The Defeat of W.I.T.C.H and the rise of western magical girls.

First I want to explain that this isn't a complaint thread. Also This isn't just about W.I.T.C.H but of the whole western genre hence the reason I opened a new thread.

I think I must say I am really confused about the failure of W.I.T.C.H. Yes its comic was huge in Europe in Italy and Europe ( though its run ended years ago). But for all intents an purposes it has faded to obscurity while its biggest rival Winx club has commercially succeded. Winx club still has new episode episodes at nickelodeon and a Netflix deal.W.I.T.C.H only managed two seasons with hardly any reruns.

Sure you might like it better, that's subjetive. But Commercially W.I.T.C.H, specially its cartoon, did fail to be the powerhouse Sailor moon and Winx are ( that's objetive).

W.I.T.C.H was supposed to be a big hit. It had had a colorful cast, a great writer in Greg Weisman and great art style.

So, why did it fail to catch the interest of kids and teens while Ladybug and Winx succeeded? What does it tell us about the future of Western Magical Girls?.

I would like to hear your thoughts.

edited 2nd Oct '16 11:42:31 PM by FallenLegend

Maybe Disney is reluctant to milk its TV shows, or maybe Greg Weisman is just cursed to never get to do a third season.

In the US at least, Winx aired on the Saturday morning cartoon bloc on basic television. Anyone with a TV could tune in to watch it. W.I.T.C.H. aired around the same time also on the Saturday cartoon bloc but on a cable channel not normally geared towards the demographic that wouldn't watch W.I.T.C.H. So from the start the deck was stacked against W.I.T.C.H., with Winx Club having a far vaster audience.

Incidentally, that's why I never watch past the middle of the first season when it aired. By the time I did have the channel it aired on, it had already been canceled, and moved to another channel were it aired around midnight, ensuring that reruns never attracted renewed interest in the show.

I'm not really sure but I have heard news about an upcoming one.

x2

There's that plus the fact that from my understanding (because I've only seen the show) the comic books for W.I.T.C.H. were just plain better than the show but unfortunately in the US, with the exception of the first 16 which were released as graphic novels, the comics were only released as snippits with the novel series.

I don't even remember Disney Channel Latin America ever showing it in the first place. I assumed that was an indication of how much faith and effort they put on the franchise to begin with.

Basically, Disney will show little to no interest on promoting and selling anything that isn't directly tied in to their major motion pictures, a tween sitcom, or a really big surprise sleeper hit (like Phineas & Ferb).

Disney is generally not terribly hot to promote anything they don't outright own. Which begs the question, why license stuff if that's your attitude?

Anyhow, I remember seeing a little of this series. It was on in the early morning, I think on Sundays in my area, and never rerun at all to my knowledge. In the era of Cartoon Network and Nickelodeon and Toon Disney (don't remember if Toon Disney existed then), airing a show once a week and never rerunning it isn't a particularly good way to build viewers. As to the comics, I never saw them. Comics readership has been, for awhile now, smaller in the US that in nearly any other market that carries comics.

You license stuff because you need to fill space in your lineup and your original programming doesn't quite fit.

Although that's a separate problem for children's networks, who have a wealth of vintage content but refuse to air it for some reason. Cartoon Network, Disney, and Nickelodeon could all support whole channels with their backlogs (excluding the really old stuff CN and Disney have access to), but instead fill the lineup with half-promoted licensed shows and endless reruns of whatever's current.

It was a lack of promotion it seems. I was trying to figure out a failure in the plot, guess that wasn't the reason.

My question was, why would Disney license it? As you say, they have a wealth of their own stuff they could use as filler, if filler was what they wanted, at little or no cost to them. From what I understand, W.I.T.C.H was an Italian comic book, the animated series was co-produced by Jetix Europe (which was Disney owned). This last actually answers my question, as it seems that the series was mainly intended for European audience, where it was very successful. I imagine they tried it out in the US to see if it'd take hold and, for whatever reason, it didn't.

W.I.T.C.H was very anime/manga influenced, and the animated series felt very "franime" (which is a term used by animation types to describe the plethora of French-produced animesque shows, like Totally Spies, Martin Mystery and others). It's failure could be attributed to poor marketing and promotion, or to the fact that often American anime/manga fans tend to prefer anime and manga only if it's actually Japanese.

I know in my case, I never watched W.I.T.C.H for one simple reason: It was never on, at least not where I lived in Canada. Winx Club was on at a consistent time every Saturday, and I time I was up by. The only time I was able to watch an episode of W.I.T.C.H was a rerun of one of the last episodes. I had absolutely no idea what was going on so I didn't bother.

Honestly, I think the art direction might have been part of the problem with it catching on in the West. Wynx Club is very Toyetic in appearance, while WITCH's costumes, going by our works page image, are kind of drab and muted, in a way that neither pushes fashion dolls or action figures. And the main purpose of any cartoon is to push merch, so that's kinda an issue.

That said, if the show came out now, I think...well, okay, I think now it would probably be hit dead on by the fact that action cartoons are out of fashion unless they can be sold as a comedy.

If the goal was to sell merchandise the only real difference would have been the age group targeted since the comics already existed.

Going to agree with the point that it was hard to catch it when it aired.

I should get around to watching a magical girl show since I haven't seen much of any. I'll probably get around to WITCH at some point, but how is Winx Club? And are there any other magical girl shows worth watching?

Star Vs The Forces Of Evil

it's shit now. i highly recommend avoiding it at all cost.

There's your answer.

Let's be real here, he's a great writer but the man is cursed to have all of his shows cancelled for whatever reason.

edited 4th Oct '16 7:24:38 PM by Soble

Winx's first 3/4 seasons are great. Rest is crap.

For all its strengths and weaknesses, Winx always felt like it was actively promoting some sort of new toy to sell. W.I.T.C.H didn't push that as hard, and with these cartoons the merch always wins. Winx is still going now because it's able to keep selling new toys. It also helps that Winx is Rainbow's top brand, so they're going to keep pushing it. I don't think W.I.T.C.H was that important to anyone.

W.I.T.C.H. Season 2 — "The ABC Saga" — is still one of my favorite seasons ever.

For real. I remember going through season one in about a week. It wasn't horrible, but it didn't leave a strong impression either. In contrast, I downed season two in about a couple of days.

Also, for a Weisman show (or season, rather), it had a very satisfying ending. Sure, there were some subtle teases for future arcs for a season three, but the story felt complete, for the most part.

edited 6th Oct '16 12:14:12 AM by GamerSlyRatchet

I recall reading once where Mark Evanier, speaking about the old Dungeons and Dragons cartoon, said no one working on a cartoon went in expecting the chance to "end" it. It was just much, much more common that a show was abruptly cancelled, or not renewed. I've heard voice actors say the same thing, that it was a common experience to go into work and be told that it'd be their last session for that particular show. So Weisman's hardly alone in getting shows cancelled out from under him.

I disagree with Greg being cursed. Spectacular Spider Man was supposedly doing well, but fell victim to the Disney-Marvel merger.

Sometimes, shows just fail to catch on. It is what it is.

Specifically, it was a victim to Sony trading in the television rights just so they could keep the movie rights.

Considering how well Sony's Amazing Spider-Man movies came out, I'm sure the sacrifice was worth it, right?

I liked WITCH but never got a chance to read the comics. What arcs woulc have been included in the show assuming it continued? Also, I hear Matt and Caleb are apparently more useful in the show than they are in the comics.

The season finale featured cameos by Riddle and Sylla, who are the girls' foes in the next arc after Nerissa, so probably that. I could've see them having a bigger role than in the comics.

Yeah, it was pretty cool to see Caleb get more to do and Matt actually doing stuff besides just being a love interest.