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Changed line(s) 23 (click to see context) from:
* How is Arthur the head of a ''spy agency'' and fails to notice the cups being switched right next to him, even if he's briefly turned away? It was justified by Eggsy's low-class upbringing working to his advantage, but by that logic Galahad wouldn't have noticed him trying to steal something from the armory, which he did. Old age? A lack of mentor intuition that Harry has? He could just be underestimating Eggsy but he didn't seem surprised when the latter figured out he was under Valentine's control almost immediately after sitting down.
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*** The Mooks' priorities make sense to me. 1.) Eggsy is taking down pretty much every guard on his way back to Valentine, so the most important task is to stop him from reaching their boss before Eggsy kills him. Blowing up the plane doesn't mean anything if Valentine's dead. 2.) If Eggsy turns back around and manages to get past the small army that followed him in, they need to get rid of the plane. So they destroy with the ''nearest, fastest, and most effective weaponry.'' The AA missiles are right down the runway, and fit all of those requirements. Remember, neither the mooks nor Valentine know that Merlin's in the system until he activates the implants. It made sense (at the time) to go for what they thought was the more immediate threat first. Remember, they also go after the plane shortly after sending that huge group after Eggsy, which means they weren't ''ignoring'' the plane, they were just dealing with what seemed to be the bigger issue first.
* How is Arthur the head of a ''spy agency'' and fails to notice the cups being switched right next to him, even if he's briefly turned away? It was justified by Eggsy's low-class upbringing working to his advantage, but by that logic Galahad wouldn't have noticed him trying to steal something from the armory, which he did. Old age? A lack of mentor intuition that Harry has? He could just be underestimating Eggsy but he didn't seem surprised when the latter figured out he was under Valentine's control almost immediately after sittingdown.down.
** Harry got Eggsy out of jail for stealing a guy's car. Eggsy freely admits to Harry that the only time he knocks is if he's casing a joint to rob. Not only does Harry know well of Eggsy's light fingers at the point where he steals the hand grenade, but Harry's also GenreSavvy enough to figure that he'd take ''something'' after that slight misdirection. In contrast, Arthur had barely interacted with Eggsy, and isn't GenreSavvy at all. This is a guy who actually tries a JoinOrDie on the protagonist, after all. No matter what he thought of Eggsy's deduction/spy skills, Arthur still thought himself superior. In the end, that overconfidence blinds him at the worst (or best, for Eggsy) possible time.
* How is Arthur the head of a ''spy agency'' and fails to notice the cups being switched right next to him, even if he's briefly turned away? It was justified by Eggsy's low-class upbringing working to his advantage, but by that logic Galahad wouldn't have noticed him trying to steal something from the armory, which he did. Old age? A lack of mentor intuition that Harry has? He could just be underestimating Eggsy but he didn't seem surprised when the latter figured out he was under Valentine's control almost immediately after sitting
** Harry got Eggsy out of jail for stealing a guy's car. Eggsy freely admits to Harry that the only time he knocks is if he's casing a joint to rob. Not only does Harry know well of Eggsy's light fingers at the point where he steals the hand grenade, but Harry's also GenreSavvy enough to figure that he'd take ''something'' after that slight misdirection. In contrast, Arthur had barely interacted with Eggsy, and isn't GenreSavvy at all. This is a guy who actually tries a JoinOrDie on the protagonist, after all. No matter what he thought of Eggsy's deduction/spy skills, Arthur still thought himself superior. In the end, that overconfidence blinds him at the worst (or best, for Eggsy) possible time.
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Changed line(s) 22 (click to see context) from:
*** Considering that Eggsy is mopping the floor with every mook he comes across, ordering most of them to converge on him makes a fair amount of sense. And don't forget the reason why Eggsy is rampaging through the base in the first place: He's trying to stop Valentine's plan from coming to fruition. They're not trying to keep him from escaping, they're trying to make sure that he doesn't get to Valentine. Stopping Eggsy from getting to Valentine is the highest priority, destroying his escape is a secondary concern. As for the C4 idea, they may not actually have C4, or at least not have it on them at that moment. And for all they know, the outer hull of the plane could have tons of countermeasures to deal with anyone who touches the fusalage. Besides, considering the amount of C4 you'd likely need on the plane (especially if you want to ensure that anyone inside would be killed), an AA missile would probably be more efficient.
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*** Considering that Eggsy is mopping the floor with every mook he comes across, ordering most of them to converge on him makes a fair amount of sense. And don't forget the reason why Eggsy is rampaging through the base in the first place: He's trying to stop Valentine's plan from coming to fruition. They're not trying to keep him from escaping, they're trying to make sure that he doesn't get to Valentine. Stopping Eggsy from getting to Valentine is the highest priority, destroying his escape is a secondary concern. As for the C4 idea, they may not actually have C4, or at least not have it on them at that moment. And for all they know, the outer hull of the plane could have tons of countermeasures to deal with anyone who touches the fusalage. Besides, considering the amount of C4 you'd likely need on the plane (especially if you want to ensure that anyone inside would be killed), an AA missile would probably be more efficient.efficient.
* How is Arthur the head of a ''spy agency'' and fails to notice the cups being switched right next to him, even if he's briefly turned away? It was justified by Eggsy's low-class upbringing working to his advantage, but by that logic Galahad wouldn't have noticed him trying to steal something from the armory, which he did. Old age? A lack of mentor intuition that Harry has? He could just be underestimating Eggsy but he didn't seem surprised when the latter figured out he was under Valentine's control almost immediately after sitting down.
* How is Arthur the head of a ''spy agency'' and fails to notice the cups being switched right next to him, even if he's briefly turned away? It was justified by Eggsy's low-class upbringing working to his advantage, but by that logic Galahad wouldn't have noticed him trying to steal something from the armory, which he did. Old age? A lack of mentor intuition that Harry has? He could just be underestimating Eggsy but he didn't seem surprised when the latter figured out he was under Valentine's control almost immediately after sitting down.
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Changed line(s) 21 (click to see context) from:
** Considering the plane is Eggsy's only escape route should anything goes wrong, the plane should be a priority target for the mooks, with or without pilot. The large group of mooks that went after Eggsy into the base are only there to prevent him from escaping. The remaining guards inside the base are more than enough to trap him in the cell block, so there aren't any reason for the mooks outside to go into the base. Also, if the mooks thought there is no one else inside the plane, then why bother to destroy it with the anti-air missile at all? Even if there IS someone hidden inside, they could just stick some well-placed C4s on it instead of the complicated anti-air setup. (I ''assumed'' they have C4s with them because a GenreSavvy guy like Valentine should be prepared for anything and equipped his mooks appropriately. And even if the Kingsman plane is RPG-proofed, enough well-placed explosives will eventually blow it up.)
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** Considering the plane is Eggsy's only escape route should anything goes wrong, the plane should be a priority target for the mooks, with or without pilot. The large group of mooks that went after Eggsy into the base are only there to prevent him from escaping. The remaining guards inside the base are more than enough to trap him in the cell block, so there aren't any reason for the mooks outside to go into the base. Also, if the mooks thought there is no one else inside the plane, then why bother to destroy it with the anti-air missile at all? Even if there IS someone hidden inside, they could just stick some well-placed C4s on it instead of the complicated anti-air setup. (I ''assumed'' they have C4s with them because a GenreSavvy guy like Valentine should be prepared for anything and equipped his mooks appropriately. And even if the Kingsman plane is RPG-proofed, enough well-placed explosives will eventually blow it up.))
*** Considering that Eggsy is mopping the floor with every mook he comes across, ordering most of them to converge on him makes a fair amount of sense. And don't forget the reason why Eggsy is rampaging through the base in the first place: He's trying to stop Valentine's plan from coming to fruition. They're not trying to keep him from escaping, they're trying to make sure that he doesn't get to Valentine. Stopping Eggsy from getting to Valentine is the highest priority, destroying his escape is a secondary concern. As for the C4 idea, they may not actually have C4, or at least not have it on them at that moment. And for all they know, the outer hull of the plane could have tons of countermeasures to deal with anyone who touches the fusalage. Besides, considering the amount of C4 you'd likely need on the plane (especially if you want to ensure that anyone inside would be killed), an AA missile would probably be more efficient.
*** Considering that Eggsy is mopping the floor with every mook he comes across, ordering most of them to converge on him makes a fair amount of sense. And don't forget the reason why Eggsy is rampaging through the base in the first place: He's trying to stop Valentine's plan from coming to fruition. They're not trying to keep him from escaping, they're trying to make sure that he doesn't get to Valentine. Stopping Eggsy from getting to Valentine is the highest priority, destroying his escape is a secondary concern. As for the C4 idea, they may not actually have C4, or at least not have it on them at that moment. And for all they know, the outer hull of the plane could have tons of countermeasures to deal with anyone who touches the fusalage. Besides, considering the amount of C4 you'd likely need on the plane (especially if you want to ensure that anyone inside would be killed), an AA missile would probably be more efficient.
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Changed line(s) 21 (click to see context) from:
** Considering the plane is Eggsy's only escape route should anything goes wrong, the plane should be a priority target for the mooks, with or without pilot. The large group of mooks that went after Eggsy into the base are only there to prevent him from escaping. The remaining guards inside the base are more than enough to trap him in the cell block, so there aren't any reason for the mooks outside to go into the base. Also, if the mooks thought there is no one else inside the plane, then why bother to destroy it with the anti-air missile at all? Even if there IS someone hidden inside, they could just stick some well-placed C4s on it instead of the complicated anti-air setup. (I ''assumed'' they have C4s with them because a GenreSavvy guy like Valentine should be prepared for anything and equipped his mooks appropriately.)
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** Considering the plane is Eggsy's only escape route should anything goes wrong, the plane should be a priority target for the mooks, with or without pilot. The large group of mooks that went after Eggsy into the base are only there to prevent him from escaping. The remaining guards inside the base are more than enough to trap him in the cell block, so there aren't any reason for the mooks outside to go into the base. Also, if the mooks thought there is no one else inside the plane, then why bother to destroy it with the anti-air missile at all? Even if there IS someone hidden inside, they could just stick some well-placed C4s on it instead of the complicated anti-air setup. (I ''assumed'' they have C4s with them because a GenreSavvy guy like Valentine should be prepared for anything and equipped his mooks appropriately. And even if the Kingsman plane is RPG-proofed, enough well-placed explosives will eventually blow it up.)
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Changed line(s) 20 (click to see context) from:
** one, it's kind of dark inside the cockpit, so maybe they didn't actually see him. Second, they are dealing with people who have bulletproof umbrellas, it's pretty easy to assume they also have RPG-proof planes. They deliberately went for the big guns and didn't waste time on the target they couldn't hurt.
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** one, it's kind of dark inside the cockpit, so maybe they didn't actually see him. Second, they are dealing with people who have bulletproof umbrellas, it's pretty easy to assume they also have RPG-proof planes. They deliberately went for the big guns and didn't waste time on the target they couldn't hurt.hurt.
** Considering the plane is Eggsy's only escape route should anything goes wrong, the plane should be a priority target for the mooks, with or without pilot. The large group of mooks that went after Eggsy into the base are only there to prevent him from escaping. The remaining guards inside the base are more than enough to trap him in the cell block, so there aren't any reason for the mooks outside to go into the base. Also, if the mooks thought there is no one else inside the plane, then why bother to destroy it with the anti-air missile at all? Even if there IS someone hidden inside, they could just stick some well-placed C4s on it instead of the complicated anti-air setup. (I ''assumed'' they have C4s with them because a GenreSavvy guy like Valentine should be prepared for anything and equipped his mooks appropriately.)
** Considering the plane is Eggsy's only escape route should anything goes wrong, the plane should be a priority target for the mooks, with or without pilot. The large group of mooks that went after Eggsy into the base are only there to prevent him from escaping. The remaining guards inside the base are more than enough to trap him in the cell block, so there aren't any reason for the mooks outside to go into the base. Also, if the mooks thought there is no one else inside the plane, then why bother to destroy it with the anti-air missile at all? Even if there IS someone hidden inside, they could just stick some well-placed C4s on it instead of the complicated anti-air setup. (I ''assumed'' they have C4s with them because a GenreSavvy guy like Valentine should be prepared for anything and equipped his mooks appropriately.)
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Changed line(s) 19 (click to see context) from:
* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part or just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, before seeing the very same mooks ''completely ignoring'' the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own, and it's not like taking down such a small plane would require an anti-air missile in the first place. A RPG would've suffice.), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part or just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, before seeing the very same mooks ''completely ignoring'' the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own, and it's not like taking down such a small plane would require an anti-air missile in the first place. A RPG would've suffice.), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???that???
** one, it's kind of dark inside the cockpit, so maybe they didn't actually see him. Second, they are dealing with people who have bulletproof umbrellas, it's pretty easy to assume they also have RPG-proof planes. They deliberately went for the big guns and didn't waste time on the target they couldn't hurt.
** one, it's kind of dark inside the cockpit, so maybe they didn't actually see him. Second, they are dealing with people who have bulletproof umbrellas, it's pretty easy to assume they also have RPG-proof planes. They deliberately went for the big guns and didn't waste time on the target they couldn't hurt.
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Changed line(s) 19 (click to see context) from:
* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part or just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, before seeing the very same mooks ''completely ignoring'' the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own, and it's not like taking down such a small plane would require an anti-air missile in the first place), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part or just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, before seeing the very same mooks ''completely ignoring'' the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own, and it's not like taking down such a small plane would require an anti-air missile in the first place), place. A RPG would've suffice.), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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Changed line(s) 19 (click to see context) from:
* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part or just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, ''before'' seeing the very same mooks completely ignoring the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own, and it's not like taking down such a small plane would require an anti-air missile in the first place), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part or just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, ''before'' before seeing the very same mooks completely ignoring ''completely ignoring'' the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own, and it's not like taking down such a small plane would require an anti-air missile in the first place), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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Changed line(s) 19 (click to see context) from:
* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part on just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, ''before'' seeing the very same mooks completely ignoring the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part on or just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, ''before'' seeing the very same mooks completely ignoring the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own), own, and it's not like taking down such a small plane would require an anti-air missile in the first place), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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Changed line(s) 18 (click to see context) from:
** This is actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance when you think about how the test was presented to each candidate. Arthur took Eggsy into a sitting room, started a casual conversation with him, and built up a rapport with him, luring him into a false sense of security. He then presented the pistol, and casually ordered Eggsy to shoot the dog. In contrast, Roxy was called into the room with Merlin, and ordered to shoot her dog. Nothing else was shown to be exchanged between Merlin and Roxy. Arthur stacked the deck against Eggsy by making his test a more emotional scenario by playing against his love for animals.[[spoiler: However, this bit Arthur in the ass later when Eggsy plays against Arthur's more gentlemanly side by tricking him into looking away so Eggsy can switch the cups.]]
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** This is actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance when you think about how the test was presented to each candidate. Arthur took Eggsy into a sitting room, started a casual conversation with him, and built up a rapport with him, luring him into a false sense of security. He then presented the pistol, and casually ordered Eggsy to shoot the dog. In contrast, Roxy was called into the room with Merlin, and ordered to shoot her dog. Nothing else was shown to be exchanged between Merlin and Roxy. Arthur stacked the deck against Eggsy by making his test a more emotional scenario by playing against his love for animals.[[spoiler: However, this bit Arthur in the ass later when Eggsy plays against Arthur's more gentlemanly side by tricking him into looking away so Eggsy can switch the cups.]]]]
* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part on just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, ''before'' seeing the very same mooks completely ignoring the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
* Might be a minor BondVillainStupidity on Valentine's part on just the mooks' incompetence, but the scene in the climax where Eggsy went into the base again to stop Valentine, Merlin spotted a large group of mooks running toward the plane he is in, with an understandable OhCrap look on his face, ''before'' seeing the very same mooks completely ignoring the plane and instead run into the base to pursue Eggsy, leaving a smaller group of mooks operating an anti-air missile turret with ''super-slow'' set up time to deal with Merlin a while later. This leaves Merlin and Eggsy with enough time to figure out that they could override the chips in the mooks' heads and save the day in the end. If the large group of mooks cared to take down Merlin's plane first (Merlin's the only one in the plane, there's no way he could've taken down all mooks present on his own), it will leave Eggsy with no support and no way to hack through Valentine's system, completely erasing any chance of victory for the Kingsmen, so why the heck didn't the mooks do that???
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** Harry shuts the laptop, but doesn't shut it down when he leaves and tells Eggsy to stay put. All Eggsy had to do was raise the screen and not let it go to sleep to be able to follow what was happening.
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** If both passed, maybe a mission like the one we see at the beginning for the Lancelot slot would be in order.
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Changed line(s) 15 (click to see context) from:
* This is more of a 'what-if' than a question that requires an actual answer, but: what would have happened if both Roxy and Eggsy had passed the final test? Or if neither of them did? Would Arthur just have to pick one of the two candidates? If so, he'd definitely pick Roxy (seeing as he doesn't seem to care that much for Eggsy), and if that's the case, was failure the only option for Eggsy from the start? And what happens if neither of them can ShootTheDog? It seems like a lot of effort to go through the whole selection process again.
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* This is more of a 'what-if' than a question that requires an actual answer, but: what would have happened if both Roxy and Eggsy had passed the final test? Or if neither of them did? Would Arthur just have to pick one of the two candidates? If so, he'd definitely pick Roxy (seeing as he doesn't seem to care that much for Eggsy), and if that's the case, was failure the only option for Eggsy from the start? And what happens if neither of them can ShootTheDog? It seems like a lot of effort to go through the whole selection process again.again.
** This is actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance when you think about how the test was presented to each candidate. Arthur took Eggsy into a sitting room, started a casual conversation with him, and built up a rapport with him, luring him into a false sense of security. He then presented the pistol, and casually ordered Eggsy to shoot the dog. In contrast, Roxy was called into the room with Merlin, and ordered to shoot her dog. Nothing else was shown to be exchanged between Merlin and Roxy. Arthur stacked the deck against Eggsy by making his test a more emotional scenario by playing against his love for animals.[[spoiler: However, this bit Arthur in the ass later when Eggsy plays against Arthur's more gentlemanly side by tricking him into looking away so Eggsy can switch the cups.]]
** This is actually a bit of FridgeBrilliance when you think about how the test was presented to each candidate. Arthur took Eggsy into a sitting room, started a casual conversation with him, and built up a rapport with him, luring him into a false sense of security. He then presented the pistol, and casually ordered Eggsy to shoot the dog. In contrast, Roxy was called into the room with Merlin, and ordered to shoot her dog. Nothing else was shown to be exchanged between Merlin and Roxy. Arthur stacked the deck against Eggsy by making his test a more emotional scenario by playing against his love for animals.[[spoiler: However, this bit Arthur in the ass later when Eggsy plays against Arthur's more gentlemanly side by tricking him into looking away so Eggsy can switch the cups.]]
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** Another interpretation: Remember how, in previous tests, the Kingsmen almost went ''out of their way'' to prove their respect for life? Merlin personally demonstrates that Eggsy's parachute was functional all along, and Galahad lets Eggsy watch Charlie failing his test, ensuring that Eggsy knows that even failures with dangerous information and a proven willingness to blab about it get saved from death. Anyone as intelligent as the Kingsmen candidates are implied to have to be (Galahad specifically mentions Eggsy's high IQ) wouldn't have found it too difficult to work out how that one apparent drowning could have been faked, and the agency ''did'' place a lot of emphasis on the importance of teamwork and looking out for each other. Maybe the solution isn't to be willing to shoot the dog, per se. Maybe the solution is to figure out that the gun is probably loaded with blanks. In other words, the solution is to be ''willing to trust the agency'', without them needing to explain every little detail to you.
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Changed line(s) 13 (click to see context) from:
* How did Eggsy get into Harry's computer to see the stream of the church massacre? Is it a FridgeBrilliance throwback to earlier in the film, where Merlin and Arthur discuss how Harry's actual ''too'' secure, and how he needs to change that? If not, it seems odd that someone who was noted to be pretty good with their security doesn't put a password on their laptop, even if it's their home computer.
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* How did Eggsy get into Harry's computer to see the stream of the church massacre? Is it a FridgeBrilliance throwback to earlier in the film, where Merlin and Arthur discuss how Harry's actual ''too'' secure, and how he needs to change that? If not, it seems odd that someone who was noted to be pretty good with their security doesn't put a password on their laptop, even if it's their home computer.computer.
* This is more of a 'what-if' than a question that requires an actual answer, but: what would have happened if both Roxy and Eggsy had passed the final test? Or if neither of them did? Would Arthur just have to pick one of the two candidates? If so, he'd definitely pick Roxy (seeing as he doesn't seem to care that much for Eggsy), and if that's the case, was failure the only option for Eggsy from the start? And what happens if neither of them can ShootTheDog? It seems like a lot of effort to go through the whole selection process again.
* This is more of a 'what-if' than a question that requires an actual answer, but: what would have happened if both Roxy and Eggsy had passed the final test? Or if neither of them did? Would Arthur just have to pick one of the two candidates? If so, he'd definitely pick Roxy (seeing as he doesn't seem to care that much for Eggsy), and if that's the case, was failure the only option for Eggsy from the start? And what happens if neither of them can ShootTheDog? It seems like a lot of effort to go through the whole selection process again.
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Changed line(s) 12 (click to see context) from:
** Yes, that sequence of events makes much more sense. Arthur likely would have at least attempted to throw both Lancelot and Harry off Valentine's trail if he'd known about the plan before Valentine's fitting. Plus, either Merlin or Harry probably would have recognized the implant scar on Arthur's neck after they reviewed Harry's footage of Professor Arnold's death. Since they don't raise the alarm, it's probably safe to assume that Arthur only became TheMole when Valentine visited the Kingsman shop in person.
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** Yes, that sequence of events makes much more sense. Arthur likely would have at least attempted to throw both Lancelot and Harry off Valentine's trail if he'd known about the plan before Valentine's fitting. Plus, either Merlin or Harry probably would have recognized the implant scar on Arthur's neck after they reviewed Harry's footage of Professor Arnold's death. Since they don't raise the alarm, it's probably safe to assume that Arthur only became TheMole when Valentine visited the Kingsman shop in person. Otherwise, we'd also have to accept that either Arthur was wearing makeup over the scar for the entirety of the movie and sacrificed two of his agents for a wild goose chase, or at least two international super-spies (and one in training) somehow overlooked a detail that Eggsy noticed within seconds of meeting Arthur in the finale.
* How did Eggsy get into Harry's computer to see the stream of the church massacre? Is it a FridgeBrilliance throwback to earlier in the film, where Merlin and Arthur discuss how Harry's actual ''too'' secure, and how he needs to change that? If not, it seems odd that someone who was noted to be pretty good with their security doesn't put a password on their laptop, even if it's their home computer.
* How did Eggsy get into Harry's computer to see the stream of the church massacre? Is it a FridgeBrilliance throwback to earlier in the film, where Merlin and Arthur discuss how Harry's actual ''too'' secure, and how he needs to change that? If not, it seems odd that someone who was noted to be pretty good with their security doesn't put a password on their laptop, even if it's their home computer.
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Changed line(s) 11 (click to see context) from:
* When exactly did Arthur become TheMole for Valentine? The main page implies or states in one entry that he was this all along, but had this been the case, Valentine would have already known about the Kingsmen and a great deal of the plot (his fishing for intel, his nano-bugging of Harry) would be pointless. I get the impression that Valentine traced Harry after their dinner, went to Savile Row, met Arthur for the first time, and convinced him to join his cause; then got fitted for a suit. Does this seem like the right sequence?
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* When exactly did Arthur become TheMole for Valentine? The main page implies or states in one entry that he was this all along, but had this been the case, Valentine would have already known about the Kingsmen and a great deal of the plot (his fishing for intel, his nano-bugging of Harry) would be pointless. I get the impression that Valentine traced Harry after their dinner, went to Savile Row, met Arthur for the first time, and convinced him to join his cause; then got fitted for a suit. Does this seem like the right sequence?sequence?
** Yes, that sequence of events makes much more sense. Arthur likely would have at least attempted to throw both Lancelot and Harry off Valentine's trail if he'd known about the plan before Valentine's fitting. Plus, either Merlin or Harry probably would have recognized the implant scar on Arthur's neck after they reviewed Harry's footage of Professor Arnold's death. Since they don't raise the alarm, it's probably safe to assume that Arthur only became TheMole when Valentine visited the Kingsman shop in person.
** Yes, that sequence of events makes much more sense. Arthur likely would have at least attempted to throw both Lancelot and Harry off Valentine's trail if he'd known about the plan before Valentine's fitting. Plus, either Merlin or Harry probably would have recognized the implant scar on Arthur's neck after they reviewed Harry's footage of Professor Arnold's death. Since they don't raise the alarm, it's probably safe to assume that Arthur only became TheMole when Valentine visited the Kingsman shop in person.
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Added line(s) 9 (click to see context) :
*** Even were the gun loaded, there was a loophole that occurred to this troper while watching the film. "Shoot" the dog, the man said; not "KILL" the dog. Why not aim for a grazing wound to the rump that will heal in a week? So, do I pass the final test?
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** Arthur was most likely lying about alerting the world leaders. He was a member of the fold, and he knew that anyone he might want to go to with the information also already knew. He was trying to throw Eggsy off. Merlin said all the other agents COULD be compromised, not that they were for sure. And even if they were, Merlin and the others still have access to all the gadgets and money. There's also more to the Kingsmen than those handful of operatives. They have the people who build all the machines, and the IT department, the people who forge fake identities, the medical staff... There's more than enough pieces left over for them to put back together.
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** Arthur was most likely lying about alerting the world leaders. He was a member of the fold, and he knew that anyone he might want to go to with the information also already knew. He was trying to throw Eggsy off. Merlin said all the other agents COULD be compromised, not that they were for sure. And even if they were, Merlin and the others still have access to all the gadgets and money. There's also more to the Kingsmen than those handful of operatives. They have the people who build all the machines, and the IT department, the people who forge fake identities, the medical staff... There's more than enough pieces left over for them to put back together.together.
* When exactly did Arthur become TheMole for Valentine? The main page implies or states in one entry that he was this all along, but had this been the case, Valentine would have already known about the Kingsmen and a great deal of the plot (his fishing for intel, his nano-bugging of Harry) would be pointless. I get the impression that Valentine traced Harry after their dinner, went to Savile Row, met Arthur for the first time, and convinced him to join his cause; then got fitted for a suit. Does this seem like the right sequence?
* When exactly did Arthur become TheMole for Valentine? The main page implies or states in one entry that he was this all along, but had this been the case, Valentine would have already known about the Kingsmen and a great deal of the plot (his fishing for intel, his nano-bugging of Harry) would be pointless. I get the impression that Valentine traced Harry after their dinner, went to Savile Row, met Arthur for the first time, and convinced him to join his cause; then got fitted for a suit. Does this seem like the right sequence?
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Changed line(s) 8 (click to see context) from:
* Alright, so this films climax left me with a lot of questions. So right after Galahad is killed, Arthur tells Eggsy to relax, because they recorded Valentine's confession and were going to turn it over to the world leaders. I knew right there with that line that something was really wrong. First, there was the line from Galahad at the beginning about how the Kingsmen were created as an independent espionage agency that was above the politics of government. Second, they just spent a good part of the film establishing that Valentine was going to pretty much all of the world leaders and persuading them to go along with his plan, or holding them hostage until they would agree to it. So the world leaders that are still walking free already know the evil plan. What good is it going to do informing them of something that they already know, and agreed to be a part of? Worst of all, the Kingsmen all know this too. So what were the other ten agents doing during Eggsy's big climactic showdown in the mountain lair? Unless they were all, like Merlin suggested, on Arthur's side, in which case they are finished as an organization. Or at the very least, Eggsy, Roxy, and Merlin are no longer a part of it. So who is paying for that nice house at the end? I'm so confused right now.
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* Alright, so this films climax left me with a lot of questions. So right after Galahad is killed, Arthur tells Eggsy to relax, because they recorded Valentine's confession and were going to turn it over to the world leaders. I knew right there with that line that something was really wrong. First, there was the line from Galahad at the beginning about how the Kingsmen were created as an independent espionage agency that was above the politics of government. Second, they just spent a good part of the film establishing that Valentine was going to pretty much all of the world leaders and persuading them to go along with his plan, or holding them hostage until they would agree to it. So the world leaders that are still walking free already know the evil plan. What good is it going to do informing them of something that they already know, and agreed to be a part of? Worst of all, the Kingsmen all know this too. So what were the other ten agents doing during Eggsy's big climactic showdown in the mountain lair? Unless they were all, like Merlin suggested, on Arthur's side, in which case they are finished as an organization. Or at the very least, Eggsy, Roxy, and Merlin are no longer a part of it. So who is paying for that nice house at the end? I'm so confused right now.now.
**Arthur was most likely lying about alerting the world leaders. He was a member of the fold, and he knew that anyone he might want to go to with the information also already knew. He was trying to throw Eggsy off. Merlin said all the other agents COULD be compromised, not that they were for sure. And even if they were, Merlin and the others still have access to all the gadgets and money. There's also more to the Kingsmen than those handful of operatives. They have the people who build all the machines, and the IT department, the people who forge fake identities, the medical staff... There's more than enough pieces left over for them to put back together.
**Arthur was most likely lying about alerting the world leaders. He was a member of the fold, and he knew that anyone he might want to go to with the information also already knew. He was trying to throw Eggsy off. Merlin said all the other agents COULD be compromised, not that they were for sure. And even if they were, Merlin and the others still have access to all the gadgets and money. There's also more to the Kingsmen than those handful of operatives. They have the people who build all the machines, and the IT department, the people who forge fake identities, the medical staff... There's more than enough pieces left over for them to put back together.
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Changed line(s) 7 (click to see context) from:
** Well, he is a MisanthropeSupreme.
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** Well, he is a MisanthropeSupreme.MisanthropeSupreme.
* Alright, so this films climax left me with a lot of questions. So right after Galahad is killed, Arthur tells Eggsy to relax, because they recorded Valentine's confession and were going to turn it over to the world leaders. I knew right there with that line that something was really wrong. First, there was the line from Galahad at the beginning about how the Kingsmen were created as an independent espionage agency that was above the politics of government. Second, they just spent a good part of the film establishing that Valentine was going to pretty much all of the world leaders and persuading them to go along with his plan, or holding them hostage until they would agree to it. So the world leaders that are still walking free already know the evil plan. What good is it going to do informing them of something that they already know, and agreed to be a part of? Worst of all, the Kingsmen all know this too. So what were the other ten agents doing during Eggsy's big climactic showdown in the mountain lair? Unless they were all, like Merlin suggested, on Arthur's side, in which case they are finished as an organization. Or at the very least, Eggsy, Roxy, and Merlin are no longer a part of it. So who is paying for that nice house at the end? I'm so confused right now.
* Alright, so this films climax left me with a lot of questions. So right after Galahad is killed, Arthur tells Eggsy to relax, because they recorded Valentine's confession and were going to turn it over to the world leaders. I knew right there with that line that something was really wrong. First, there was the line from Galahad at the beginning about how the Kingsmen were created as an independent espionage agency that was above the politics of government. Second, they just spent a good part of the film establishing that Valentine was going to pretty much all of the world leaders and persuading them to go along with his plan, or holding them hostage until they would agree to it. So the world leaders that are still walking free already know the evil plan. What good is it going to do informing them of something that they already know, and agreed to be a part of? Worst of all, the Kingsmen all know this too. So what were the other ten agents doing during Eggsy's big climactic showdown in the mountain lair? Unless they were all, like Merlin suggested, on Arthur's side, in which case they are finished as an organization. Or at the very least, Eggsy, Roxy, and Merlin are no longer a part of it. So who is paying for that nice house at the end? I'm so confused right now.
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Changed line(s) 5 (click to see context) from:
**** While the Kingsmen do consider themselves good guys, they are still as spy organization, and sometimes GoodIsNotNice. Killing the dog is a test to show their loyalty to the organization, similar to how the previous test was to see whether they would rat out the organization.
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**** While the Kingsmen do consider themselves good guys, they are still as spy organization, and sometimes GoodIsNotNice. Killing the dog is a test to show their loyalty to the organization, similar to how the previous test was to see whether they would rat out the organization.organization.
*Did Valentine ever hear of the theory of the whole Ice Age cycle thing? I mean, my highschool said that global warming is the first stage in a new Ice Age, by causing enough evaporation to make clouds that block out the sun, which in turn, cools down the planet. The only problem with global warming is that it's going too fast.
** Well, he is a MisanthropeSupreme.
*Did Valentine ever hear of the theory of the whole Ice Age cycle thing? I mean, my highschool said that global warming is the first stage in a new Ice Age, by causing enough evaporation to make clouds that block out the sun, which in turn, cools down the planet. The only problem with global warming is that it's going too fast.
** Well, he is a MisanthropeSupreme.
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Changed line(s) 5 (click to see context) from:
**** While the Kingsmen do consider themselves good guys, they are still as spy organization, and sometimes GoodIsNotNice. Killing the dog is a test to show their loyalty to the organization, similar to how the previous test was to see whether they would rate out the organization.
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**** While the Kingsmen do consider themselves good guys, they are still as spy organization, and sometimes GoodIsNotNice. Killing the dog is a test to show their loyalty to the organization, similar to how the previous test was to see whether they would rate rat out the organization.
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Changed line(s) 4 (click to see context) from:
**** Also, I think Arthur deliberately set the scene it so that Eggsy would be more likely to fail. The setup between his and Roxy's scenarios seemed to be very different in tone and setting.
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**** Also, I think Arthur deliberately set the scene it so that Eggsy would be more likely to fail. The setup between his and Roxy's scenarios seemed to be very different in tone and setting.setting.
**** While the Kingsmen do consider themselves good guys, they are still as spy organization, and sometimes GoodIsNotNice. Killing the dog is a test to show their loyalty to the organization, similar to how the previous test was to see whether they would rate out the organization.
**** While the Kingsmen do consider themselves good guys, they are still as spy organization, and sometimes GoodIsNotNice. Killing the dog is a test to show their loyalty to the organization, similar to how the previous test was to see whether they would rate out the organization.
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Changed line(s) 3 (click to see context) from:
*** Is just seems odd that an organization like the Kingsmen, who clearly see themselves as the good guys and as gentlemen, would have a final test that is borrowed from the Nazi and boils down to “Am I willing to do something horrid simply because I am ordered to?”.
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*** Is just seems odd that an organization like the Kingsmen, who clearly see themselves as the good guys and as gentlemen, would have a final test that is borrowed from the Nazi and boils down to “Am I willing to do something horrid simply because I am ordered to?”.to?”.
**** Also, I think Arthur deliberately set the scene it so that Eggsy would be more likely to fail. The setup between his and Roxy's scenarios seemed to be very different in tone and setting.
**** Also, I think Arthur deliberately set the scene it so that Eggsy would be more likely to fail. The setup between his and Roxy's scenarios seemed to be very different in tone and setting.
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Changed line(s) 2 (click to see context) from:
** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the former, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special force for that matter. TruthInTelevision.). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the former, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special force for that matter. TruthInTelevision.). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.cost.
***Is just seems odd that an organization like the Kingsmen, who clearly see themselves as the good guys and as gentlemen, would have a final test that is borrowed from the Nazi and boils down to “Am I willing to do something horrid simply because I am ordered to?”.
***Is just seems odd that an organization like the Kingsmen, who clearly see themselves as the good guys and as gentlemen, would have a final test that is borrowed from the Nazi and boils down to “Am I willing to do something horrid simply because I am ordered to?”.
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Changed line(s) 2 (click to see context) from:
** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces for that matter. TruthInTelevision.). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, former, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces force for that matter. TruthInTelevision.). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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Changed line(s) 2 (click to see context) from:
** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces for that matter. [[TruthInTelevision]]). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces for that matter. [[TruthInTelevision]]).TruthInTelevision.). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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Changed line(s) 2 (click to see context) from:
** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces for that matter). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces for that matter).matter. [[TruthInTelevision]]). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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Changed line(s) 1 (click to see context) from:
* Why is not shooting the dog considered disappointing? I mean, the dog was essentially raised as your comrade and companion. Isn't not shooting the dog evidence you won't betray your comrades?
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* Why is not shooting the dog considered disappointing? I mean, the dog was essentially raised as your comrade and companion. Isn't not shooting the dog evidence you won't betray your comrades?comrades?
** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces for that matter). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
** It's a test of showing how far are you willing to go to complete the mission given to you. In this case, the 'mission' is to shoot your dog, a loving companion that's been at your side for a very long time. In the field, there will be a time when one must decide whether to complete the objective or saving your friend. Since obviously the only real choice would be the latter, one needs to have a hardened mind to make such decision in a short notice as expected from a Kingsman (or any special forces for that matter). To put it simply, it's not a matter of betraying your friend, it's about completing your mission no matter the cost, even if your best friends are among those very cost.
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Changed line(s) 1 (click to see context) from:
* Why is not ShootingTheDog considered disappointing? I mean, the dog was essentially raised as your comrade and companion. Isn't not shooting the dog evidence you won't betray your comrades?
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* Why is not ShootingTheDog shooting the dog considered disappointing? I mean, the dog was essentially raised as your comrade and companion. Isn't not shooting the dog evidence you won't betray your comrades?
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* Why is not ShootingTheDog considered disappointing? I mean, the dog was essentially raised as your comrade and companion. Isn't not shooting the dog evidence you won't betray your comrades?
