History Fridge / BioShockInfinite

5th Aug '17 5:34:38 AM TheWildWestPyro
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* Early in the game when going through the Hall of Heroes Elizabeth remarks that she has read about how Comstock fought at Wounded Knee. To which Slate angrily shouts "COMSTOCK WASN'T THERE!" It's more complicated than that, though: After the battle of Wounded Knee, [[spoiler:Booker turned to baptism to assuage himself of his guilt and PTSD, but whether he goes through with it or not is what creates Comstock. However, it is telling that if he does get baptized and is born anew without sin]], he goes on to create the Hall of Heroes which feature him as the glorified hero of those battles. And yet Booker, who [[spoiler:refused baptism and wasn't absolved of his guilt]], instead insists he's no hero for his deeds and doesn't even want to ''talk'' about his involvement in the Boxer Rebellion or Wounded Knee. Once again, however, Comstock did the exact ''opposite'' of repenting. By attempting to take credit for Wounded Knee and repeating his actions at Peking, he's shown he's utterly ''unrepentant'' for his actions. He's actively trying to turn his vices into virtues. [[spoiler: Booker, who genuinely repents of his deeds at Wounded Knee but can't see baptism washing away the sin, later drowns and is reborn in new life]].

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* Early in the game when going through the Hall of Heroes Heroes, Elizabeth remarks that she has read about how Comstock fought at Wounded Knee. To the Boxer Rebellion, to which Slate angrily shouts "COMSTOCK WASN'T THERE!" It's more complicated than that, though: After the battle of Wounded Knee, [[spoiler:Booker turned to baptism to assuage himself of his guilt and PTSD, but whether he goes through with it or not is what creates Comstock. However, it is telling that if he does get baptized and is born anew without sin]], he goes on to create the Hall of Heroes which feature him as the glorified hero of those battles. And yet Booker, who [[spoiler:refused baptism and wasn't absolved of his guilt]], instead insists he's no hero for his deeds and doesn't even want to ''talk'' about his involvement in the Boxer Rebellion or Wounded Knee. Once again, however, Comstock did the exact ''opposite'' of repenting. By attempting to take credit for Wounded Knee and repeating his actions at Peking, by razing Peking to the ground, he's shown he's utterly ''unrepentant'' for his actions. He's actively trying to turn his vices into virtues. [[spoiler: Booker, who genuinely repents of his deeds at Wounded Knee but can't see baptism washing away the sin, later drowns and is reborn in a new and possibly happier life]].
8th Mar '17 2:55:04 PM rjd1922
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* Elizabeth could have tried to assassinate Atlas/Fontaine directly, but she doesn't. Without Atlas, Ryan's grip on Rapture would become a stranglehold; no one else has the power to challenge him. Events of ''VideoGame/Bioshock'' have to happen the way they happen for the cycle of violence to end.

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* Elizabeth could have tried to assassinate Atlas/Fontaine directly, but she doesn't. Without Atlas, Ryan's grip on Rapture would become a stranglehold; no one else has the power to challenge him. Events of ''VideoGame/Bioshock'' ''VideoGame/BioShock1'' have to happen the way they happen for the cycle of violence to end.
22nd Feb '17 9:16:08 PM 309216364
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*** More likely, [[DrivenToSuicide he would have just shot himself]], unable to live with the guilt of [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone inadvertently killing his own daughter.]]
2nd Jan '17 5:48:53 PM forsetipurge
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* Even if Fitzroy doesn't denounce Booker as a ghost or an impostor, sooner or later Booker would end up fighting the Vox. Why? Because he himself has massacred civilians in the past, and realized that nothing would ever justify that.


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* Elizabeth could have tried to assassinate Atlas/Fontaine directly, but she doesn't. Without Atlas, Ryan's grip on Rapture would become a stranglehold; no one else has the power to challenge him. Events of ''VideoGame/Bioshock'' have to happen the way they happen for the cycle of violence to end.
23rd Dec '16 8:17:24 AM Gosicrystal
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* Of the various events that allow you make a choice, some expire after a set period of time. Invariably, if you let the choice expire, you end up with a worse outcome than if you make the "wrong" choice. If you wait too long to choose whether to pelt either the couple or Fink in the beginning, you lose out on a gear later in the game [[LostForever (and you can't get it by any other means.)]] If you wait too long to either draw on the ticket clerk in the Arcade or demand your ticket, you get stabbed in the hand (the result of the "demand your ticket" choice) for your trouble. That seems a strange feature, but if you think about it, it fits the a theme established in all of the games: the importance of choice. No matter what choice you make, the important thing is to choose. Regardless of the outcome, it's always better than agonizing over making the right choice.

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* Of the various events that allow you make a choice, some expire after a set period of time. Invariably, if you let the choice expire, you end up with a worse outcome than if you make the "wrong" choice. If you wait too long to choose whether to pelt either the couple or Fink in the beginning, you lose out on a gear later in the game [[LostForever [[PermanentlyMissableContent (and you can't get it by any other means.)]] means)]]. If you wait too long to either draw on the ticket clerk in the Arcade or demand your ticket, you get stabbed in the hand (the result of the "demand your ticket" choice) for your trouble. That seems a strange feature, but if you think about it, it fits the a theme established in all of the games: the importance of choice. No matter what choice you make, the important thing is to choose. Regardless of the outcome, it's always better than agonizing over making the right choice.
2nd Nov '16 8:47:11 PM SantosLHalper
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* At Soldier's Field, two women are talking about a boy who was sent to [[spoiler: Comstock House]] and was never heard from again. [[spoiler: The horrors you encounter in the BadFuture were, at least to some extent still existed in 1912.]]

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* At Soldier's Field, two women are talking about a boy who was sent to [[spoiler: Comstock House]] and was never heard from again. [[spoiler: The horrors you encounter in the BadFuture were, at least to some extent still existed exist in 1912.]]
2nd Nov '16 8:07:29 PM SantosLHalper
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* At Soldier's Field, two women are talking about a boy who was sent to [[spoiler: Comstock House]] and was never heard from again. [[spoiler: The horrors you encounter in the BadFuture were, at least to some extent still existed in 1912.]]
31st Jul '16 6:09:23 PM WanderingBrowser
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*** However, WordOfGod is that this is a case of GameplayAndStoryIntegration -- the people you possess in the game commit suicide because they were possessed by ''The False Shepherd'', specifically -- that then turned into GameplayAndStorySegregation in ''Burial At Sea''. Not that it makes things ''too'' much cheerier; the residents of Columbia are so indoctrinated that being under Booker's CharmPerson power triggers a suicidal "redemption" urge. Think a little about what that says about Comstock's charisma and his influence over his flock...
12th Jul '16 8:53:26 PM Blacknuz
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* During the level 'The Hand of the Prophet', you drop multiple Patriot pods off a sky line to reach the top of a zeppelin. During the lighthouse scene at the beginning of the game it shows that Columbia's flight-path stays primarily inside the US, given that at least have passed since Booker entered Columbia (Hall of Heroes and Comstock House take place at night). That gives Columbia more than enough time to get past the coast of Maine, and the pods were probably designed to be dropped. [[ParanoiaFuel So where did the Motorized Patriots in the pods go, and what did they do once they got there]]?

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* During the level 'The Hand of the Prophet', you drop multiple Patriot pods off a sky line to reach the top of a zeppelin. During the lighthouse scene at the beginning of the game it shows that Columbia's flight-path stays primarily inside the US, given that at least a day have passed since Booker entered Columbia (Hall of Heroes and Comstock House take place at night). That gives Columbia more than enough time to get past the coast of Maine, and the pods were probably designed to be dropped. [[ParanoiaFuel So where did the Motorized Patriots in the pods go, and what did they do once they got there]]?
11th Jul '16 9:10:27 PM Blacknuz
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* From what we saw in the first of ''[=BioShock=] Infinite'', Booker is travelling in a boat along with a lighthouse-like structure to (supposedly), get to Columbia in the sky. Since the first game was set in an underwater world, the opening of them contrast with each other. The first game started on a plane and then goes to the ocean, where Infinite starts in the water and goes into the sky.

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* From what we saw in the first beginning of ''[=BioShock=] Infinite'', Booker is travelling in a boat along with a lighthouse-like structure to (supposedly), get to Columbia in the sky. Since the first game was set in an underwater world, the opening of them contrast with each other. The first game started on a plane and then goes to the ocean, where Infinite starts in the water and goes into the sky.



* The background material about Comstock states that he was at the battle of Wounded Knee and also used Columbia to raze Peking to the ground during the Boxer Rebellion (supposedly in retaliation for Americans being held hostage). [[spoiler:But in the game itself, Booker had never heard of anyone named Comstock at the battle of Wounded Knee. Why? Because Comstock was the name a alternate version of himself chose after accepting baptism for his sins after the battle. Which then led to the events in the story]]. Same thing goes for why Slate not hearing of him.

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* The background material about Comstock states that he was at the battle of Wounded Knee and also used Columbia to raze Peking to the ground during the Boxer Rebellion (supposedly in retaliation for Americans being held hostage). [[spoiler:But in the game itself, Booker had never heard of anyone named Comstock at the battle of Wounded Knee. Why? Because Comstock was the name a alternate version of himself chose after accepting baptism for his sins after the battle. Which then led to the events in the story]]. Same thing goes for why Slate has not hearing heard of him.



* Heard all those anachronistic covers of more recent songs, like 'Everybody Wants to Rule the World', 'God Only Knows' and 'Girls Just Wanna Have Fun'? In modern times, these songs won't be original ones, they would be treated as historical songs, being "written" decades before their times. Given a double fridge brilliance in that Booker and Elizabeth's voice actors made a cover of 'Will The Circle Be Unbroken'.

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* Heard all those anachronistic covers of more recent songs, like 'Everybody Wants to Rule the World', 'God Only Knows' and 'Girls Just Wanna Have Fun'? In modern times, these songs won't be original ones, they would be treated as historical songs, being "written" decades before their times. Given a double fridge brilliance in that Booker and Elizabeth's voice actors made a cover of 'Will The the Circle Be Unbroken'.



** Booker, who the main religious establishment of Columbia hates and fears, is revealed to have been martyred as a hero to the Vox in, then seems to come back to life. Comstock would certainly believe him to be the anti-christ, seeing his actions as a perverting of the Jesus mythology.

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** Booker, who the main religious establishment of Columbia hates and fears, is revealed to have been martyred as a hero to the Vox in, in one universe, then seems to come back to life. Comstock would certainly believe him to be the anti-christ, seeing his actions as a perverting of the Jesus mythology.



*** "My father yells what you gonna do with your life" -- Father Comstock's criticism of her indecision between following him or the false prophet

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*** "My father yells what you gonna do with your life" -- Father Comstock's criticism of her indecision between following him or the false prophetshepherd



** Tears for Fears "Everybody Wants To Rule The World". Comes up a few times from a cameo, Elizabeth singing it, and a Fink record. It's fair to say that this could be considered a representation of Comstock's desires to rain fire from the skies with Elizabeth. It could also be [[spoiler: interpreted that, at some point in space and time, everybody has a desire to rule or reign. Comstock is Booker, it's clear he wants to rule. Eventually Elizabeth gives in and follows up to Comstock's wishes, and Daisy went mad while ruling the Vox Populi and now wants to take over everything for herself]].

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** Tears for Fears "Everybody Wants To to Rule The the World". Comes up a few times from a cameo, Elizabeth singing it, and a Fink record. It's fair to say that this could be considered a representation of Comstock's desires to rain fire from the skies with Elizabeth. It could also be [[spoiler: interpreted that, at some point in space and time, everybody has a desire to rule or reign. Comstock is Booker, it's clear he wants to rule. Eventually Elizabeth gives in and follows up to Comstock's wishes, and Daisy went mad while ruling the Vox Populi and now wants to take over everything for herself]].



** Firstly, Elizabeth and Booker don't really seem to ''care'' anymore. Think about it; Booker was in awe of Columbia (for more reasons then just the positive) because it was totally new to him and he's never heard of or seen anything like it before. Elizabeth is much the same, having spent her whole life cooped up in a cage with nothing but books and lockpicks, and is at first excited and later disturbed by how wondrous and massive the city is compared to what she's always known. By the time Songbird ruins their escape, the initial curious wonder has worn off. They've seen more than enough of Columbia, for what it wants to be seen as and for what it actually is underneath, and now they just want to '''leave''' and get to Paris. From that point on they're focused more on their own internal drama than whatever the ruin of a city is still putting itself through, because that's what will actually matter when it comes to them finally escaping.

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** Firstly, Elizabeth and Booker don't really seem to ''care'' anymore. Think about it; Booker was in awe of Columbia (for more reasons then than just the positive) because it was totally new to him and he's never heard of or seen anything like it before. Elizabeth is much the same, having spent her whole life cooped up in a cage with nothing but books and lockpicks, and is at first excited and later disturbed by how wondrous and massive the city is compared to what she's always known. By the time Songbird ruins their escape, the initial curious wonder has worn off. They've seen more than enough of Columbia, for what it wants to be seen as and for what it actually is underneath, and now they just want to '''leave''' and get to Paris. From that point on they're focused more on their own internal drama than whatever the ruin of a city is still putting itself through, because that's what will actually matter when it comes to them finally escaping.



** He seems really on the nose with his confrontations with Booker in the Hall of Heroes, doesn't he? Almost to the point where it's implied that Slate knows the truth of Comstock/Booker's relationship. [[spoiler: Remember, this is the universe where Booker became Comstock, which means Slate knows full well about how his old war buddy went and got saved and ended up building Columbia. So when he sees Booker come in, sans beard and holier then though attitude, it's pretty obvious he knows the score, even if he's not in on the specifics of how tears and alternate universes work]].

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** He seems really on the nose with his confrontations with Booker in the Hall of Heroes, doesn't he? Almost to the point where it's implied that Slate knows the truth of Comstock/Booker's relationship. [[spoiler: Remember, this is the universe where Booker became Comstock, which means Slate knows full well about how his old war buddy went and got saved and ended up building Columbia. So when he sees Booker come in, sans beard and holier then though than thou attitude, it's pretty obvious he knows the score, even if he's not in on the specifics of how tears and alternate universes work]].



* The very first "choice" you make in the game has only: be baptized, or wander around the room forever. You MUST go through the baptism, even insincerely, to enter Columbia. [[spoiler:Columbia only EXISTS in those universes where Booker went through a baptism and rechristened himself Zachary Comstock, not to actually better himself but to simply assuage his guilt, which is an insincere reason for baptism. At which point another universe's Booker was brought in to stop him, who had to insincerely be baptised to enter]]... It's a ButThouMust moment crossing over with a StableTimeLoop. Which feeds into Fridge Brilliance part two: the thing about loops is that they're (more or less) circular. And what's the name of the song that Elizabeth sings to the scared child, with Booker backing her up on the guitar?

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* The very first "choice" you make in the game has only: be baptized, or wander around the room forever. You MUST go through the baptism, even insincerely, to enter Columbia. [[spoiler:Columbia only EXISTS in those universes where Booker went through a baptism and rechristened himself Zachary Comstock, not to actually better himself but to simply assuage his guilt, which is an insincere reason for baptism. At which point another universe's Booker was brought in to stop him, who had to insincerely be baptised baptized to enter]]... It's a ButThouMust moment crossing over with a StableTimeLoop. Which feeds into Fridge Brilliance part two: the thing about loops is that they're (more or less) circular. And what's the name of the song that Elizabeth sings to the scared child, with Booker backing her up on the guitar?



* As you first arrive on ''The Hand Of The Prophet,'' Comstock tells Elizabeth (over the PA system) that she clearly knows that there's something weird about Booker but "can't quite put your finger on it". Quite apart from the fact that it sounds like a cheeky hint as to [[spoiler: Booker being the cause of Elizabeth's missing finger]], this isn't the first time someone in the [=BioShock=] series has used this particular turn of phrase: [[spoiler: Andrew Ryan in the first game, hinting at Jack's true origins]].

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* As you first arrive on ''The Hand Of The of the Prophet,'' Comstock tells Elizabeth (over the PA system) that she clearly knows that there's something weird about Booker but "can't quite put your finger on it". Quite apart from the fact that it sounds like a cheeky hint as to [[spoiler: Booker being the cause of Elizabeth's missing finger]], this isn't the first time someone in the [=BioShock=] series has used this particular turn of phrase: [[spoiler: Andrew Ryan in the first game, hinting at Jack's true origins]].



* Near the very end of the game, [[spoiler: Elizabeth explains that, despite there being "a million million" worlds, there are constants and variables. "There's always a lighthouse. There's always a man, there's always a city..." It's easy to dismiss how similar these constants might be, but you were just on a bathysphere in Rapture. So, how is this significant? While in Rapture you can observe a familiar sign from the first game, where surface travel and bathysphere use was restricted... And only those who have genetic makeup similar to Andrew Ryan could use them.]]

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* Near the very end of the game, [[spoiler: Elizabeth explains that, despite there being "a million million, million" worlds, there are constants and variables. "There's always a lighthouse. There's always a man, there's always a city..." It's easy to dismiss how similar these constants might be, but you were just on a bathysphere in Rapture. So, how is this significant? While in Rapture you can observe a familiar sign from the first game, where surface travel and bathysphere use was restricted... And only those who have genetic makeup similar to Andrew Ryan could use them.]]



* Booker [[spoiler: becomes Comstock after being baptized and becomes a sociopath, whereas Prime!Booker doesn't and is still trying to become a better person. Baptism isn't vindication-your "sins" are no more because they were the correct course of action; it's forgiveness-your sins are no more because you turn away from them and repent-the Bible refers to this as "Casting it into the sea". Booker was desperate to escape the consequences of his actions, and likely saw baptism as a "Get Out Of [[FireAndBrimstoneHell Jail]] [[KarmaHoudini Free]]" card. It's not; it's a Good Start, but you have to work from your end. Prime!Booker understands that, but [[MoralEventHorizon doesn't believe he can be forgiven]].]]

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* Booker [[spoiler: becomes Comstock after being baptized and becomes a sociopath, whereas Prime!Booker doesn't and is still trying to become a better person. Baptism isn't vindication-your "sins" are no more because they were the correct course of action; it's forgiveness-your sins are no more because you turn away from them and repent-the Bible refers to this as "Casting it into the sea". Booker was desperate to escape the consequences of his actions, and likely saw baptism as a "Get Out Of of [[FireAndBrimstoneHell Jail]] [[KarmaHoudini Free]]" card. It's not; it's a Good Start, but you have to work from your end. Prime!Booker understands that, but [[MoralEventHorizon doesn't believe he can be forgiven]].]]
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Fridge.BioShockInfinite