History Fridge / InglouriousBasterds

* While Goebbels is pretty clearly an EvilMentor to Zoller, does anyone else notice that apparent DoggedNiceGuy Zoller seems to be taking after him? His ego is constantly swelling due to everyone's admiration, to the point that he clearly oversteps his boundaries with Goebbels (who laughs it off) and Landa (who doesn't), which is pretty telling for a mere private. Also, his outburst at Shoshanna shows a massive sense of entitlement, and his sudden return to nice guy once he gets what he wants seems to mirror Goebbels' childish mood swings.

• Unless you consider Hugo Stiglitz as "the helper". He's the only non-Jewish member of the Basterds.

** If anything, the practice at least leaves MENTAL scars. [[CaptainObvious Seeing all your comrades get slaughtered by eight members of the so-called inferior, getting cut in a grotesque and painful way, and only being left alive so you can tell your horrible tale must be horrific.]]

* While Goebbels is pretty clearly an EvilMentor to Zoller, does anyone else notice that apparent DoggedNiceGuy Zoller seems to be taking after him? His ego is constantly swelling due to everyone's admiration, to the point that he clearly oversteps his boundaries with Goebbels (who laughs it off) and Landa (who doesn't), which is pretty telling for a mere private. Also, his outburst at Shoshanna shows a massive sense of entitlement, and his sudden return to nice guy once he gets what he wants seems to mirror Goebbels' childish mood swings.
* The way this troper interpreted the film is that it's something of a meditation on the cinema itself. When Shoshanna says "This is the face of Jewish vengeance", she is referencing Hicox's conversation with Churchill on how Goebbels was trying to "take on the Jews at their own game": the cinema. Hicox says Goebbels was doing quite well, but ultimately it's a game which Goebbels loses, not only because he is killed by Jews in a cinema (with one of them taking over his own film to deliver their death sentence), but for all his Nazi-glorifying propaganda, ThoseWackyNazis have only occupied villain slots since the end of WW2, ranging from the IneffectualSympatheticVillain to the CompleteMonster. Ironically, ''Film/InglouriousBasterds'' is one of the comparatively few films that does feature sympathetic Nazis and unsympathetic Allies. There are other references to the cinema as a medium throughout the film; when Landa's convoy arrives in the very first scene they are revealed by an image of drawing aside a curtain, when Shoshanna runs she is framed through the door as if she's on a screen, plus the multiple in-universe references to films, directors and actors by various characters. Anyone agree, or am I reading too much into it?
** This is Tarantino we're talking about. I think you've got it exactly right.

* FridgeHorror: Watch Monseiur [=LaPedite=] break down and cry as Colonel Landa tortures him slowly, using multiple languages to confuse him, leaving his family with armed thugs, abusing his hospitality, constantly leaving him on the edge with unexpected behaviour... [[TearJerker he is probably the most heroic man in the entire film]] for harbouring his neighbours, for he had a choice not to protect them but did so at great personal risk- in the end, even he broke. [[HumansAreBastards What does that say about the rest of us?]]
** I agree. The only thing that might make [=LaPedite=]'s suffering slightly less was Landa proving that he was not exaggerating his skill at finding Jews. I half expected him to have been bluffing (albeit doing so ''very'' convincingly), but at least by guessing immediately that they were under the floorboards, [=LaPedite=] can know that Landa really would have found them even if he hadn't broken, and thus he didn't betray his friends for no reason.

* FridgeLogic: Carving a swastika into a forehead isn't actually all ''that'' horrific, in the long run - even 1944 reconstructive surgery was capable of fixing that, at worst to 'not quite as noticeable' levels, but often to 'surgery can be noticed, what was before can not' levels.
** Even 21st century technqiues aren't seamless when it comes to deep scars.
** I'm not sure it's really FridgeLogic as Raine is not a surgeon nor does he have a medical background so he had no way to know that so as far as he knows it is permanent.
** Watch the scene again when Raine does it to Landa. The ''experience'' is horrific, even if you don't think the scars are. Even if the scar disappeared the next day, Landa would still have nightmares about it for the rest of his life.
** Assuming he survived- that carving seemed to be pretty damn deep.

* Upon watching ''Film/InglouriousBasterds'', I was confused at how the Basterds seemed to be the background plot and the story seemed to be set in an alternate timeline, which is uncommon for war movies. But given the repeated theme of exaggerated war stories ("The Jew Hunter", "The Bear Jew," the German sniper), this would be entirely natural if Landa himself was telling and embellishing his own story, probably leading up to the question "How did you get that scar?" (which is why the movie ends on it). Note that Landa outsmarts nearly every character in the movie, fluently speaks at least 4 languages, catches the uncatchable Basterds without breaking a sweat, instantly recognizes Shoshanna despite only seeing her back four years prior as she was fleeing, pieces together Hammersmark's plan in about 30 seconds from investigating the bar, ensures that Hitler and the German commanders will die (thus making a HeelFaceTurn), and negotiates himself a Congressional Medal of Honor. This would also explain why the Basterds are constantly shown as boorish brutes compared to the Germans' supposed refinement and class, and why we never learn the fate of 4 of the Basterds, because Landa himself didn't know it. But the one thing he can't spin in his favor is that scar, carved right into his forehead. -Mens Rea.
** If Landa is the narrator of the movie, then he must be narrating it to a Nazi. The movie makes it clear that he didn't actually betray the Germans until the day of the bombing, or maybe until the day he had strudel with Shoshanna at the earliest, and even then it he didn't go through with it until and unless he was promised rewards. Implausibly clever or not, Landa was a Nazi until the end, so he's a MagnificentBastard, but definitely not an AntiVillain or AntiHero, which is what you'd expect if he was revising the story to make himself look better.
*** I wouldn't say he's trying to make himself look more heroic, only more cunning. He's certainly not apologetic about his choices.
** Perhaps a bit too obvious, but I've always felt uncomfortable rooting for the Basterds because they were so brutal. The Bear Jew is one of the most celebrated characters in the movie because he kills a prisoner for not giving up his comrades' position, something that, if he wasn't a Nazi, would be considered honorable. This seems particularly nasty, but everyone loved it. Then I realized we were simultaneously supposed to enjoy it and dislike ourselves for enjoying it. Remember where Hitler was and what he was doing in his last scene? That's right: [[spoiler: in a movie theater, reveling in the death of hundreds of men because they weren't on his side.]]
*** Oh. Oh GOD you're right!
** Rewatching the movie at home made me realise the main reason I love the works of Tarantino (and possibly why he is so popular) - he makes his movies to be watched and enjoyed multiple times. The first time you watch the first scene, you're watching a funny little scene where a Nazi is having an interesting chat with a French farmer. You watch it again, and you're watching [[spoiler: a Nazi smugly stretch out the suffering of a noble man trying to help his Jewish friends.]] (Compare this with the second scene from ''Film/ReservoirDogs'', which changes from 'Criminal begs his friend for his life, promising not to rat him out to the cops to [[spoiler: cop trying desperately to manipulate the guy he's trying to take down]]). - Tropers/{{Randomfanboy}}
*** At first viewing, Landa seems to offer a pretty lame excuse to switch to English when talking with [=LaPedite=], that he has "exhausted his knowledge of French." It is quite obvious that he is fluent in the French language, and this seemed like a cop out to switch the conversation to English for the benefit of the English speaking audience. Later in the conversation [[spoiler: he mentions that his assumption that the hiding family does not speak English is correct. He switched to English right when the conversation went from pleasant and mundane to an intimidating interrogation. Brilliant!]]
**** That is brilliant, but Tarantino probably also used English just as much for the mundane reason: to make the dialogue-heavy scene friendlier to English speakers. Tarantino likes to play around with movie conventions, and having a character explicitly say he wants to speak English is a very Tarantino move. He has more fun with subtitles later: A German says "Wonderbar," and sure enough, the subtitle says "Wonderbar!"

** Another one, with an extra dose of WhatDoYouMeanItsNotSymbolic: The Basterds originally start out as eight Jewish soldiers, with a ninth commanding officer. Now what does that [[http://www.worldofjudaica.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Menorah.jpg remind you of?]]

''SPOILER WARNING''

* The way this troper interpreted the film is that it's something of a meditation on the cinema itself. When Shoshanna says "This is the face of Jewish vengeance", she is referencing Hicox's conversation with Churchill on how Goebbels was trying to "take on the Jews at their own game": the cinema. Hicox says Goebbels was doing quite well, but ultimately it's a game which Goebbels loses, not only because he is killed by Jews in a cinema (with one of them taking over his own film to deliver their death sentence), but for all his Nazi-glorifying propaganda, ThoseWackyNazis have only occupied villain slots since the end of WW2, ranging from the IneffectualSympatheticVillain to the CompleteMonster. Ironically, ''Film/InglouriousBasterds'' is one of the comparatively few films that does feature sympathetic Nazis and unsympathetic Allies. There are other references to the cinema as a medium throughout the film; when Landa's convoy arrives in the very first scene they are revealed by an image of drawing aside a curtain, when Shoshanna runs she is framed through the door as if she's on a screen, plus the multiple in-universe references to films, directors and actors by various characters. Anyone agree, or am I reading too much into it?

* The way this troper interpreted the film is that it's something of a meditation on the cinema itself. When Shoshanna says "This is the face of Jewish vengeance", she is referencing Hicox's conversation with Churchill on how Goebbels was trying to "take on the Jews at their own game": the cinema. Hicox says Goebbels was doing quite well, but ultimately it's a game which Goebbels loses, not only because he is killed by Jews in a cinema (with one of them taking over his own film to deliver their death sentence), but for all his Nazi-glorifying propaganda, ThoseWackyNazis have only occupied villain slots since the end of WW2, ranging from the IneffectualSympatheticVillain to the CompleteMonster. Ironically, InglouriousBasterds is one of the comparatively few films that does feature sympathetic Nazis and unsympathetic Allies. There are other references to the cinema as a medium throughout the film; when Landa's convoy arrives in the very first scene they are revealed by an image of drawing aside a curtain, when Shoshanna runs she is framed through the door as if she's on a screen, plus the multiple in-universe references to films, directors and actors by various characters. Anyone agree, or am I reading too much into it?

*** At first viewing, Landa seems to offer a pretty lame excuse to switch to English when talking with Lapedite, that he has "exhausted his knowledge of French." It is quite obvious that he is fluent in the French language, and this seemed like a cop out to switch the conversation to English for the benefit of the English speaking audience. Later in the conversation [[spoiler: he mentions that his assumption that the hiding family does not speak English is correct. He switched to English right when the conversation went from pleasant and mundane to an intimidating interrogation. Brilliant!]]

* FridgeHorror: Watch Monseiur LaPedite break down and cry as Colonel Landa tortures him slowly, using multiple languages to confuse him, leaving his family with armed thugs, abusing his hospitality, constantly leaving him on the edge with unexpected behaviour... [[TearJerker he is probably the most heroic man in the entire film]] for harbouring his neighbours, for he had a choice not to protect them but did so at great personal risk- in the end, even he broke. [[HumansAreBastards What does that say about the rest of us?]]
** I agree. The only thing that might make LaPedite's suffering slightly less was Landa proving that he was not exaggerating his skill at finding Jews. I half expected him to have been bluffing (albeit doing so ''very'' convincingly), but at least by guessing immediately that they were under the floorboards, LaPedite can know that Landa really would have found them even if he hadn't broken, and thus he didn't betray his friends for no reason.

** Rewatching the movie at home made me realise the main reason I love the works of Tarantino (and possibly why he is so popular) - he makes his movies to be watched and enjoyed multiple times. The first time you watch the first scene, you're watching a funny little scene where a Nazi is having an interesting chat with a French farmer. You watch it again, and you're watching [[spoiler: a Nazi smugly stretch out the suffering of a noble man trying to help his Jewish friends.]] (Compare this with the second scene from ''ReservoirDogs'', which changes from 'Criminal begs his friend for his life, promising not to rat him out to the cops to [[spoiler: cop trying desperately to manipulate the guy he's trying to take down]]). - Tropers/{{Randomfanboy}}

SPOILER WARNING

* Upon watching ''InglouriousBasterds'', I was confused at how the Basterds seemed to be the background plot and the story seemed to be set in an alternate timeline, which is uncommon for war movies. But given the repeated theme of exaggerated war stories ("The Jew Hunter", "The Bear Jew," the German sniper), this would be entirely natural if Landa himself was telling and embellishing his own story, probably leading up to the question "How did you get that scar?" (which is why the movie ends on it). Note that Landa outsmarts nearly every character in the movie, fluently speaks at least 4 languages, catches the uncatchable Basterds without breaking a sweat, instantly recognizes Shoshanna despite only seeing her back four years prior as she was fleeing, pieces together Hammersmark's plan in about 30 seconds from investigating the bar, ensures that Hitler and the German commanders will die (thus making a HeelFaceTurn), and negotiates himself a Congressional Medal of Honor. This would also explain why the Basterds are constantly shown as boorish brutes compared to the Germans' supposed refinement and class, and why we never learn the fate of 4 of the Basterds, because Landa himself didn't know it. But the one thing he can't spin in his favor is that scar, carved right into his forehead. -Mens Rea.

* FridgeHorror: Watch Monseiur LaPedite break down and cry as Colonel Landa tortures him slowly, using multiple languages to confuse him, leaving his family with armed thugs, abusing his hospitality, constantly leaving him on the edge with unexpected behaviour... [[TearJerker he is probably the most heroic man in the entire film]] for harbouring his neighbours, for he had a choice not to protect them but did so at great personal risk- in the end, even he broke. [[HumansAreBastards What does that say about the rest of us?]]

* Upon watching ''InglouriousBasterds'', I was confused at how the Basterds seemed to be the background plot and the story seemed to be set in an alternate timeline, which is uncommon for war movies. But given the repeated theme of exaggerated war stories ("The Jew Hunter", "The Bear Jew," the German sniper), this would be entirely natural if Landa himself was telling and embellishing his own story, probably leading up to the question "How did you get that scar?" (which is why the movie ends on it). Note that Landa outsmarts nearly every character in the movie, fluently speaks at least 4 languages, catches the uncatchable Basterds without breaking a sweat, instantly recognizes Shoshanna despite only seeing her backside four years prior as she was fleeing, pieces together Hammersmark's plan in about 30 seconds from investigating the bar, ensures that Hitler and the German commanders will die (thus making a HeelFaceTurn), and negotiates himself a Congressional Medal of Honor. This would also explain why the Basterds are constantly shown as boorish brutes compared to the Germans' supposed refinement and class, and why we never learn the fate of 4 of the Basterds, because Landa himself didn't know it. But the one thing he can't spin in his favor is that scar, carved right into his forehead. -Mens Rea.

* FridgeHorror: Watch Monseiur LaPedite break down and cry as Colonel Landa tortures him slowly, using multiple languages to confuse him, leaving his family with armed thugs, abusing his hospitality, constantly leaving him on the edge with unexpected behaviour... [[TearJerker he is probably the most heroic man in the entire film]] for harbouring his neighbours, for he had a choice not to protect them but did so at great personal risk- [[HumansAreBastards what does that say about the rest of us?]]

** Assuming he survived- that carving seemed to be pretty damn deep.

** Watch the scene again when Raine does it to Landa. The ''experience'' is horrific, even if you don't think the scars are. Even if the scar disappeared the next day, Landa would still have nightmares about it for the rest of his life.

** I'm not sure it's really FridgeLogic as Raine is not a surgeon nor does he have a medical background so he had no way to know that so as far as he knows it is permanent.

* FridgeLogic: Carving a swastika into a forehead isn't actually all ''that'' horrific, in the long run - even 1944 reconstructive surgery was capable of fixing that, at worst to 'not quite as noticeable' levels, but often to 'surgery can be noticed, what was before can not' levels.

** Another one, with an extra dose of WhatDoYouMeanItsNotSymbolic: The Basterds originally start out as eight Jewish soldiers, with a ninth commanding officer. Now what does that [[http://www.worldofjudaica.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Menorah.jpg remind you of?]]

** Another one, with an extra dose of WhatDoYouMeanItsNotSymbolic: The Basterds originally start out as eight Jewish soldiers, with a ninth commanding officer. Now what does that [[http://www.worldofjudaica.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Menorah.jpg remind you of?]]
* FridgeLogic: Okay, so [[spoiler: Lt. Raine carves a swastika into Landa's forehead, and talks about how it's going to stay with him for the rest of his life.]] The problem with this? Plastic surgery for disfiguring facial scars was already pretty well-developed (having come to prominence after the first World War), and [[spoiler: Landa]] could easily have the scar removed -- it wouldn't take much to lie to a doctor when you received the wound overseas, during wartime, in a secluded area. Or, you know, he could wear a hat. Or burn it off, which wouldn't be that hard, either. Basically, [[spoiler: Aldo's "masterpiece"]] wouldn't last very long.