Team Rocket Boss.
So Bunrei are technically both the person they were split from as well as their own individuals?
The whole concept is giving me a weird existential crisis again.
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
Submarine Chomper
From what I can understand with the "Bunrei"-concept, it's like the sci-fi concept of having a brain-scan made and then when activating it, that brain-scan is also the person it was made from but have the possibility to develop differently due to the circumstances it's put through in contrast to the different circumstances the other person is put through on a different way in life.
For example, give "Person A" a saxophone and "Brain-scan A2" a flute and plenty of time to practice, resulting in "Person A" mastering the saxophone but remaining a complete beginner on the flute, while "Brain-scan A2" mastering the flute but remaining a beginner on the saxophone, despite both of them being the same person and fully capable of mastering both instruments if given the opportunity to do so.
Something like this?
Edited by Trainbarrel on Apr 27th 2024 at 9:46:49 PM
"If there's problems, there's simple solutions."
Team Rocket Boss.
Yeah, I was just thinking about how the Bunrei concept was unintentionally used via the brain scan method with Superior Spider-Man.
Like, that comic ends with Doc Ock mentally erasing himself so that Spider-Man can regain his body.
But since it's comics, no popular villain is allowed to stay dead, so there was a whole time travel story that reveals Doc Ock backed up his brainwaves into an A.I. copy using 2099 technology then that copy eventually reactivated after 100 days after the finale of Superior, then that copy uses cloning tech to gain a body, basically reviving Doctor Octopus. He's treated as the same Doc Ock brought back but he also lacks knowledge of the original Doc Ock's memories from after he was backed up, which is basically the ending of Superior, which lets him go back to a more antagonistic mindset towards Spider-Man.
It's pretty fitting since the author of MHA has stated Superior Spider-Man is one of his favorite comic book runs of all time. I've said numerous times on the main forum that I've seen lots of parallels with MHA and Superior.
Edited by RedHunter543 on Apr 28th 2024 at 3:51:09 AM
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
Thinking on it more, I don't think I see Deku losing One For All sticking. If so, it would mean that all the effort and sacrifice of trying to "overload" Shigaraki, or whatever you want to call it, with the Vestiges pointless, and I don't really imagine that ending up being the case.
But I could just be missing something here. *shrug*
The whole concept is giving me a weird existential crisis again.
On the bright side, that means if Deku does redeem AFO's vestige, the original AFO still remains a Complete Monster since AFO's vestige is technically its own separate person.
Submarine Chomper
The Vestige of AFO in question is the original AFO, since the quirk in AFO's body was a copy made from this one put into Shigaraki.
So in short, what they are up against is the Original AFO, while the Clone is the one who got the massive beating previously until it ceased to exist.
"If there's problems, there's simple solutions."
Team Rocket Boss.
Wait, what?
As I understood it, the quirks only contain some part of the person which is where the bunrei concept comes in.
Flesh All for One losing his original quirk in favor of an artificial one would be more akin to a necromancy putting a part of his soul in a phylactery.
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Huh, that would make AFO a lich then, which fits with his appearance in the latest chapter.
Submarine Chomper
Considering how he went so far to make Shigaraki the "next AFO", he clearly wouldn't rely on an "inferior copy" of himself to be put into him.
It was even brought up in Flesh AFO's fight as he struggled to contain his prisoner vestiges due to "All For One" being an inferior copy of what he used to have.
Which is also why I called the Original AFO we're seeing right now a "ghost".
Edited by Trainbarrel on Apr 27th 2024 at 5:05:17 PM
"If there's problems, there's simple solutions."
Team Rocket Boss.
I thought the plan was to make a new combination of himself and Shigaraki to be the next him?
Because he needs Shigaraki's emotional range to steal OFA. So I see both versions of AFO as the real deal, heck, it's the flesh AFO that tells Shigaraki for One to chill in the aftermath of that arc.
I see it as my necromancer example, the necromancer puts a part of his soul in the phylactery in order to revive himself once his flesh runs out of time.
If either AFO was truly a clone, then they wouldn't be able to have that connection to each other, like All Might did with his vestige in Deku, ergo both AFO are the real ones.
EDIT: Besides, simply losing your quirk doesn't cost you your identity, they are described as a part of someone's soul but not the entire thing, otherwise AFO's victims should be soulless shells.
Yeah, if you wanna get technical you could argue that Shigaraki killed a part of AFO's soul when he initially broke free, then when flesh AFO died the rest of the soul went to Shigaraki's body and is the version we are seeing now. Kind of like how phylactery works.
Edited by RedHunter543 on Apr 27th 2024 at 11:18:03 PM
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
Submarine Chomper
What do you mean?
AFO cloning himself is basically no different from how starfish does it when cut in half. Same person, same memories, two different outcomes.
So Flesh AFO being a clone of himself through his quirk getting cut apart and cultivated in a lab while the other half recovers doesn't make them a completely different person.
Edited by Trainbarrel on Apr 27th 2024 at 5:41:28 PM
"If there's problems, there's simple solutions."
Team Rocket Boss.
Yeah but losing a quirk doesn't render you an empty shell, so flesh AFO having a copy of his own quirk wouldn't really mean he's a copy of himself is what I'm getting at. Since the things that make up who he is like memories and brain are what his flesh self has, not the vestige.
If anything, since quirks show up later in your life, I'd argue that vestige AFO is the clone if we're using your comparison.
How AFO explains things at the start of season 7, indicates that quirks contain part of a person, not the entire persona.
Edited by RedHunter543 on Apr 27th 2024 at 11:48:50 PM
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
Submarine Chomper
I suspect that AFO's quirk alone have been acting as his back-up brain through the Vestige ever since All Might obliterated everything above his mouth (cranium, eyes, nose, brain...) by a punch in that fight years before the plot started in the story.
I mean, All Might did think the man was dead after that fight for a good reason.
Edited by Trainbarrel on Apr 27th 2024 at 6:49:56 PM
"If there's problems, there's simple solutions."
Garaki has already shown a capability of reviving people, and has stuffed quirks into corpses to make brain dead minion Noumu by going past the bodies capacity to handle quirks. You don’t need someone’s original quirk to revive them.
Edited by OmegaRadiance on Apr 27th 2024 at 10:28:55 AM
Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.
Team Rocket Boss.
Yeah, I just assume Garaki resuscitated All for One the mundane way. Well mundane for Garaki at least.
I'll teach you a lesson about just how cruel the world can be. That's my job, as an adult.
Weirdly enough I kind of thought of them sort of like Bioshocks "ghosts", in effect.