History Headscratchers / Frankenstein

15th Apr '18 10:48:21 AM Mareon
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* Okay, Real Talk!: Is Victor a VillainProtagonist, or is that 200 years of ValuesDissonamce talking?

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* Okay, Real Talk!: Is Victor a VillainProtagonist, or is that 200 years of ValuesDissonamce ValuesDissonance talking?
15th Apr '18 10:47:58 AM Mareon
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* Okay, Real Talk!: Is Victor a VillainProtagonist, or is that 200 years of ValuesDissonamce talking?
11th Apr '18 5:32:45 AM Mareon
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**** By the magic of the Kindle, here is all three mentions of "Adam" in the 1818 edition
*****[chapter Two; Creature to Victor] "Oh, Frankenstein, be not equitable to every other, and trample upon me alone, to whom thy justice, and even thy clemency and affection, is most due. Remember, that I am thy creature: I ought to be thy Adam; but I am rather the fallen Angel, whom thou drivest from joy for no misdeed. \\
[Chapter Seven; The Creature describes reading ''Paradise Lost'' and equating it to his own situation] "It moved every feelin of wonder and awe, that the picture of an omnipotent God warring with his creatures was capable of exciting. I often referred the several situations, as their similarity struck me, to my own. Like Adam, I was created apperantly united by no link yo any other being in existence; but his state was far different from mine in every other respect. \\
[Later same chapter] "But it was all a dream: no Eve soothed my sorrows, or shared my thoughts; I was alone. I remembered Adam's supplication to his Creator; but where was mine? he had abandoned me, and, in the bitterness of my heart, I cursed him.
8th Mar '18 11:12:33 AM fighwitt
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** Well, all they had to go by in those days was observation and the means, motive, and opportunity. What would possess a servant woman to throttle the son of her master (I'm assuming she was a servant)? Means: Hire a big guy to do the deed so she can stay 'clean'. Motive: Revenge? Jealous love (the kid should've been hers, but wasn't. Crazy, I know.)? Maybe the kid was hers and she thought him a mistake? Maybe she just got fed up with the brat and decided to snuff him out? Opportunity: They were out on a trip together, and the boy managed to get himself seperated from the family. Of course, we ''know'' what really happened. I'm just considering what the police may have thought and discovering that photo in the woman's possession may have had confirmed it all for them. They got the woman who concoted the murder, but not the man who actually killed the boy.

to:

** Well, all they had to go by in those days was observation and the means, motive, and opportunity. What would possess a servant woman to throttle the son of her master (I'm assuming she was a servant)? Means: Hire a big guy to do the deed so she can stay 'clean'. Motive: Revenge? Jealous love (the kid should've been hers, but wasn't. Crazy, I know.)? Maybe the kid was hers and she thought him a mistake? Maybe she just got fed up with the brat and decided to snuff him out? Opportunity: They were out on a trip together, and the boy managed to get himself seperated from the family. Of course, we ''know'' what really happened. I'm just considering what the police may have thought and discovering that photo in the woman's possession may have had confirmed it all for them. They got the woman who concoted concocted the murder, but not the man who actually killed the boy.
24th Jan '18 7:18:44 PM costanton11
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** Also in [[Film/MaryShelleysFrankenstein Branagh's version]], where the monster is built from the base of recently-executed RobertDeNiro and given the dead brain of Creator/JohnCleese. What a weird movie.

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** Also in [[Film/MaryShelleysFrankenstein Branagh's version]], where the monster is built from the base of recently-executed RobertDeNiro Creator/RobertDeNiro and given the dead brain of Creator/JohnCleese. What a weird movie.
27th Dec '17 8:50:51 PM DoctorNemesis
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*** And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't be corrected if necessary (although to be frank, we can perhaps dial down the confrontational attitude a little; I mean, 'appeased'? We're talking about people misreading or reinterpreting a novel, not the invasion of the Rhineland, [[MST3KMantra we can relax a little about it]]), just offering reasons for why people might choose that interpretation or make that mistake. As for why people don't call him Lucifer, maybe they appreciate the irony of calling him Adam instead, or maybe they sympathise with him too much to basically call him the Devil, or maybe some people just prefer calling him Adam.

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*** And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't be corrected if necessary (although to be frank, we can perhaps dial down the confrontational attitude a little; I mean, 'appeased'? We're talking about people misreading or reinterpreting a novel, not the invasion of the Rhineland, [[MST3KMantra we can relax a little about it]]), just offering reasons for why people might choose that interpretation or make that mistake. As for why people don't call him Lucifer, maybe they appreciate the irony of calling him Adam instead, or maybe they sympathise with him too much to basically call him the Devil, or maybe some people just prefer calling him Adam. Furthermore, while the Creature identifies with Milton's Devil, there's still the whole "creator vs. creation" thing which may cause some people to view Adam as more appropriate regardless.
27th Dec '17 8:22:10 PM DoctorNemesis
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*** And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't be corrected if necessary (although to be frank, we can perhaps dial down the confrontational attitude a little; [[MST3KMantra it's just a novel, we can relax]]), just offering reasons for why people might choose that interpretation or make that mistake. As for why people don't call him Lucifer, maybe they appreciate the irony of calling him Adam instead, or maybe they sympathise with him too much to basically call him the Devil, or maybe some people just prefer calling him Adam.

to:

*** And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't be corrected if necessary (although to be frank, we can perhaps dial down the confrontational attitude a little; I mean, 'appeased'? We're talking about people misreading or reinterpreting a novel, not the invasion of the Rhineland, [[MST3KMantra it's just a novel, we can relax]]), relax a little about it]]), just offering reasons for why people might choose that interpretation or make that mistake. As for why people don't call him Lucifer, maybe they appreciate the irony of calling him Adam instead, or maybe they sympathise with him too much to basically call him the Devil, or maybe some people just prefer calling him Adam.
27th Dec '17 8:00:37 PM DoctorNemesis
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*** And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't be corrected if necessary (although to be frank, we can probably dial down the confrontational attitude a little; [[MST3KMantra it's just a novel, we can relax]]), just offering reasons for why people might choose that interpretation or make that mistake. As for why people don't call him Lucifer, maybe they appreciate the irony of calling him Adam instead, or maybe they sympathise with him too much to basically call him the Devil, or maybe some people just prefer calling him Adam.

to:

*** And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't be corrected if necessary (although to be frank, we can probably perhaps dial down the confrontational attitude a little; [[MST3KMantra it's just a novel, we can relax]]), just offering reasons for why people might choose that interpretation or make that mistake. As for why people don't call him Lucifer, maybe they appreciate the irony of calling him Adam instead, or maybe they sympathise with him too much to basically call him the Devil, or maybe some people just prefer calling him Adam.
27th Dec '17 7:59:05 PM DoctorNemesis
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*** And again, I'm not saying they shouldn't be corrected if necessary (although to be frank, we can probably dial down the confrontational attitude a little; [[MST3KMantra it's just a novel, we can relax]]), just offering reasons for why people might choose that interpretation or make that mistake. As for why people don't call him Lucifer, maybe they appreciate the irony of calling him Adam instead, or maybe they sympathise with him too much to basically call him the Devil, or maybe some people just prefer calling him Adam.
22nd Dec '17 5:39:04 PM NewVirginiaCreeper
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*** And yet I don't hear anyone making the case that we should call him "Lucifer" even though he specifically identifies more strongly with Milton's Devil. I don't see any reason why people saying completely wrong things like "I insist on using the name since the Creature adopted it" should be appeased... they should be corrected.
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