Nippon Ichi (Disgaea, Makai Kingdom, etc.)

Yeah. The bill is the sticking point for me. If you haven't spent dozens of hours sucking up to those stupid parasites, all you'll unlock is a ~1% chance to unlock dual magichange. Yaaay!

As I said, I recall trying that before and getting nothing. I'll try it again (go go Fuka and Desco sisterly combo!) when I start again.

PREDIT: Ah, fused monster. That explains why it didn't work when I tried before. Fused monster makes sense actually, as you need a fused monster for Giant Magichange.

Of course, this will make things easier for Fuka and Desco, Valzy and Desco, and any other swordy and Desco. Maybe Fenrich and Desco if her own magichange move can work. Mostly Desco though.

...Desco is the only monster I have that is up to level!

...I am awful at this game.

REAL EDIT:And on top of that, dork assembly. Great. Well, I killed a level 900 guy when I forced Etna's bill. I can do anything! <famous last words>

edited 27th Sep '12 8:10:08 PM by Otherarrow

...You should be around and/or above the 1000s by then. You can basically bug spray them at that point.

edited 27th Sep '12 8:14:17 PM by Demonfly

I just buy a large amount of a certain type of item, and bribe certain reps over and over with those items until they love me. Of course this is D3, I have no idea how this works in D4.

Wait, so can I get Giant Magichange or not?

Because that is the bill we are talking about, yes?

For reference, my guys are all around the early 500s (Desco is at I think the 520s due to her wiping out gargolyes thanks to Final Boss Setting, but I want to have everyone strong enough so that they can all do that)

I'm pretty sure he was referring to the Dual Dojo, which actually does end up with a 1% approval rating. Fusion Weapon Lab is at a decent 25~%, IIRC, and is much more easily obtainable.

Gold bars are fairly hard to come by, and patting down is both annoying and uncertain to work. I for one just force the bills when I can / have to.

edited 27th Sep '12 8:41:20 PM by Demonfly

Ah OK.

Also, for more future reference, Mt. Ordeal 4 will do for my grinding needs for the rest of the game, yes? I can just use Stronger Enemies if the initial levels stop working for me, etc?

Because the set up alone is perfect for grinding. The reason I am not doing it yet is more problems on my end.

edited 27th Sep '12 8:27:20 PM by Otherarrow

Yeah pretty much. You can reach 9999 there no problem. Passing the stronger enemies bill works. Having a tier 5 professor around with the EXP evality helps reduce the amount of time you'd be grinding.

edited 27th Sep '12 8:29:13 PM by mega-dark

I kinda doubt you'd be willing to go on D4's LoC quest, so you should be fine up until you get to the last unlockable, Zetta. Max SEBs should take you up to a little more than 3000 tops w/o Statisticians.

Couldn't you also go to the Land Of Carnage version of Mt. Ordeals 4 and train there to level up your units fast? It's what I did in D3. (Traphezoidons an Guardians are SO useful!)

Again I am reminded that I want the professor, but I don't want to make and grind up the otherwise unwanted units I need to make her.

Still, this is good to know.

EDIT:I can barely make it through the X Dimension. The Land of Carnage will cream me. I will be content with the Cave of Ordeals for now. Even if they only go up to 3000 even with Strongest Enemies, hey! That's fine with me! I probably won't be that far for a long time!

edited 27th Sep '12 8:33:38 PM by Otherarrow

You'll likely get 2 Monsters or more at level 9999 because of Giant Magic change and if you keep switching the second monster out every so often you'll have monsters stronger than humans.

That reminds me, should I grind up a second monster before I Giant Magichange grind with Desco, or will just being part of Desco's Magichange bring it up to speed?

I admit, I do not know if both monsters get EXP for Giant Monster hijinks.

edited 27th Sep '12 8:51:54 PM by Otherarrow

They do. This means that you can build up your whole menagerie by fusing them with Desco.

The bonus from Wild Groom passes on as well, (albeit not for magichanges, sadly) so there's also that.

Huzzah! Now I can grind up my Succubus, Catsaber, Dragon, and Nekomata without having to put in any effort on their part!

Oh, this reminds me (somehow): Why is it the game refuses to let you delete certain generics? For example, through the process of capturing enemies and such, I ended up with a reaper guy that I really do not want, but the game refuses to let me delete him. I reincarnated him, thinking that was the trick, but the game still refuses to let me get rid of him.

EDIT: Wild Groom? That is the Beast Tamer thing, yes?

edited 27th Sep '12 8:56:48 PM by Otherarrow

That's been bugging me as well, so I decided to look into it. Apparently you should try to make sure the unit in question is not set up with anything important like pirate crews and such.

Also, yes.

edited 27th Sep '12 9:02:53 PM by Demonfly

I suspected as such.

However, the reaper in question isn't involved with anything. He isn't part of a pirate crew (though I'll probably double check just in case) he isn't part of a Evil Symbol, he has no equipment, etc.

One other thing - I know I was complaining about Des-X, but she's actually a really good fusion partner for Desco if you have her. Including Fuka in the Final Boss Setting makes her attack even more absurd.

Isn't she identical to Desco, only without Yog Sothoth, but with an extra Evility that boosts her stats when she is next to Fuka and Desco?

(Though I am not sure which Desco evility I'd give up to make room for it. Mana Scarcity is pretty good despite the trade off, and 3 Transformations is radtastic)

She is, yes. But that's the evility she'd pass on to be Desco's fourth when they fuse, which makes Final Boss Setting even stronger, see?

I dunno, Desco/Des-X fusion is what got me started on Mount Ordeal 4. Mileage may vary.

Oooh, I can see how that would be handy.

Also, a second Desco is not something I'd say no to. Desco rocks.

Speaking of second uniques I'd not say no to, how does Tyrant Valzy play? Is he to Valzy what Des-X is to Desco (as in, mostly the same) or what?

I really want to like her as a unit, but it's amazing how crippling it can be to be a monster with only two borderline obsolete attacks at her diposal, even if it is D4. (That, and she doesn't even have Desco's floating properties despite having the exact same animation. How did they miss that?)

Besides, I find my crew of stolen Beast Masters to be much more practical and all-purpose when it comes to making monster units like Desco into living WMDs.

She's literally just an all-around inferior Desco, unfortunately. The only thing she really adds stat-wise is the innate, which I also find detracting given that Final Boss Setting is all I really need for the original.

Ironically, T. Val all-but-invalidates Valvatorez, especially when it comes to movesets.

edited 27th Sep '12 9:37:37 PM by Demonfly

He is pretty much incredibly broken. His moves are basically wide-angle versions of Val's and one of his secondary evilities increases all stats by 20% for every ally adjacent to him on the Cam-pain HQ. His main evility increases weapon stats by 50%, but I don't know if it'd stack with 300% aptitude.

Ninja.

EDIT: Here we are.

edited 27th Sep '12 9:37:59 PM by Durazno

Wait, Des-X's unique evility replaces Final Boss Setting? That sucks

So Tyrant Valvatorez is basically Valvatorez, but somehow even better.

I am not sure how this is possible, as Valvatorez is pretty much the best unit in the game (Desco comes close). But it seems they pulled it off. Of course, it's worth noting that his specials are basically Valzy's specials but better, while his Evilitites are completely unique.

edited 27th Sep '12 9:42:22 PM by Otherarrow