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Discussion History Main / DateRape

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[011] timewilltell Current Version
28th Dec '20 at 10:08:48 PM
Changed line(s) 4 from:
n
I am well aware that we are free to critique and review Quietus on this site, but I argue that critiquing it in the same way that one would critique a professionally edited and published piece of fiction is inappropriate. Keeping in mind the kind of medium within which the story was written and the amount of support the author has when actually crafting the story and plot and how the writing has changed over the course of a decade is key to being able to understand the tropes within this story and the story itself.
to:
I am well aware that we are free to critique and review Quietus on this site, but I argue that critiquing it in the same way that one would critique a professionally edited and published piece of fiction is inappropriate. Keeping in mind the kind of medium within which the story was written, the amount of support the author has when actually crafting the story and plot, and how the writing has changed over the course of a decade is key to being able to understand the tropes within this story and the story itself.
Changed line(s) 13 from:
n
While the site rules are clear that you have the right to analyse Quietus, it does not follow that providing extensive details about the author’s personal preferences and tumblr account are permissible or even appropriate. This was not a tumblr account created only for advertising or expanding upon Quietus or Quietus-related themes. It was the author’s personal space and going through it in this way and posting dates when things were changed on it (which now will be accessible to anyone who goes back through the history section of this page) and the author’s own preferences was an invasion of privacy and showed a lack of respect for the author. This was not the webpage of a professional author dedicated to their works of fiction and, while I recognise that the internet is forever and we can all comment on everything nowadays, putting the extensive details of a normal person writing a fanfic for fun in their free time into a wiki seems inappropriate to me. Note that this was not just confined to this section of the page.
to:
While the site rules are clear that you have the right to analyse Quietus, it does not follow that providing extensive details about the author’s personal preferences and tumblr account are permissible or even appropriate. This was not a tumblr account created only for advertising or expanding upon Quietus or Quietus-related themes. It was the author’s personal space and going through it in this way and posting dates when things were changed on it (which now will be accessible to anyone who goes back through the history section of this page) and the author’s own preferences was an invasion of privacy and showed a lack of respect for the author. This was not the webpage of a professional author dedicated to their works of fiction and, while I recognise that the internet is forever and we can all comment on everything nowadays, putting personal details of a normal person writing a fanfic for fun in their free time into a wiki seems inappropriate to me. Note that this was not just confined to this section of the page. I recognise that this has partially been addressed in your most recent comment, so thank you.
Changed line(s) 16 from:
n
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years.\
to:
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years.\\\" There is no deadline for each chapter of Quietus. Updates on the status of chapters are provided in the author’s FF.net page and in author’s notes, but these do not provide specific dates for chapter releases. Hence, this was a misapplication of the trope.

2.3. Arc Fatigue:
While I understand that some reviewers were impatient for the author to hurry up and get to the romance, a large section of the fandom enjoyed this arc greatly as it allowed the characters to grow to the point that *healthy* renewal of the SS relationship was possible in the Relics arc. I think that both sides should be presented.

2.4. Serial Escalation:
The use of escalation and building of tension is for particular plot points and the fic is clearly rated M for mature and disturbing content. As the trope explanation clearly states, “This isn\\\'t meant to be confused with the buildup to season finales or a plot climax, but rather a consistent escalation in events that always exceeds what a viewer would expect.” Hence, I don’t see how this applies.

2.5. Unfortunate Implications:
Once more I do not think that this trope applies as it doesn’t meet the criteria, i.e. “When a work\\\'s content offends a large enough audience in a way that the author did not expect, you get this.” Anonomous reviews (that are possibly posted by the same person) and a small number of criticisms of the work do not warrant this trope. There is not a large portion of the reading audience that is offended by the points you make, as you seem to state yourself when prefacing with, “There have been occasional reviews”.
Additionally, the author has stated that this is not the final version of the story and a large edit will be done once it is completed, hence critiquing any edits still pending is premature.
Critiquing the implications of a one-off song used to create an ambience for a particular scene yourself is also misusing this trope.

3. Adhering to a singular writing style and tone is laudable, but, as I think I have shown, many of the changes that I made were in order to present a more holistic analysis of the story. At times, I do believe that calls for more charitable interpretations and not making judgements about where the author is going with something before they get there. If this is a site where someone can come and pick apart for fun an amateur’s writing style from ten years ago that hasn’t been edited professionally, then I think that there is a problem with the site and its culture and not my interpretation. We’re analysing a fanfic and that can be done well, but there is a human being at the other end of it and fans who love the story. What harm is there in being a bit more gracious in word choice while critiquing and analysing?

Further Comments:

Several of the tropes you bring up tie into canon aspects of Naruto and the Greek myth of Hades and Persephone. These tropes are problematic and dark at times, but crediting them fully to the author of Quietus as she is crafting a fusion fic and trying to do homage to both, is reductive. It should be made clear what are original plot points and which are being integrated and reworked.

In all honesty, I do not have a great deal of time to continue editing this page in any great detail, but I think that it is wildly unfair to the story, fans, and author to have left it as it was when I first encountered the page. I admire the effort put into parsing this story for tropes and would like to see this page be a clear and critical reading of these, while also being fair in its tone and presentation.

I would like to end on a few points. I think that, if this page is to be an appropriate and fair reading of the story, multiple points of view of the story and its themes need to be taken into consideration. Negative comments or interpretations should not be singled out and presented as the views of the entire fanbase, even if the YMMV section is not as formalised as the rest of the page. Additionally, a greater effort should be made to consider and present the context of the story and its development. Finally, the author’s privacy should be respected.

I do hope that this answered all your questions and that if we do continue to work on this together, we may do so amicably.
[010] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 01:40:23 PM
Changed line(s) 16 from:
n
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years.\
to:
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years.\\\" There is no deadline for each chapter of Quietus. Updates are provided in the author’s FF.net page and in author’s notes for each chapter, but these do not provide specific dates for chapter releases. Hence, this was a misapplication of the trope.

2.3. Arc Fatigue:
While I understand that some reviewers were impatient for the author to hurry up and get to the romance, a large section of the fandom enjoyed this arc greatly as it allowed the characters to grow to the point where it allowed for a *healthy* renewal of the SS relationship in the Relics arc. I think that both sides should be presented.

2.4. Serial Escalation:
The use of escalation and building of tension is for particular plot points and the fic is clearly rated M for mature and disturbing content. As the trope explanation clearly states, “This isn\\\'t meant to be confused with the buildup to season finales or a plot climax, but rather a consistent escalation in events that always exceeds what a viewer would expect.” Hence, I don’t see how this applies.

2.5. Unfortunate Implications:
Once more I do not think that this trope applies as it doesn’t meet the criteria, i.e. “When a work\\\'s content offends a large enough audience in a way that the author did not expect, you get this.” Anonomous reviews (that are possibley posted by the same person) and a small number of criticisms of the work do not warrant this trope. There is not a large portion of the reading audience that is offended by the points you make, as you seem to state yourself when prefacing with, “There have been occasional reviews”.
Additionally, the author has stated that this is not the final version of the story and a large edit will be done once it is completed, hence critiquing any edits still pending is premature.
Critiquing a one-off song used to create an ambience yourself is also misusing this trope.

3. Adhering to a singular writing style and tone is laudable, but, as I think I have shown, many of the changes that I made were in order to present a more holistic analysis of the story. At times, I do believe that calls for more charitable interpretations and not making judgements about where the author is going with something before they get there. If this is a site where someone can come and pick apart for fun an amateur’s writing style from ten years ago that hasn’t been edited professionally, then I think that there is a problem with the site and its culture and not my interpretation. We’re analysing a fanfic and that can be done well, but there is a human being at the other end of it and fans who love the story. What harm is there in being a bit more gracious in word choice while critiquing and analysing?

Further Comments:

Several of the tropes you bring up tie into canon aspects of Naruto and the Greek myth of Hades and Persephone. These tropes are problematic and dark at times, but crediting them fully to the author of Quietus as she is crafting a fusion fic and trying to do homage to both, is reductive. It should be made clear what are original plot points and which are being integrated and reworked.

In all honesty, I do not have a great deal of time to continue editing this page in any great detail, but I think that it is wildly unfair to the story, fans, and author to have left it as it was when I first encountered the page. I admire the effort put into parsing this story for tropes and would like to see this page be a clear and critical reading of these, while also being fair in its tone and presentation.

I would like to end on a few points. I think that, if this page is to be an appropriate and fair reading of the story, multiple points of view of the story and its themes need to be taken into consideration. Negative comments or interpretations should not be singled out and presented as the views of the entire fanbase, even if the YMMV section is not as formalised as the rest of the page. Additionally, a greater effort should be made to consider and present the context of the story and its development. Finally, the author’s privacy should be respected.

I do hope that this answered all your questions and that if we do continue to work on this together, we may do so amicably.
[009] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 01:15:47 PM
Changed line(s) 16 from:
n
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years.\
to:
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years.\\\" There is no deadline for each chapter of Quietus. Updates are provided in the author’s FF.net page and in author’s notes for each chapter, but these do not provide specific dates for chapter releases. Hence, this was a misapplication of the trope.

2.3. Arc Fatigue:
While I understand that some reviewers were impatient for the author to hurry up and get to the romance, a large section of the fandom enjoyed this arc greatly as it allowed the characters to grow to the point where it allowed for a *healthy* renewal of the SS relationship in the Relics arc. I think that both sides should be presented.

2.4. Serial Escalation:
The use of escalation and building of tension is for particular plot points and the fic is clearly rated M for mature and disturbing content. As the trope explanation clearly states, “This isn\\\'t meant to be confused with the buildup to season finales or a plot climax, but rather a consistent escalation in events that always exceeds what a viewer would expect.” Hence, I don’t see how this applies.

2.5. Unfortunate Implications
Once more I do not think that this trope applies as it doesn’t meet the criteria, i.e. “When a work\\\'s content offends a large enough audience in a way that the author did not expect, you get this.” Anonomous reviews (that are possibley posted by the same person) and a small number of criticisms of the work do not warrant this trope. There is not a large portion of the reading audience that is offended by the points you make, as you seem to state yourself when prefacing with, “There have been occasional reviews”.
Additionally, the author has stated that this is not the final version of the story and a large edit will be done once it is completed, hence critiquing any edits still pending is premature.
Critiquing a one-off song used to create an ambience yourself is also misusing this trope.

3. Adhering to a singular writing style and tone is laudable, but, as I think I have shown, many of the changes that I made were in order to present a more holistic analysis of the story. At times, I do believe that calls for more charitable interpretations and not making judgements about where the author is going with something before they get there. If this is a site where someone can come and pick apart for fun an amateur’s writing style from ten years ago that hasn’t been edited professionally, then I think that there is a problem with the site and its culture and not my interpretation. We’re analysing a fanfic and that can be done well, but there is a human being at the other end of it and fans who love the story. What harm is there in being a bit more gracious in word choice while critiquing and analysing?

Further Comments:

Several of the tropes you bring up tie into canon aspects of Naruto and the Greek myth of Hades and Persephone. These tropes are problematic and dark at times, but crediting them fully to the author of Quietus as she is crafting a fusion fic and trying to do homage to both, is reductive. It should be made clear what are original plot points and which are being integrated and reworked.

In all honesty, I do not have a great deal of time to continue editing this page in any great detail, but I think that it is wildly unfair to the story, fans, and author to have left it as it was when I first encountered the page. I admire the effort put into parsing this story for tropes and would like to see this page be a clear and critical reading of these, while also being fair in its tone and presentation.

I would like to end on a few points. I think that, if this page is to be an appropriate and fair reading of the story, multiple points of view of the story and its themes need to be taken into consideration. Negative comments or interpretations should not be singled out and presented as the views of the entire fanbase, even if the YMMV section is not as formalised as the rest of the page. Additionally, a greater effort should be made to consider and present the context of the story and its development. Finally, the author’s privacy should be respected.

I do hope that this answered all your questions and that if we do continue to work on this together, we may do so amicably.
[008] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 01:11:27 PM
Changed line(s) 16 from:
n
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years. There is no deadline for each chapter of Quietus. Updates are provided in the author’s FF.net page and in author’s notes for each chapter, but these do not provide specific dates for chapter releases. Hence, this was a misapplication of the trope.
to:
The Schedule Slip trope was not appropriate as the author has repeatedly stated that she is not beholden to any particular schedule. The Schedule Slips trope page clearly states that it applies to media “released late, from hours or days to months or (in a few notorious cases) years.\\\" There is no deadline for each chapter of Quietus. Updates are provided in the author’s FF.net page and in author’s notes for each chapter, but these do not provide specific dates for chapter releases. Hence, this was a misapplication of the trope.
[007] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 12:36:19 PM
Changed line(s) 39 from:
n
I do hope that this answered all your questions and that, if we do continue to work on this together, we may do so amicably.
to:
I do hope that this answered all your questions and that if we do continue to work on this together, we may do so amicably.
[006] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 12:36:08 PM
Changed line(s) 39 from:
n
I do hope that this answered all your questions and that if we do continue to work on this together, we may do so amicably.
to:
I do hope that this answered all your questions and that, if we do continue to work on this together, we may do so amicably.
[005] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 12:31:40 PM
Changed line(s) 29 from:
n
3. Adhering to a singular writing style and tone is laudable, but as I think I have shown many of the changes that I made were in order to present a more holistic analysis of the story. At times, I do believe that calls for more charitable interpretations and not making judgements about where the author is going with something before they get there. If this is a site where someone can come and pick apart for fun an amateur’s writing style from ten years ago that hasn’t been edited professionally, then I think that there is a problem with the site and its culture and not my interpretation. We’re analysing a fanfic and that can be done well, but there is a human being at the other end of it and fans who love the story. What harm is there in being a bit more gracious in word choice while critiquing and analysing?
to:
3. Adhering to a singular writing style and tone is laudable, but, as I think I have shown, many of the changes that I made were in order to present a more holistic analysis of the story. At times, I do believe that calls for more charitable interpretations and not making judgements about where the author is going with something before they get there. If this is a site where someone can come and pick apart for fun an amateur’s writing style from ten years ago that hasn’t been edited professionally, then I think that there is a problem with the site and its culture and not my interpretation. We’re analysing a fanfic and that can be done well, but there is a human being at the other end of it and fans who love the story. What harm is there in being a bit more gracious in word choice while critiquing and analysing?
[004] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 12:30:49 PM
[003] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 12:16:04 PM
Changed line(s) 1 from:
to:
[002] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 12:15:51 PM
Changed line(s) 31 from:
n
Several of the tropes you bring up tie into canon aspects of Naruto and the Greek myth of Hades and Persephone. These tropes are problematic and dark at times, but crediting them fully to the author of Quietus as she is crafting a fusion fic and trying to do homage to both, is reductive. It should be made clear what are original plot points and which are being integrated and reworked.
to:
Changed line(s) 32 from:
to:
Several of the tropes you bring up tie into canon aspects of Naruto and the Greek myth of Hades and Persephone. These tropes are problematic and dark at times, but crediting them fully to the author of Quietus as she is crafting a fusion fic and trying to do homage to both, is reductive. It should be made clear what are original plot points and which are being integrated and reworked.
[001] timewilltell
28th Dec '20 at 12:13:42 PM
Changed line(s) 1 from:
n
A. General Comments:
to:
General Comments:

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