The Falcon and the Winter Soldier

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. is on its way to being decanonized but at the moment, it was the most immediate response to Cap's decision.

Probably the most clear and direct middle finger, however, is Nick Fury and his S.H.I.E.L.D. Helicarrier literally showing up at the eleventh hour to save the day in Age of Ultron. Literally just shows up while Steve is lamenting the impossibility of the Avengers pulling off this massive evacuation they're trying and failing to undergo.

If Fury hadn't gone behind Steve's back to ignore his wishes in Winter Soldier, everyone would have died in Sokovia for Steve's unwillingness to leave before the evacuation was complete.

• Steve said, "End S.H.I.E.L.D."
• Fury said, "Eat shit."
• S.H.I.E.L.D. resources bailed Steve out of an unwinnable situation.
• Steve said, "This is what S.H.I.E.L.D. is supposed to be," all proud like it's not a direct middle finger pointed at him specifically.

Fury won the ideological debate over whether S.H.I.E.L.D. needed to be eradicated. He just did it in a follow-up movie rather than in the one the debate was held.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Mar 18th 2021 at 5:02:50 AM

After that SHIELD pretty much rarely showed up at all, and miles away from their former strength. In both Infinity War and Far From Home, they're barely a handful of people (and ambiguously either humans or Skrulls.)

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Mar 18th 2021 at 5:07:05 AM

That is one of Age of Ultron's weaknesses, but it is a different writing team. I will point out that past that movie the Helicarriers have not shown up. In fact Fury's one act in the later movies is calling Captain Marvel... which he probably should've done a bunch of other times.

That's true. But it doesn't change the fact that S.H.I.E.L.D.'s last major appearance within MCU canon, excluding the shows that are questionable at best, featured them triumphantly saving countless civilian lives from a deadly super-weapon the Avengers built.

Which is pretty much the exact opposite from what Winter Soldier was trying to say with, "S.H.I.E.L.D. and Hydra are two sides of a coin; they both need to go." Steve issued that statement, and the rest of the franchise was like, "WHOA MAN maybe let's walk that back a bit."

And now we have S.W.O.R.D., which is basically just being S.H.I.E.L.D. by any other name.

EDIT: And also, while its canonicity is questionable, Marvel did air like seven seasons of a show starring the "other side of the coin" from Hydra that Steve said is unsalvagably bad and must be thrown out. Steve's assessment of S.H.I.E.L.D. has a lot of rebuttals within the franchise, is what I'm saying.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Mar 18th 2021 at 5:11:27 AM

Well you've said your piece, I've said mine. I think we'll just go in circles if we keep arguing about it. Anyway I'm excited for tomorrow, it's been getting great reviews. I wonder about the direction they'll go with US Agent.

I wonder if they might make a mention of Joaquin Torres, the 2nd Falcon if Sam passes it down his identity.

Edited by slimcoder on Mar 18th 2021 at 5:35:26 AM

Honestly, there's a very good Alternate Character Interpretation that Coulson's show 100% proved what a flaming shit pile SHIELD was repeatedly. He was 100% devoted to it but the show repeatedly had him slamming up against more evil his organization did.

When he actually finally reassembled (hehe) SHIELD, his first encounter was Edward James Olmos saying, "Yeah, Hydra doesn't matter. Let's instead devote ourselves to destroying mutants...err, Inhumans."

And eventually they rebuild it but in alternate realities after cosmic battles with cosmic invaders that are very much not SHIELD's mandate. Because Coulson repeatedly demonstrated he wanted to run a superhero team not a government agency.

Mind you, I feel a nuance was lost from THE WINTER SOLDIER which is the Avengers REPLACED SHIELD.

They do that with open and honesty about their actions and no secrets.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Mar 18th 2021 at 9:43:04 AM

Except for Steve covering up the truth about how the Starks died.

Whoops.

Remember how Ghost’s backstory is about her as a little girl being taken by SHIELD and coerced into being an assassin for them?

Yep. Because Hydra and SHIELD are the same!

:)

(No one agrees)

As far as Ava knew it was SHIELD.

Anyway, Cool to see Batroc back.

Edited by Cortez on Mar 19th 2021 at 4:00:29 AM

That was dope.

Didn't expect Sam to just go full Just Cause there, but I am most definitely not complaining. Also glad to see just how much focus his home life got. Really hope some bird takes a shit on that banker's head when he leaves for the day. Or multiple birds, really. I assume of course the later episodes will probably be much more action focused, but as long as there's a healthy balance throughout with the domestic life I think I'll be very happy.

Poor Bucky. And poor Bucky's old friend whose name I didn't catch. And poor Bucky's date, whose name I also didn't catch, she seems like a sweet girl; hope Bucky went back/goes back to apologize to her. Also kinda hope there's not a second date, because I want nice things for her and people who are close to Bucky can't have that.

Overall, this episode readily soothed any misgivings I had from the initial teaser/trailer not exciting me. Don Cheadle / 10.

Edited by TheAirman on Mar 19th 2021 at 3:38:24 AM

It’s interesting seeing Sam reveal a mechanic side. He went from tinkering on boats to fixing up Redwing.

Also, at the Smithsonian Sam says people returned in the Blip “several months ago”, which means this show takes place after WandaVision, which was 3 weeks after Endgame.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Mar 19th 2021 at 2:08:59 AM

I wonder how they'll portray John Walker, his relationship with Sam will probably be antagonistic at first.

Oh wow they did bring in Torres. He’s Sam’s number 2.

Yeeesh Bucky is in the worst position ever. he no longer has to run or fight, it just leaves him alone with his own thoughts and everyday he’s constantly reminded of every horrible thing he’s done. Peace really is the worst state to be in for a guy like him.

Interesting first episode. Mostly set-up, but interesting.

I assumed Joaquin wasn't going to make it out of episode 1 alive, but I didn't realize he had a comic character behind him, so that beefs up his survival chances.

Saying they're going to put the shield in a museum and then giving it to New!Cap is a real scummy move.

Also kinda hesitant about the Flag-Smashers. In this current political climate, trying to "both sides" things just feels like giving benefit to the right. We'll see, I guess.

Edited by HalfFaust on Mar 19th 2021 at 10:36:35 AM

Given the context of the introduction, I'd say that's a guarantee. The introduction gave me strong "this is not a good thing" vibes.

Wyatt Russell Talks About John Walker and What He Means for Falcon and the Winter Soldier

I'm pretty sure Joaquin's gonna become Falcon by the end of this. Making him a military officer is definitely weird though, wonder if he has his comics backstory or not.

Hey, another Latino in the MCU. Yeah, if Sam's going to be Cap, someone has to be Falcon, right?

I do appreciate the everyday struggle Falcon and his family has. It feels quite new and down-to-earth.

eh, the stuff with Yori felt a little bit forced? So Bucky happens to live with the one old man whose son was killed by him a few years ago? lol give me a break.

Solid episode overall. I just hope they stop with the overly long marvel opening every single episode, it's starting to get old

Re: the SWORD point from earlier, Ross (and Tony) in Civil War expressed the idea that Hulk and Wanda were also considered weapons

So Sentient Weapon -> people with superpowers probably

No, Bucky purposefully seeked him out built a connection with Yori as his way of making amends. His name is on Bucky's list.

Edited by Nightwire on Mar 19th 2021 at 8:22:59 AM

Edit: what said.

It occurs to me Bucky is essentially Jason Bourne now

Edited by TheAirman on Mar 19th 2021 at 10:17:05 AM