* It Just Bugs Me that tvtropes tends to have more information about the World of Darkness than many of the wikis soley about the World of Darkness. How is it that tvtropes, a wiki which focuses on thousands of different shows and tropes can have more information about one subject than entire wikis dedicated to that one subject?
** I can't say why the specialized wikis suck, but at a guess White Wolf probably doesn't want a wiki on its games to have ''too'' much content (or at enough detail) out of fear it become a substitute to their books. The official wiki's page in particular has some huge gaps, the article on the [[http://wiki.white-wolf.com/worldofdarkness/index.php?title=Ordo_Dracul Ordo Dracul]] (and two other covenants) showcase just how skimpy ''the official wiki is''. As to why TVTropes has so much info? Well, the site has a huge user base, and enough of us are fans of the games that a good pool of information was already present. TV Tropes had another advantage in the form of already having an extensive trope catalogue, so when we wrote the gameline/setting articles we weren't starting from scratch, just "plugging in tropes" (in fact, using the "related to" button helped people the first few articles). The fact that the setting is so gosh darn story centric it practically ''bleeds'' tropes made the rest almost easy.\\
So in a nutshell: TVTropes has the userbase, backup material, and knowledge to build such a wiki. The dedicated/official wiki lack one or more of the previous.

20th Oct '11 6:33:20 PM NOYB

Send NOYB a PM notification explaining the badness of natter: natter-fy

Changed line(s) 6 (click to see context) from:

to:

30th Sep '11 10:41:55 AM MagBas

Send MagBas a PM notification explaining the badness of natter: natter-fy

headscratchers is not to complaining

Changed line(s) 20,24 (click to see context) from:

* Why can't anyone make a decent, non-Vampire, World of Darkness computer or console game? The Hunter, Werewolf, Changeling, and Wraith concepts could all make really impressive interactive visual media. Mage might seem a little cramped, but it was still a fun setting.
** There have been a few Hunter games, but this troper has never played them.
*** They weren't * bad* games, exactly, but they didn't capture the feel of the actual Hunter games per se -- unsurprising, because they weren't even [=RPG=]s, just Gauntlet-style over-the-top action-adventure shooters. The plot was okay and the gameplay was okay but it wasn't really a story game at all, and the problem was a lot of people took the video games as a reflection of what playing Hunter was like (leading to the ludicrous-if-you've-ever-even-read-the-rules assertion that Hunters are "overpowered" relative to other characters because they can mow down thousands of undead at once, whereas in the actual RPG fiction Hunters are shown dying left and right while trying to accomplish modest goals like taking down a single random Caitiff or dealing with one haunted house).
** The trouble I've found with conceptualizing a oWoD games is that it is a bit open ended power-wise. The group I played with would combine powers and abilities. But, I may be more thinking of Werewolf Rites and Demon the Fallen. We also blatantly cheated some parts and rulings went towards whoever could rationalize/BS the best.
*** I played with a similar group. Not just oWoD, but if you could RulesLawyer something into RuleofCool, you won. The main thing, is you touch on the nature of the problem. The books are open ended and more a guideline than set in stone rules. You could have 10:1 odds in your favor or be playing multiple characters. Video games need to be strict or they don't work. They also are limited on how many players are allowed, and you need to be overpowered to win. Books be more of a middle ground. Limited characters who are probably more powerful/inventive/creative than the average character. They'll win, but it will probably only be barely.

to:

Changed line(s) 29,46 (click to see context) from:

* It Just Bugs Me that there are [[YaoiFangirl fangirls]] who completely ignore the concepts of the gamelines for the purposes of their [[MarySue Gary Stu]] slash. And I'm saying this as a female who ships Ventrue/Lasombra regardless of gender, but this bizarre trend just isn't ''good''. Inevitable maybe, but how are you an Assamite/Toreador/Ravnos with all the Disciplines involved? [[SeriousBusiness Clans do NOT work that way!]] And every time I see a sparkly-eyed yaoi-boy with [[CatGirl kitty ears]] or [[LittleBItBeasty fox ears]] and [[ThrowItIn two or three different clans]] forming some kind of thrice-bastard bloodline in his dead (but [[{{Moe}} presumably adorable]]) veins, it makes me want to retch blood. It's annoying enough even without the BoysLove stereotypes and waif-like builds and 100% pure sugar-cane sweetness (I mean, even the ''Toreador'' were acknowledged to often be [[CompleteMonster mean mutha'fuckers]]), but the flagrant disregard for the properties of the Blood make it even worse... Because it's hard to find an [=oWoD=] game these days, but with my only option being an all-gay game of the above, it's sort of a [[SadisticChoice masochistic choice]].
** Stuff like that happened in my games too at first, mostly because my players are teenagers. The girls always create a Bella Swan Captain Ersatz and the guys always make an overpowered badass with a dark troubled past. After a few sessions they eventually get better. A good way to get past that is to do character exercises, ask them what their character would realistically do,instead of what they think is the KEWLEST. It worked eventually for me.
*** I just feel like I shouldn't have to herd them through this: I'm not the Storyteller. There's no real plot and I think the only reason we know the prince exists is because he's both the GM's character ''and'' a PC; is it possible for the Sheriff (me) to sue the prince for sexual harassment? ''[[BishieSparkle Sparkles]]'' and ''feathery locks'' and ''that's just an {{Expy}} of [[TheVampireChronicles Lestat]]''... It's like their entire understanding of [=V:tM=] came from Kindred The Embraced and a browse through DeviantArt.
*** My only suggestion is you try to [[CombatSadomasochist turn pain]] into [[TooKinkyToTorture pleasure.]] Not to insult their intelligence[[hottip:* :(no, really, I'm not being sarcastic, they may actually have a keen but addled intellect under all the twee. The goal here is for you to have fun and try to snap them out of it)]] but they don't sound to be very combat, politically, or survival savvy. As the Sheriff, you already have a privileged position to bandy out state sanctioned violence and "tidy up messes." So tell your GM / Prince your character thinks the new players are "too green, dangerous for the masquerade" and get his help / approval to secretly frame them for various crimes, and then deputize them to help with the bloody cleanup to "atone". Have the GM okay your character setting up the crimes "off screen" before the session, but make it fair; give them a chance to put clues together so they can find out you set them up. If they confront you, [[FullyEmbracedFiend casually]] and [[AffablyEvil cordially]] tell them it was all a test to help toughen them up. If they complain that's not the game they want to play, point out they aren't playing the game ''you'' want to play. If the GM / Prince doesn't help out, then have fun the old fashioned way: turn the GossipyHens on each other with "she told me she thought you..." etc etc. and then have your character restore peace with a "modicum" of force.

* Why do people seem to think all Demons are evil. Did anyone but me actually read Demon the Fallen?
** A gamer who only plays NeutralGood Fallen here. But you are right, very few have actually read, much less played DTF, because it was forever eclipsed by everyone's favorite bloodsuckers and wolfmen...
** I think it's because most of them didn't play Demon: The Fallen, and in all the other books demons are portrayed as, well, evil. There may have been an exception or two in other gamelines, but if so I can't recall. Remember, the vast majority of demons ''are'' evil, twisted by Torment or so uncaring that they're entirely self-absorbed: The [=PCs=] are implied to be of the very, very few whose human hosts combined with their demonic selves to unlock some motivation for attempting to protect, or at least live among, Mankind.
*** It just gets really annoying when [=GMs=] advertise that you can play any [=WoD=] race you want, then backtrack and say you can't play a demon because "They're all evil." Well no, they aren't. And obviously if I'm making a demon character, I'm making it in Demon: the Fallen, where starting characters are, by definition, low Torment demons, probably with a good deal more humanity than the average vampire or werewolf.
*** Recall that ''Demon'' is a lesser-known gameline along the lines of ''Wraith'' or ''Kindred of the East''; it's possible the GM hadn't expected those who might like to play a demon (or even heard of the gameline) and is handwaving it by saying "No ChaoticEvil characters." It might be worth the time to educate them on the reality of playing a demon [=PC=], including the fact that while most demons ''are'' evil, by no means is ''every'' demon evil; and that demon [=PCs=] are likely to have a good dose of morality. (Use terms like "High Humanity" if it helps.) On the other hand, if the GM just isn't open to allowing demon [=PCs=], ask them for an explanation-- It's possible that their crossover-game/plot/ect just doesn't have room for demons, though that should be stated up-front.

* It bugs me that the World of Darkness never was all that keen on diversity. White Wolf has this ironbound image in their heads that all of their players are straight white guys who listen to German death metal. It can feel alienating if you don't fit that mold, which is a tad hypocritical. And all attempts at writing about the strange thing called "other people and cultures" tend to be TheThemeParkVersion at best and offensively stereotyped at worst. Whenever I play a [=WoD=] game, I always have a knee-jerk urge to create a non-white (and often non-straight) character just because I hate how they're so {{wallbang}}erishly portrayed in the books.
** They're a bunch of white, schlubby good old boys from Georgia. When the Gypsy book came out and was panned for being incredibly racist (didn't it make anti-Roma blood libel canon?) one of the credited writers defended himself by claiming that he didn't know that Roma were real. It's kind of hard to expect them to be enlightened.
** Um...wow. It looks like more [[WallBang wallbanging]] is in store. I'm scared to ask why there were barely any blacks or Latinos in the books either. Are we mythical creatures too?
*** Err, what? There ''are'' black and latino characters in the books; Theo Bell instantly springs to mind as the Brujah Signature character (he's black in case you don't know who he is). Over in Hunter the Reckoning (the game I have the most experience with), we have Witness1 (Asian), Bookworm55, God45 (Black) as signature characters who weren't white, and there's also Traveller, Memphis and that Infernal Extremist from Fall from Grace (Black), Soyboy (Asian), several south American hunters (Latino) and a few people from the middle east (Arabic). And keep in mind, I pulled all of these names off the top of my head. I would not call the above "barely" any. Is the ratio of white-to-minorities off? Yes, but the same could be said of Marvel, DC, StarWars, StarTrek, GIJoe, etc. etc. etc.
*** Some games were better about it than others. Hunter had a decent mix, yes, but other games tended to give non-whites horribly stereotyped and poorly-researched ThemeParkVersion cultures. ''Vampire'' and ''Werewolf'' being the worst by far.
*** It's not really a "white or non-white" thing, it's more "everywhere White Wolf is not." Their sourcebooks on parts of Europe (for a very noted example their UK one) were terrible too. Even sourcebooks about other parts of the U.S. that basically weren't Georgia were full of idiocy too. I seem to remember in the one about New England (Dark Colony) at one point the author talks about suburbs of Boston three hours to the west (three hours west of Boston is known as New York). Basically it boils down to WW just sucks about getting people who know the topic they're to write about.

to:

30th Sep '11 10:34:56 AM Tambov333

Send Tambov333 a PM notification explaining the badness of natter: natter-fy

Changed line(s) 45 (click to see context) from:

to:

30th Sep '11 7:19:07 AM DesertDragon

Send DesertDragon a PM notification explaining the badness of natter: natter-fy

Changed line(s) 46 (click to see context) from:

to:

30th Sep '11 7:18:29 AM DesertDragon

Send DesertDragon a PM notification explaining the badness of natter: natter-fy

Changed line(s) 45 (click to see context) from: