Follow TV Tropes

Following

History YMMV / OrsonScottCardsEmpire

Go To

OR

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* BrokenAesop: The book is about the evils of divisiveness in political discourse and extremism on both ends of the political spectrum, but [[spoiler:the right-wing response to the leftist uprising turns out to be a sham and never materializes -- it's an attempt by the Progressive Restoration's mole to identify who's going to take the most hardline action against them. The Progressive Restoration itself has no manifesto or demands, despite a paragraph talking about the divide it caused in the left-wing community, especially among hard-left radicals]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* DontShootTheMessage: Although the book suffers from a BrokenAesop by only portraying the liberals as extremists, it doesn't negate how dogmatic [[TheHorseshoeEffect both sides of the US political system]] have become in real life. As he states in the afterword, people in the middle who are reasonable and sane get lumped together with the extremists of whichever side they support, and that modern politicians focus too much on calling out and demonizing the opposing side instead of acknowledging when their side messes up.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Not YMMV and only applies to facts regarding the work.


* WordOfGod: The afterword where Scott Card speaks about the problems of extremism in the American political system. It's very apt, but is slightly hamstrung by virtue of it following a book that only had one side be at all extreme. And by Card's nonfiction writing where he holds some very right-wing views, contrasting to his call for moderation.


* AcceptableReligiousTargets: Islam in the second book.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Examples need to explain why they are examples. What are some examples of Empire being anvilicious? What are some examples of the protags having Ho Yay?


* {{Anvilicious}}: Let's just say this book is not subtle in its execution and leave it at that.

to:

* {{Anvilicious}}: Let's just say this book is not subtle in its execution and leave it at that.%%* {{Anvilicious}}



* HoYay: A massive amount with its two protagonists. Ironic, given the author.

to:

* %%* HoYay: A massive amount with its two protagonists. Ironic, given the author.protagonists.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
What about poor Cecily?


* TheWoobie: Cecily, poor Cecily.

to:

* %%* TheWoobie: Cecily, poor Cecily.Cecily
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* AlternateAesopInterpretation: One way to read the book is that the bad guys aren't "the Democrats" or "the Republicans." It's not the right or the left, it's a few people ''at the top'' on both sides, with extremist views, who could pull everyone else along with them into a second civil war. The rebels are liberals, but they have equally angry and irrational enemies on the right. (And the unanswered question posed by the ending is even creepier...)
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Agenda based troping is not allowed


* HarsherInHindsight: Political extremists destroying or at least damaging America would hit a little too close to home for many in 2020 and 2021 as politics became increasingly violent, from the riots that sprang from the national George Floyd protests in 2020 to the insurrection in the Capitol in 2021, all in the midst of a global pandemic that saw the medical response repeatedly hampered by politics, leading to hundreds of thousands of deaths and a noticeable dip in the national life expectancy.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Requires 20 years to have passed since release.


* ValuesResonance: [[AuthorTract Regardless of what one may think of Card's politics]], political extremism is a slippery slope regardless of which end on the spectrum it is. More than a decade after the book's release would see the increasing polarization of politics, from the rise of [=QAnon=] and the alt-right on one side of the spectrum to BLM and Antifa protestors on the other.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
NRLEP.


* DontShootTheMessage: Although the book suffers from a BrokenAesop by only portraying the liberals as extremists, it doesn't negate how dogmatic [[MirroringFactions both sides of the US political system]] have become in real life. As he states in the afterword, people in the middle who are reasonable and sane get lumped together with the extremists of whichever side they support, and that modern politicians focus too much on calling out and demonizing the opposing side instead of acknowledging when their side messes up.

to:

* DontShootTheMessage: Although the book suffers from a BrokenAesop by only portraying the liberals as extremists, it doesn't negate how dogmatic [[MirroringFactions [[TheHorseshoeEffect both sides of the US political system]] have become in real life. As he states in the afterword, people in the middle who are reasonable and sane get lumped together with the extremists of whichever side they support, and that modern politicians focus too much on calling out and demonizing the opposing side instead of acknowledging when their side messes up.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* DontShootTheMessage: Although the book suffers from a BrokenAesop by only portraying the liberals as extremists, it doesn't negate how dogmatic [[NotSoDifferent both sides of the US political system]] have become in real life. As he states in the afterword, people in the middle who are reasonable and sane get lumped together with the extremists of whichever side they support, and that modern politicians focus too much on calling out and demonizing the opposing side instead of acknowledging when their side messes up.

to:

* DontShootTheMessage: Although the book suffers from a BrokenAesop by only portraying the liberals as extremists, it doesn't negate how dogmatic [[NotSoDifferent [[MirroringFactions both sides of the US political system]] have become in real life. As he states in the afterword, people in the middle who are reasonable and sane get lumped together with the extremists of whichever side they support, and that modern politicians focus too much on calling out and demonizing the opposing side instead of acknowledging when their side messes up.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* ValuesResonance: [[AuthorTract Regardless of what one may think of Card's politics]], political extremism is a slippery slope regardless of which end on the spectrum it is. More than a decade after the book's release would see the increasing proliferation of political extremism, from the rise of [=QAnon=] and the alt-right on one side of the spectrum to BLM and Antifa protestors on the other.

to:

* ValuesResonance: [[AuthorTract Regardless of what one may think of Card's politics]], political extremism is a slippery slope regardless of which end on the spectrum it is. More than a decade after the book's release would see the increasing proliferation polarization of political extremism, politics, from the rise of [=QAnon=] and the alt-right on one side of the spectrum to BLM and Antifa protestors on the other.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* ValuesResonance: [[AuthorTract Regardless of what one may think of Card's politics]], political extremism is a slippery slope regardless of which end on the spectrum it is. More than a decade after the book's release would see the increasing proliferation of political extremism, from the rise of QAnon and the alt-right on one side of the spectrum to BLM and Antifa protestors on the other.

to:

* ValuesResonance: [[AuthorTract Regardless of what one may think of Card's politics]], political extremism is a slippery slope regardless of which end on the spectrum it is. More than a decade after the book's release would see the increasing proliferation of political extremism, from the rise of QAnon [=QAnon=] and the alt-right on one side of the spectrum to BLM and Antifa protestors on the other.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Not a trope anymore


* SomeAnvilsNeedToBeDropped: The book's main theme is more and more relevant each year since it was written (2006), if the major political blogs and TV news shows are any indication.

Changed: 1229

Removed: 565

Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* HarsherInHindsight: Left-wing extremists destroying or at least damaging America would hit a little too close to home for many in 2020 going on 2021 with the rise of many radical, left-wing ideologues such as Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez[[note]][[Main/{{Hypocrite}} vehemently opposed detainment facilities for undocumented foreign minors during a Republican's presidency, discreetly downplayed the same facilities during a Democrat's presidency]][[/note]], Ilhan Omar[[note]]Advocate for open borders, despite the severe human trafficking problems it creates[[/note]] and Maxine Waters[[note]]notoriously interfered in a trial in complete disregard of American fair trial laws[[/note]], and a mainstream media that is too eager to amplify the clout and incendiary rhetoric of such individuals.
** And then the sequel hits even harder after we saw how a politically divided America handled COVID-19.

to:

* HarsherInHindsight: Left-wing Political extremists destroying or at least damaging America would hit a little too close to home for many in 2020 going on and 2021 with as politics became increasingly violent, from the rise of many radical, left-wing ideologues such as Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez[[note]][[Main/{{Hypocrite}} vehemently opposed detainment facilities for undocumented foreign minors during a Republican's presidency, discreetly downplayed riots that sprang from the same facilities during a Democrat's presidency]][[/note]], Ilhan Omar[[note]]Advocate for open borders, despite national George Floyd protests in 2020 to the severe human trafficking problems it creates[[/note]] and Maxine Waters[[note]]notoriously interfered insurrection in a trial the Capitol in complete disregard 2021, all in the midst of American fair trial laws[[/note]], a global pandemic that saw the medical response repeatedly hampered by politics, leading to hundreds of thousands of deaths and a mainstream media that is too eager to amplify noticeable dip in the clout and incendiary rhetoric of such individuals.
** And then the sequel hits even harder after we saw how a politically divided America handled COVID-19.
national life expectancy.



** HistoryMarchesOn: 2020 would later demonstrate how similar groups would do so.
* ValuesResonance: [[AuthorTract Regardless of what one may think of Card's politics]], political extremism is a slippery slope regardless of which end on the spectrum it is, the fact that 14-15 years after the book's release would see the increasing proliferation of Left-leaning extremists like the pro-socialist ''Black Lives Matter'' organization aligns with this aspect of the book well doesn't take away from the inherent anti-extremist stance it conveys.

to:

** HistoryMarchesOn: 2020 would later demonstrate how similar groups would do so.
* ValuesResonance: [[AuthorTract Regardless of what one may think of Card's politics]], political extremism is a slippery slope regardless of which end on the spectrum it is, the fact that 14-15 years is. More than a decade after the book's release would see the increasing proliferation of Left-leaning extremists like the pro-socialist ''Black Lives Matter'' organization aligns with this aspect of the book well doesn't take away political extremism, from the inherent anti-extremist stance it conveys.rise of QAnon and the alt-right on one side of the spectrum to BLM and Antifa protestors on the other.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

** HistoryMarchesOn: 2020 would later demonstrate how similar groups would do so.

Top