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Troper Fencing Academy:

 76 Mr AHR, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:40:45 AM from ಠ_ಠ Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
I know the sword is naturally light. I can read. I just like the mental image.

Plus, I thought football players are not what you would call within standard deviation.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:41:29 AM by MrAHR

 77 Madass Alex, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:41:33 AM from the Middle Ages.
I am vexed!
Alex, can you tell me what major schools of European swordsmanship exist and what are their characteristics?

Oh man.

Can I just do a few?

There's so many. [lol]

I'll go over the most notable examples of each, I think.

  • Longsword
    • Efficiency and brutality. Longsword is the European battlefield sword.
    • German longsword is all about FUCK SHIT UP DUDE. You're always on the attack, and by doing so you remove the ability for your adversary to strike at you. That is your protection. Pure bloodletting.
    • Italian longsword is similar to German, given that Liechtenauer is also the major influence on this style. Its stances and methods are a little more conservative and take self-preservation into account a little more. It strikes me as more of a dueling art than a battlefield art.

  • Single Sword
    • I'm not really very knowledgable about this, since I'm mostly a longsword dude, but you've got English and Scottish as the major styles here. They're very similar, but the Scottish style focuses on diagonal lines of defense rather than horizontal/vertical, and the Scottish style also later adapted to battlefield dual-wielding. Single-sword is generally less ruthless than longsword, but a bit more footworky and perhaps a bit more tricksy.

  • Rapier and X
    • Rapier combat is taught on its own, with a buckler and/or with an off-hand dagger.
    • German and Italian rapier were the children of the longsword styles mentioned above and are quite similar, with some interjections from single-sword. Due to the limitations of the weapon, however, they're more conservative and restrained.
    • There's also Spanish rapier, which looks reasonable to me, but in reading some of the texts the theory behind it is quite different. I can't say I understand it just yet.

There are a variety of different weapons, too, but these are the three main ones and the most widely-taught. These, especially longsword, can give you a grounding in other weapons as well. Longsword in particular is like a combination of single-sword, sword-and-shield and polestaff.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:46:39 AM by MadassAlex

 78 Kinkajou, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:41:49 AM from you're not your
Red
@Erock: But Sweden was too much of a renegade. tongue
"Tumblr. Showing us why it's bad to enjoy things since 2007." - joeyjojo
 79 Madass Alex, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:43:20 AM from the Middle Ages.
I am vexed!
On sword weight, the heaviest usable swords were about 2.5kg. Any heavier was considered dumb.

2kg on a single-hander? Get outta here. You don't want much more than 1kg, and honestly around 600-800g is ideal.

The only time 2.5kg+ was acceptable was on those huge, 5-6 foot long zweihanders because of the leverage of the hilts.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:44:22 AM by MadassAlex

Proud Canadian
@AHR: In that case, that would be funny. And dangerous.

@Kink: True, but so were Trondheimers.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:43:44 AM by Erock

If you don't like a single Frank Ocean song, you have no soul.
 81 Mr AHR, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:44:01 AM from ಠ_ಠ Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
Erock: Exactly.

Hey look! six foot long sword! —swing—

—crash—
 82 Milos Stefanovic, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:44:23 AM from White City, Ruritania
Decemberist
Ah-ha. Thanks, Madass!
The sin of silence when they should protest makes cowards of men.
Proud Canadian
Hopefully no limbs were lopped off.

@Alex: Don't forget the wCeltic/Norse school of one handed swordsmanship.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:45:12 AM by Erock

If you don't like a single Frank Ocean song, you have no soul.
 84 Kinkajou, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:44:50 AM from you're not your
Red
I prefer smaller swords.
"Tumblr. Showing us why it's bad to enjoy things since 2007." - joeyjojo
Proud Canadian
This http://wweapons.blogspot.com/2009/01/arming-sword-nights-or-nightly-sword.html

is what I would use.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:46:59 AM by Erock

If you don't like a single Frank Ocean song, you have no soul.
 86 Milos Stefanovic, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:47:03 AM from White City, Ruritania
Decemberist
It's never the weight itself that's the problem, but its layout across the length of the sword, which is necessary for balance.

[up]That one looks nice. I've never been a type for two-handers, nor sissy almost-daggers.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:48:30 AM by MilosStefanovic

The sin of silence when they should protest makes cowards of men.
 87 Madass Alex, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:47:31 AM from the Middle Ages.
I am vexed!
The Celtic/Germanic/Norse schools of one-handed swordsmanship existed, but there are no texts we can draw on today. Sadly, all we can do is have educated speculation on what they might've been like.

^ Yar. You want the weightiest bit of the sword to be in the blade, a few inches out from the hilt.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:48:11 AM by MadassAlex

 88 Mr AHR, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:47:46 AM from ಠ_ಠ Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
Milos: Really? Could you elaborate? For the sake of research? What would it be like to hold a six foot sword like the Zwi?

edited 13th Jul '11 8:49:44 AM by MrAHR

Proud Canadian
@Alex: We could just get a whole bunch of Norwegians drunk and see what they come up with when encoutnering a sword for the first time.tongue
If you don't like a single Frank Ocean song, you have no soul.
 90 Madass Alex, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:50:28 AM from the Middle Ages.
I am vexed!
^^ Basically, having the weight out a few inches along the blade from the hilt supports your strikes and ensures that you strike with greater force. It also makes it easier to use the energy of enemy strikes for counter-striking. You might do this when you parry to stop their sword, but allow the strength of their strike to move your sword around and then turn that into a counter-attack.

^ Horrible death? [lol]

edited 13th Jul '11 8:50:47 AM by MadassAlex

Proud Canadian
[up]No, I mean what kind of motions they would use.
If you don't like a single Frank Ocean song, you have no soul.
 92 Mr AHR, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:51:49 AM from ಠ_ಠ Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
Alex: But what's it like to hold one? If you're not used to it?
 93 Madass Alex, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:53:18 AM from the Middle Ages.
I am vexed!
If you're not used to it, it's kinda awkward. The weight is forward when you tilt the sword forward, so it's almost like the sword has a will of its own. Like it's begging to strike out. It's also really difficult to control strikes at first because of that balance.

(But it's pretty awesome when you get used to it.)

edited 13th Jul '11 8:53:32 AM by MadassAlex

Away on the wind~
What would it be like to hold a six foot sword like the Zwi?

Have you ever held a mop? One that's generally along the lines of 500g?

Well, the Zwie would generally weigh five times that or more. Very likely more.

You have a lot of weight immediately near the handle, which will strain your wrists to hold it outstretched for too long, and you also have to compensate for the tip, which, at six feet away from you, wants to lower itself to the ground.

I wouldn't say it's so much heavy as it is really awkward to hold upright, and it puts a lot of strain on your arms.

This is just talking about holding it, though, I should specify. Using it is a whole different ballpark.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:55:10 AM by CyganAngel

There are too many toasters in my chimney!
 95 Kinkajou, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:55:25 AM from you're not your
Red
Indeed. Sometimes the problem isn't weight per se but distribution - I find it easier carrying a bag than a block of the same weight.
"Tumblr. Showing us why it's bad to enjoy things since 2007." - joeyjojo
 96 Mr AHR, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:55:52 AM from ಠ_ಠ Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
Thank y'all kindly. waii
 97 Milos Stefanovic, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:56:54 AM from White City, Ruritania
Decemberist
@AHR: The hilt serves to hold the weight of the blade itself, so the length of the hilt should be proportional to the length of the blade. For those reasons, the mass of the parts of the blade should get progressively smaller between the point closest to the hilt and the point. Since the sword's center of gravity is on the hilt, really long swords cannot be held by one hand, regardless of the weight. Simple physics.

Sorry for the slight delay.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:57:43 AM by MilosStefanovic

The sin of silence when they should protest makes cowards of men.
 98 Madass Alex, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:57:14 AM from the Middle Ages.
I am vexed!
To elaborate on what Cygan said, this essentially means that you'd be using high diagonal and vertical strikes only. Horizontal and rising strikes would be too tiresome and awkward.
 99 Mr AHR, Wed, 13th Jul '11 8:58:05 AM from ಠ_ಠ Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
really long swords cannot be held by one hand, regardless of the weight.

evil grin Eeeeexcellent.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:58:19 AM by MrAHR

Away on the wind~
I can never remember all the terms while writing, either.
There are too many toasters in my chimney!
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