposed to avoid, and to maintain peace with Poseidon which he explicitly stated why he let Percy live. And while he did offer to let Nico and Bianac go to Camp Half-blood it was the general mistreatment of Hades that caused the latter to distrust Zeus. Hephaestus stated Zeus excels as being a jerk, Hera confirmed he has a long history of letting his pride make wrong decisions and refuse to change unless he had to, and Achelous confirmed major Olympians are rarely punished for their crimes. Truth is, this version of Zeus is just a poor king whose positive traits are overshadowed by his negative ones especially when compared to other Riordan god-kines like Ra, Horus, and Odin. Hence, why Khione only needed to push him slightly into closing Olympus.





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*** Headscratchers are often Headscratcher because there is no clear, plainly stated answer to something. The best one can do is infer from the given information. The "Olympians are jerks" is used to answer any question on why the Olympians did something that is jerkish because the books portray them, especially Zeus, as that big of jerks.
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