Yahari Ore no Seishun Love Come wa Machigatteiru

After watching the latest episode, could someone clarify something for me about Hina?

The job she gave to Hachiman & co. was basically to stop Tobe from confessing to her in order to keep the status quo among her group. After the job was completed, She tells Hachi that she's not ready to change herself yet and she's happy with the way things are right now, but because she's not ready to change, she actually hates herself. Is that what she was saying? If so, why exactly would she be so self-loathing because of that?

The subs translated that convo too literally she calls herself 'rotten to the core' which was referring to being a Fujoshi (Fujoshi literally means 'Rotten Girl'.) and being in a relationship with one of the guys who she ships would ruin that.

Basically she is akin to being an otaku who chooses 2d over 3d denying any relationship with a real person but hates himself for living in that delusion.

edited 11th Apr '15 1:44:33 PM by Memers

Yeah, she's basically a self-hating otaku.

Thanks for explaining that. Makes her motivation a bit more clear to me now.

From what i could infer, the self-loathing is a result of her selfish desire to maintain the status quo at the cost of any opportunity to develop relationships and sabotaging Tobe's attempt to grow out of the status quo. Or something along those lines.

I understand the concept when I think about it in my head but trying to explain it is difficult.

No, she says she's rotten and there's the whole fujoshi thing, but... This author is very fond of double-meanings and that's the surface interpretation, so that's probably wrong. It's either a general teenager self-loathing (basically no one in the main cast has good self-esteem, so she has plenty of company) or a more specific thing we aren't necessarily aware of; as she says herself, Hikigaya doesn't really care about her, so we have no real reason to know.

Pretty confident it's not down to her being a fujoshi, though.

Any relationship (with a guy) she gets into will just crash and burn because of her...interests. Or at least that's what she believes. Plus it's going to make things awkward afterward, so she'd rather cherish what she has and maintain the status quo.

Yeah, I can't help but feel that this isn't the correct interpretation of the scene. It's not that she avoids relationships because she's really into man on man action (feel free to brand me a hater but I don't think that's an actual, legitimate sexual identity.)

Everything in how it was said, her expressions, etc. were shouting that there's something more fundamental behind that and that the whole fujoshi thing is an interest that's maybe used to mask other insecurities. She makes a show of it to keep others at an arms length.

So yes, she used the word rotten as a nod to her fujoshi nature, but not to signify that it's her core issue or true nature.

Basically what's said there.

I feel like I'm missing something really stupid and obvious, but why did everybody hate Hikigaya's solution?

I barely even remember the premise of this show, I guess I'll have to look it up.

Because he committed what is basically social suicide in order to keep others happy.

Is that literally it? I thought there was something else to it that I wasn't picking up on.

He really only screwed himself with that one guy, everyone else there knew exactly what and he did what he did.

Honestly it was light compared to what happened last season.

He was aware of Yui's affection towards him on some level, and he pretty much disregarded her feelings in favor of a person who he's not even half as close to. It's a messed up way to treat your friends.

Yukino was also kinda pissed for almost the same reasons. He sacrificed himself for a shallow group he barely knows. He didn't take into account how his friends would feel seeing him hurt. Also, he solved the problem in a "dishonest" matter. She would've preferred a solution wherein everything was solved including the issues with Hayato's group's dynamics, but Hachiman used a solution that in a sense did fix things, but it also managed not to solve the most pressing issue. He made a solution which promoted the shallowness of their group.

Hachiman himself said in season 1 he hated dishonesty and falseness, which is why he felt like a liar and was disgusted with what he'd don at the end of the episode.

And personally, I think the reason Hina hates herself is that she can't seem to express herself in front of her friends. Thus, she acts like a fujoshi to maintain her "role". She recognizes that all this is doing is making the group interaction even more fake, yet she enjoys it that way. That makes her "hate" herself.

I think it's even worse now. The people who care about him are hurt by it this time. At least last time they recognized the need for it and gave it a pass. This time they're beginning to see that it's the only way he knows how to solve things which is bothering them.

edited 13th Apr '15 12:39:01 AM by Jigaboo

In short, Yui had to see the guy she's fond of make a fake confession and Yukino had to watch Hikigaya sacrifice his ideals which is arguably worse.

Hikgaya used to put Yukino on a pedestal for never lying, but now it turns out she was doing something similar to him. He hated fake people but he sacrificed himself to preserve superficial relationships he didn't even like.

Or so I interpret it.

Hikigaya used Tobe's problem as a pretext to create an atmosphere in which Yui couldn't possibly confess to him, preserving the status quo in the Service Club; that's a violation of his philosophy on shallow relationships (see his talk with Hayato earlier in the ep), so he was upset with himself. Yui's upset both because he's thinking of Tobe's feelings as a problem to solve and because she didn't want to see him confessing to anyone else, hence her "think about how other people feel" afterwards. Yukino is upset because Yui is upset and she also suspects that Hikigaya was using a pretext to keep things static in the group, which she finds equally offensive. Hayato is upset because he knew Hikigaya's solution would inevitably have some consequence on the Service Club but relied on him anyway.

edited 13th Apr '15 7:31:32 AM by Einander

Episode 2. In which he confesses.

Happy sister. Really shows that siblings are either alike, or one of them steals one trait from all the others.

Yay.

That haunted house is good for the girls. Not sure the boys appreciate it as much. Well, in the first group. The second...

As they say on Danbooru, "Varying Degrees of Want". Good reactions. Can't even say which I like more.

Is helping someone up so significant? Even for him?

Not exactly that perceptive about some people, and not exactly polite to some people, but she does seem to care about her friends. Sort of.

Had she planned on eating all of that on her own? And this isn't just the smörgåsbord effect, where a little bit of a lot of things become a lot of things.

This looks more like an ambush than anything else.

Trust him to do something no one expects.

I can emphasise with Yuki there.

I think the reason she gives is probably the best thing she's said. Not entirely sure why I think that.

Also not entirely sure why the cat would be so sensible and run away from her.

As for a deeper analyses, after reading the thread, I pretty much interpreted it the same as most/some people above.

And three lines up, because it was one of the more honest things she's said. Nothing extreme, just being honest with who's probably the one person she can be that with, since she knows he doesn't care anyway. It's not going to affect her relationship with people. Him included (or at least not in a negative way). He's a stranger who isn't a stranger. Well, not completely honest, but close enough for her.

Still think Yui should grow a pair to have any room to complain, though.

The budget upgrade is doing wonders, the episode was beautiful. Though visuals aside, it still was beautiful. There was this brief shot of the bamboo grove and you could hear Hachiman sigh, and it was a sigh dripping with exasperation and self-loathing. Props to the voice actor for that one.

Pretty much also agree with everyone's analysis. Hachiman's too kind for his own good.

Just a question

Has anyone actually read through the currently translated novels from 1 to 10.5 or are you all just animeonly secondaries?

cuz judging from the previous posts you guys have only ever talk about the anime even though the L Ns are all translated bar the *.5 ones

Anime-only here. Never read an LN.

I've read everything translated so far. It's kind of fun to put the blinders up and consider the material in isolation, though, so I'm fine with this staying anime-only discussion.

For some reason after the new episode I'm starting to like Yukinoshita onee-san. Not really sure what to feel about Iroha at this point.

As for the L Ns I've read up to the beginning of volume 4 so far.

I've read the light novels, but there's no need to be elitist and exclude half the people in this thread.

That aside, Iroha's here. It begins.

Also Hachiman acts a little destructively this episode. It almost feels like he wants to burn all his close relationships.

I've read the L Ns myself. It would be inconsiderate to talk about future plot points while other people try to enjoy the anime. Tone down the buzzwords dude.

If you looked a page back, you'd see that we've disussed the novels in passing.

Harunooooooooooooo. She's baaaaaaack. Looking forward to her meddling. Mai Nakahara has some pretty good range.

edited 17th Apr '15 11:20:53 PM by Jigaboo

Episode 3. In which nothing much happens.

That breakfast scene makes me realise I like Komachi's voice.

Completely not awkward.

Kind of obvious plan. Kind of obvious reaction to it. I also kind of wonder who she really plans to help.

She's always fun.

Yeah, those are scary words, especially coming from her. "I'm bored."

Why not just say she's his personal troll? Well, that'd be honest, and we can't have that...

Everyone's so casually condescending to him. Not that that's anything new.

Lots of quiet steaming, and not a lot of actually talking about it. Standard problem. And it's especially ineffective against someone who resists change.

And yeah, Haruno's also got a nice voice.

I do like these bits where Hachiman is stuck between a rock and a scary girl. And now we have Haruno and Iroha. Both smiling the whole time.