The New Touhou Character Alternate Interpretation Compendium!

The way I'm picturing it, Mamizou was/is moderately fond of Nue, but Nue considered the two of them to have a special bond as masters of shape-shifting prankery

Mamizou would have to be pretty damned moderately fond of her to abandon her life and coming running to Gensoyko when called.

I think Mamizou may have been bored

It's not like she didn't have family back in Sado. No matter how bored you might be it isn't easy to drop everything and leave your ancestral home.

edited 17th Oct '12 6:19:46 PM by Clarste

I wonder, how did they meet? I am thinking they must have been very close before Nue got sealed if Mamizou dropped everything and came running when Nue called her.

I can absolutely see Mamizou treating Nue like a little sister, even more so than the other Temple members.

Maybe Mamizou helped her escape from Genzanmi Yorimasa, way back when.

Like, I sort of have the mental image of Nue being hunted by the guy, and Mamizou transforming a leaf pierced by a stray arrow into a body-double of Nue's current form, fooling Yorimasa into believing that he had slain a Nue.

And thus, the legend.

edited 17th Oct '12 6:41:11 PM by Enlong

And then Nue went to hide in the underworld until it all blew over?

...hurm.

...huh. I was under the impression that she'd been sealed underground, but according to her profile, she went underground of her own accord?

edited 17th Oct '12 6:49:19 PM by Enlong

According to Akyuu, the creature that was involved in that wasn't even a Nue. She was framed!

By Mamizou, perhaps? The classical nue had the body of a tanuki...

"You are an amazing prankster, getting me so good! Teach me your ways!"

Quick thing on the topic of Kishin again. Komachi talks about sending Kishin in terms of "you yourself might see them someday", as if they haven't yet sent them after Kasen, but Kasen talks about having fought back servants of Hell in the past, so what gives?

Poor innocent chimera. Also, apparently the bow of Yorimasa for sale in Kourindou is a fake. I wonder if Nue has the real one.

Probably the testing reapers.

I think Akyuu's main point is that the true identity of a nue is something far more mysterious than the rather silly "Japanese chimera" with the tail of a snake and all that.

...I don't even see how that creates any sort of contradiction in the first place? Also, I think you're overestimating how often they're sending these Kishin. It's not like there are whole armies of these things or anything. Rather than "servants of Hell" they'd be closer to "leaders of Hell". Upper management anyway. Kishin of course means "oni god" and Suiki himself was a Kishin chief. A leader among oni gods. Given that Suiki is part of a set of four different elemental oni, it wouldn't be surprising if those 4 were the only Kishin chiefs. He is by no means a low-ranking minion. People like Seiga are rare, so sending people like Suiki would be an extraordinary measure.

Also, Komachi was stopping to correct herself after she said that one might come after Kasen, and Kasen's next line was that their conversation gave no indication whatsoever about what would happen to her in particular. This is of course further evidence that she's not human, and Komachi temporarily forgot that while talking. I must admit though that I translated Kasen's line pretty terribly. It's supposed to be super-poignant.

edited 17th Oct '12 7:08:12 PM by Clarste

My take on Mamizou coming to Gensokyo:

For a classical youkai, living in the modern world is tough. All classical youkai in Japan know that eventually they'll either make the journey to Gensokyo, or else they cease being what they are (they die, become modern youkai, or like the tanuki of Sado, become humans). It's exactly the same situation as Tolkien's elves. Besides, Gensokyo is constantly calling for youkai (P Mi SS, Yukari's entry).

So for Mamizou, entering Gensokyo is something she/he had to do, sooner or later.

EDIT: I'm now picturing a road movie starring a bunch of youkai (or a youkai family) on their way to Gensokyo.

edited 17th Oct '12 10:23:28 PM by atrican

Guys! Ohmygod! This is amazing! You know how you pointed out the similarities between Heian Alien and U.N. Owen was Her? Well, listen to Nue's theme, then Sanae's, then Nue's again. Zun took a few bars from Faith for Nue's theme, as well as U.N Owen!

...Well, I thought it was pretty cool when I found out...

Anyway, she does seem a bit like Sanae; another bewildered newcomer to Gensokyo, excited to have arrived but also very nervous, and kind of lonely. I don't really know enough to say more on her than that, so I'll stop just here. Hopefully you guys can help fill me in a little more.

I don't know if she's overly lonely. She didn't join with the Myourens because she needed a friend. She felt legitimately bad for (indirectly) pranking someone like Byakuren. I do think this shows that Nue has a bit of heart about her mischief though.

If Akyuu is right and Nue wasn't the one that was harassing the emperor and if Nue really was sealed underground, then she was blamed and sealed for something she didn't do just because she was a youkai. Freshly freed from her seal she would feel some sympathy towards a group like Byakuren's.

Its also interesting that her current status has her doing training at Myouren Temple. I wonder if she really buys Byakuren's doctrine and earlier I would have said no but it is possible if she was falsely imprisoned. A better life for youkai? Byakuren trying to make it so people won't shoot you with an arrow while you're just innocently standing somewhere? Sounds good to Nue.

She doesn't have the kinship that the other temple members have though, if you listen to Akyuu, which does make sense. Ichirin and Murasa were sealed together underground for a long time (actually this seems like a thing that should be discussed with one or the other). Shou and Nazrin were together at the temple over that long period. Before that, they were all with Byakuren for an indeterminate length of time. Nue is a nuecomer to the group and was responsible for some small bit of hardship. Besides her guilt induced loyalty to Byakuren, Nue doesn't have any tie to the temple.

So I don't think she was lonely before when she could fly around and do whatever she wanted but she became lonely after becoming adjacent to a group. Nothing like having bonds of camaraderie rubbed in your face to do that. And I do wonder how much that affected her decision to bring in Mamizou. According to WAHH, Mamizou, unlike Nue, seems to be able to ingratiate herself in with a group and that could be an 'in' for Nue.

At the least she'd have Mamizou to pal around with and she'd even get some brownie points for bringing her in to face the Taoist menace! Oh, that got resolved while Mamizou was still on her way. But still, isn't Mamizou cool to have around? And isn't Nue cool for calling her in?

I don't know how sincere she is, though. Along with Murasa she's one of the two big troublemakers at the temple.

She is a troublemaker, but I'd attribute that to her more childish nature than any insincerity to the cause. I do think that she really does believe in Byakuren's goals...it's just that being a Buddhist is hard for someone like her and before Mamizou came along, Nue didn't really have any connection to the other members of the temple.

And yes, I do think that Mamizou, who ended up fitting in with the others better, will be a good "in" for Nue to help her fit in.

None of them are good Buddhists. Neither do I think many of them sympathize with her cause. They just like Byakuren.

If you think about the difference in their powers, it does kind of make sense. Mamizou can choose what she disguises herself as so having good social skills to sell that disguise help.

Nue just unidentifies herself and what she looks like is dependent on the observer.

Well yes. But I see Nue as particularly struggling with the Buddhist thing. The others can at least pretend.

And I didn't say they all cared about the cause. I said Nue personally did. And even then, it could be more sympathy towards it than anything.

Do recall that, unlike the others, Nue doesn't know Byakuren. She initially tagged along out of guilt for indirectly pranking her, but since she had to real stake in this thing, there was no reason for her to stay once things got sorted out unless there was something that made her want to stay.

EDIT:Hmm. Good point.

edited 18th Oct '12 7:33:58 AM by Otherarrow

Well, she called in a favour from an old friend to help support Byakuren. So I think that she's fond of Byakuren, despite the fact that Byakuren is a fuddyduddy and unpranksterish.

Well, yes, I can see her growing fond of her despite her fuddy duddyness. What I meant was that she didn't have the personal connection the others (except Nazrin I guess) did, and thus didn't have the "stick around because she likes Byakuren" excuse.

I am probably making no sense. What I am saying is, she initially had no tie to Byakuren, so something else had to motivate her to stay, I am arguing maybe her message appealed to Nue? And over time she grew attached to her...despite their differences.

I am bad at this.

None of them are good Buddhists but I do think many of them do sympathize with her cause. A lot of real life Buddhist monks weren't very good Buddhists either, drinking alcohol and saying its "holy water."