History DethroningMoment / Film

9th Jul '16 8:55:58 AM Allronix
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* Tropers/{{Allronix}}: The dethroning moment of suck for the ''Film/{{TRON}}'' franchise? It's the BadassDecay of Flynn. In the first film, he was something of a JerkWithAHeartOGold; even with the trail of ''"what were you thinking?!"'' moments (like sexually harassing Yori - not cool, El Duderino), you knew he'd do the right thing when the chips were truly down. But then the coup, running off to the Outlands with Quorra and then what? He pretty much sits on his ass meditating while The Grid burns around him. We get this token line about how he fought Clu and it "made him stronger," but the fact that Clu's pretty much taken the whole thing over makes the whole line sound like an excuse. We don't even get a mention in ''WesternAnimation/TronUprising'' about Flynn resisting Clu (you'd think that if the local DeityOfHumanOrigin and the local batshit crazy avatar were at active war with one another, someone would mention it). But no, from all the evidence presented, Flynn essentially buggered off to a cave with Olivia Wilde, knifed the Programs in the back, and let Clu have whatever he wanted until Sam knocks some sense into him.

to:

* Tropers/{{Allronix}}: The dethroning moment of suck for the ''Film/{{TRON}}'' franchise? It's the BadassDecay of Flynn. In the first film, he was something of a JerkWithAHeartOGold; JerkWithAHeartOfGold; even with the trail of ''"what were you thinking?!"'' moments (like sexually harassing Yori - not cool, El Duderino), you knew he'd do the right thing when the chips were truly down. But then the coup, running off to the Outlands with Quorra and then what? He pretty much sits on his ass meditating while The Grid burns around him. We get this token line about how he fought Clu and it "made him stronger," but the fact that Clu's pretty much taken the whole thing over makes the whole line sound like an excuse. We don't even get a mention in ''WesternAnimation/TronUprising'' about Flynn resisting Clu (you'd think that if the local DeityOfHumanOrigin and the local batshit crazy avatar were at active war with one another, someone ''someone'' would mention it). But no, from all the evidence presented, Flynn essentially buggered off to a cave with Olivia Wilde, knifed the Programs in the back, and let Clu have whatever he wanted until Sam knocks some sense into him.



** Tropers/{{Allronix}}: Much as I mentioned above, the cherry on top of the mess? Luke Skywalker pulling the same stunt as Kevin Flynn above. He runs off to a pretty nice location to pout...excuse me, "meditate" while leaving his friends, family, and allies to clean up the mess while his crazed nephew actively trashes everything he and his loved ones worked for. At least when it was Jacen pulling this crap in the old EU, Luke was the first to go after him. I do hope Leia tears him a new one.

to:

** Tropers/{{Allronix}}: Much as I mentioned above, the cherry on top of the mess? Luke Skywalker pulling the same stunt as Kevin Flynn above. He runs off to a pretty nice scenic location to pout...excuse me, "meditate" while leaving his friends, family, and allies to clean up the mess while his crazed nephew actively trashes everything he and his loved ones worked for. At least when it was Jacen pulling this crap in the old EU, Luke was the first to go after him. I do hope Leia tears him a new one.
9th Jul '16 8:52:52 AM Allronix
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Added DiffLines:

* Tropers/{{Allronix}}: The dethroning moment of suck for the ''Film/{{TRON}}'' franchise? It's the BadassDecay of Flynn. In the first film, he was something of a JerkWithAHeartOGold; even with the trail of ''"what were you thinking?!"'' moments (like sexually harassing Yori - not cool, El Duderino), you knew he'd do the right thing when the chips were truly down. But then the coup, running off to the Outlands with Quorra and then what? He pretty much sits on his ass meditating while The Grid burns around him. We get this token line about how he fought Clu and it "made him stronger," but the fact that Clu's pretty much taken the whole thing over makes the whole line sound like an excuse. We don't even get a mention in ''WesternAnimation/TronUprising'' about Flynn resisting Clu (you'd think that if the local DeityOfHumanOrigin and the local batshit crazy avatar were at active war with one another, someone would mention it). But no, from all the evidence presented, Flynn essentially buggered off to a cave with Olivia Wilde, knifed the Programs in the back, and let Clu have whatever he wanted until Sam knocks some sense into him.


Added DiffLines:

** Tropers/{{Allronix}}: Much as I mentioned above, the cherry on top of the mess? Luke Skywalker pulling the same stunt as Kevin Flynn above. He runs off to a pretty nice location to pout...excuse me, "meditate" while leaving his friends, family, and allies to clean up the mess while his crazed nephew actively trashes everything he and his loved ones worked for. At least when it was Jacen pulling this crap in the old EU, Luke was the first to go after him. I do hope Leia tears him a new one.
28th Jun '16 11:39:00 PM JEFFWONTLEAVE
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* JEFFWONTLEAVE: Coming from a person who considers the first [[Film/SpiderManTrilogy 2 Spider-Man films]] as extremely Important to comic book movieís and are a wonderful homage to the original run in the 60s and 70s, I can not understand why anybody would defend [[Film/TheAmazingSpiderman2 The Amazing Spider-Man 2]] or be shocked that sony decided to reboot the character. While the [[Film/TheAmazingSpiderMan First film]] was a flawed and predictable film, it at the very least gave me some great versions of spider-man and gwen stacey and a story arc about peterís parents that would build up in future installments. Not only does the sequel [[Main/TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot fail to do anything cool with that arc]], not only does it [[Main/TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter ruin those versions I loved in the first]] and made them almost complete idiots, not only did it fail to give me the most laughably awful villains since Batman and Robin, but it also flat-out stop the movie with no reason whatsoever to poorly hint at potential film sequels and spin-offs. Take for a scene that happens 38 minutes in, where harry just drops a conversation where he acts like a smug little brat to the suits at oscorp[[note]] Which makes me not care that oscorp stabs him in the back later[[/note]] to just say randomly chat to a girl named Felicia who just happens to be his fatherís assistant and that everybody now must work for her because she works for him[[note]] How the hell does he know this information by the way?[[/note]]. There are 2 reasons this scene doesn't work at all. 1: As a person who has read a good chunk of spider-man comics, I know that the most common Felicia in those books is Felicia Hardy a.k.a. [[Comicbook/BlackCat The Black Cat]]. So itís pretty obvious to me that this is Sony's way of saying [[Main/LampshadeHanging ďHEY GUYS WE GOT FELICIA IN THE MOVIE AND SHE MAY OR MAY NOT BE BLACK CAT ONE DAY WHO KNOWS!!!??!!?Ē]] And yeah itís cool that sheís here and all, but I would rather see Felicia actually be like her comic book counterpart in some way instead of just being a random shout-out in the middle of a scene. If anything Iím annoyed that youíre wasting a beloved side-character like this. 2: Letís say you donít have much knowledge in spider-man lore and you weíre just a fan through the movies and TV showís. Now try watching the movie and this scene in the particular. [[Main/BigLippedAlligatorMoment What the hell does this have anything to do with the story at all?]] She barely shows up at all for the rest of the movie, nobody actually worked for her or anything, she wasnít even a love interest for harry. The movie stopped for about a minute for a character that is literally nothing. And thatís all this film is, just a bunch of random scenes that pretend to be something important but in the end was just nothing.

to:

* JEFFWONTLEAVE: Coming from a person who considers the first [[Film/SpiderManTrilogy 2 Spider-Man films]] as extremely Important to comic book movieís and are a wonderful homage to the original run in the 60s and 70s, I can not understand why anybody would defend [[Film/TheAmazingSpiderman2 The Amazing Spider-Man 2]] or be shocked that sony decided to reboot the character. While the [[Film/TheAmazingSpiderMan First film]] was a flawed and predictable film, it at the very least gave me some great versions of spider-man and gwen stacey and a story arc about peterís parents that would build up in future installments. Not only does the sequel [[Main/TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot fail to do anything cool with that arc]], not only does it [[Main/TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter ruin those versions I loved in the first]] and made them almost complete idiots, not only did it fail to give me the most laughably awful villains since Batman and Robin, but it also flat-out stop the movie with no reason whatsoever to poorly hint at potential film sequels and spin-offs. Take for a scene that happens 38 minutes in, where harry just drops a conversation where he acts like a smug little brat to the suits at oscorp[[note]] Which makes me not care that oscorp stabs him in the back later[[/note]] to just say randomly chat to a girl named Felicia who just happens to be his fatherís assistant assistant[[note]] How the hell does he know this information by the way?[[/note]] and that everybody now must work for her because she works for him[[note]] How the hell does he know this information by the way?[[/note]].him. There are 2 reasons this scene doesn't work at all. 1:
**1:
As a person who has read a good chunk of spider-man comics, I know that the most common Felicia in those books is Felicia Hardy a.k.a. [[Comicbook/BlackCat The Black Cat]]. So itís pretty obvious to me that this is Sony's way of saying [[Main/LampshadeHanging ďHEY GUYS WE GOT FELICIA IN THE MOVIE AND SHE MAY OR MAY NOT BE BLACK CAT ONE DAY WHO KNOWS!!!??!!?Ē]] And yeah itís cool that sheís here and all, but I would rather see Felicia actually be like her comic book counterpart in some way instead of just being a random shout-out in the middle of a scene. If anything Iím annoyed that youíre wasting a beloved side-character like this. 2: this.
**2:
Letís say you donít have much knowledge in spider-man lore and you weíre just a fan through the movies and TV showís. Now try watching the movie and this scene in the particular. [[Main/BigLippedAlligatorMoment What the hell does this have anything to do with the story at all?]] She barely shows up at all for the rest of the movie, nobody actually worked for her or anything, she wasnít even a love interest for harry. The movie stopped for about a minute for a character that is literally nothing. And thatís all this film is, just a bunch of random scenes that pretend to be something important but in the end was just nothing.
28th Jun '16 11:33:20 PM JEFFWONTLEAVE
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Added DiffLines:

*JEFFWONTLEAVE: Coming from a person who considers the first [[Film/SpiderManTrilogy 2 Spider-Man films]] as extremely Important to comic book movieís and are a wonderful homage to the original run in the 60s and 70s, I can not understand why anybody would defend [[Film/TheAmazingSpiderman2 The Amazing Spider-Man 2]] or be shocked that sony decided to reboot the character. While the [[Film/TheAmazingSpiderMan First film]] was a flawed and predictable film, it at the very least gave me some great versions of spider-man and gwen stacey and a story arc about peterís parents that would build up in future installments. Not only does the sequel [[Main/TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot fail to do anything cool with that arc]], not only does it [[Main/TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodCharacter ruin those versions I loved in the first]] and made them almost complete idiots, not only did it fail to give me the most laughably awful villains since Batman and Robin, but it also flat-out stop the movie with no reason whatsoever to poorly hint at potential film sequels and spin-offs. Take for a scene that happens 38 minutes in, where harry just drops a conversation where he acts like a smug little brat to the suits at oscorp[[note]] Which makes me not care that oscorp stabs him in the back later[[/note]] to just say randomly chat to a girl named Felicia who just happens to be his fatherís assistant and that everybody now must work for her because she works for him[[note]] How the hell does he know this information by the way?[[/note]]. There are 2 reasons this scene doesn't work at all. 1: As a person who has read a good chunk of spider-man comics, I know that the most common Felicia in those books is Felicia Hardy a.k.a. [[Comicbook/BlackCat The Black Cat]]. So itís pretty obvious to me that this is Sony's way of saying [[Main/LampshadeHanging ďHEY GUYS WE GOT FELICIA IN THE MOVIE AND SHE MAY OR MAY NOT BE BLACK CAT ONE DAY WHO KNOWS!!!??!!?Ē]] And yeah itís cool that sheís here and all, but I would rather see Felicia actually be like her comic book counterpart in some way instead of just being a random shout-out in the middle of a scene. If anything Iím annoyed that youíre wasting a beloved side-character like this. 2: Letís say you donít have much knowledge in spider-man lore and you weíre just a fan through the movies and TV showís. Now try watching the movie and this scene in the particular. [[Main/BigLippedAlligatorMoment What the hell does this have anything to do with the story at all?]] She barely shows up at all for the rest of the movie, nobody actually worked for her or anything, she wasnít even a love interest for harry. The movie stopped for about a minute for a character that is literally nothing. And thatís all this film is, just a bunch of random scenes that pretend to be something important but in the end was just nothing.
18th Jun '16 2:51:43 PM SenorCornholio
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* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/JemAndTheHolograms Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it apart was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, and pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by people like Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life. Give the other moments on this page credit; at least they didn't go out of their way to insult a franchise's fanbase to such a degree. With that said, this is officially my dethroning moment for pretty much all media, ever.

to:

* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/JemAndTheHolograms Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it apart was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, and pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by people like Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it the movie by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life. Give the other moments on this page credit; at least they didn't go out of their way to insult a franchise's fanbase to such a degree. With that said, this is officially my dethroning moment for pretty much all media, ever.
18th Jun '16 2:50:59 PM SenorCornholio
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* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/JemAndTheHolograms Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it apart was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, and pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by people like Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life.

to:

* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/JemAndTheHolograms Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it apart was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, and pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by people like Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life. Give the other moments on this page credit; at least they didn't go out of their way to insult a franchise's fanbase to such a degree. With that said, this is officially my dethroning moment for pretty much all media, ever.
18th Jun '16 2:46:59 PM SenorCornholio
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* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/JemAndTheHolograms Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it up was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life.

to:

* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/JemAndTheHolograms Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it up apart was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, and pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by people like Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life.
18th Jun '16 2:45:27 PM SenorCornholio
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/Jem Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it up was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life.

to:

* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/Jem [[WesternAnimation/JemAndTheHolograms Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it up was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life.
18th Jun '16 2:44:49 PM SenorCornholio
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Added DiffLines:

* SenorCornholio: No mention of the [[WesternAnimation/Jem Jem]] movie yet? Just watching [[NostalgiaCritic the Nostalgia Critic]] tearing it up was enough to keep me away from this mess, even as someone who never saw the original cartoon. It had nothing to do with the show, everything is changed up aside from the idea that the characters are in a band, pretty much everything I could potentially say about it has already been said by Doug and [[RebelTaxi Pan]] in the past. However, one moment in the movie, I have to mention. In case you were blissfully unaware, the creators of the movie gave the fans a chance to be in it by simply stating how much they loved the show. Sounds like an interesting idea, right? It seems like they're being nice to the fans. However, that's not what they did; what fans got instead was their own gushing over Cartoon!Jem being used at the end of the film, and edited to make it look like they're talking about Movie!Jem. Wow. Not since [[TeenTitansGo Return of Slade]] have I seen such an insult towards a fanbase in my entire life.
18th Jun '16 7:09:34 AM Peridonyx
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** Tropers/{{Peridonyx}}: For me, it was the sheer HappyEndingOverride over ''Return of the Jedi''. Sure, the ''Legends'' EU also invoked RealityEnsues regarding the Battle of Endor, the New Republic, the New Jedi Order, etc., but at least it was all done in a way that didn't make you feel like you had just watched a glorified ShootTheShaggyDog story. The same, however, can't be said for the state of affairs in this film -- the heroes are still at a major disadvantage (even an arguably worse one than before), the villains are still so overpowering (complete with yet another FallenHero acting as TheDragon), and the New Jedi Order was taken down even far easier than the one in the Prequels (thus technically making Luke a FailureHero despite all of his CharacterDevelopment in the Originals). What's the point of getting invested in the heroes if you're just going to {{Retcon}} all of their accomplishments offscreen anyway?

to:

** Tropers/{{Peridonyx}}: For me, it was it's the sheer HappyEndingOverride over ''Return of the Jedi''. Sure, the ''Legends'' Legends EU also invoked RealityEnsues regarding the Battle of Endor, the New Republic, the New Jedi Order, etc., but at least it was all done in a way that didn't make you feel like you had you'd just watched a glorified ShootTheShaggyDog story. The same, however, can't be said for the state of affairs in this film -- the film: The heroes are still at a major disadvantage (even an arguably (arguably even a worse one than before), the villains are still so overpowering (complete with yet another FallenHero acting as TheDragon), and the New Jedi Order was taken down even far easier than the one in the Prequels (thus technically making Luke a FailureHero despite all of his CharacterDevelopment in the Originals). What's Originals) -- and off-screen on top of it. So what's the point of getting invested in the heroes if you're just going to {{Retcon}} pretty much all of their accomplishments offscreen anyway?are just going to be {{Retcon}}ned away between movies regardless?
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=DethroningMoment.Film