History Main / ItsNotSupposedToWinOscars

* After it became a critical failure and surprise BoxOfficeBomb over its cliched story, sloppy PaintedCGI animation, and underwhelming songs, a common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/{{Wish|2023}}'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans. There have been counterarguments in response, in particular that the story is too complicated for the BlackAndWhiteMorality to not feel forced and the constant references to older movies are confusing and eat up time that could have been given to properly developing the story and characters. Another common defense is that viewers were asking too much of a children's movie, which sticks out because Disney animation fans in particular ''love'' to argue for the artistic merits and maturity of their preferred films.

* After it became critical failure and surprise BoxOfficeBomb over its cliched story, sloppy PaintedCGI animation, and underwhelming songs, a common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/{{Wish|2023}}'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans. There have been several counterarguments in response to this, including the fact that the overreliance on the references is hurting the film and that the story is too overly complicated for the BlackAndWhiteMorality they are going for.

* Many of the criticisms heaped on ''VideoGame/NoMoreHeroes'', notably the rather empty overworld, bad driving physics, and generally low-scale environment assets, were deflected by the fanbase by saying that the creator meant to lampoon games like ''VideoGame/GrandTheftAuto'' by deliberately making a clunky overworld. It's not certain how true this explanation actually is since in the UsefulNotes/PlayStation3 port, part of the overworld is actually ''blocked off'' because absolutely nothing happens in that particular section.

* After it became critical failure and surprise BoxOfficeBomb over its cliched story, sloppy PaintedCGI animation, and underwhelming songs, a common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/Wish2023'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans. There have been several counterarguments in response to this, including the fact that the overreliance on the references is hurting the film and that the story is too overly complicated for the BlackAndWhiteMorality they are going for.

* ''Film/TheRoom2003'' was immediately panned as one of the worst movies of all time when initially released. After it became extremely popular as a SoBadItsGood film, writer/director/producer/star Tommy Wiseau started saying that [[ParodyRetcon he always intended it to be a black comedy]], which doesn't exactly work as the funniest scenes in the film are clearly intended to be serious, including Tommy's [[MemeticMutation "You are tearing me apart, Lisa!"]], a character casually dropping that she has breast cancer, only to be ignored, one actor being switched out for another, and even the sex scenes.

* After ''Series/IronFist2017'' became the most-panned TV show in the Franchise/MarvelCinematicUniverse thus far, star Finn Jones claimed that Marvel made it not for the critics, but for the ''ComicBook/IronFist'' fans.

** The Spoony One acknowledges this in his [[{{Film/Twilight}} Twilight:New Moon]] Vlog, saying that he has to judge it on whether it does what it sets out to do well. He says that insofar as it seeks to show the audience [[{{Fanservice}} shirtless Native Americans]], it sort of does, but it fails at everything else it attempts to do. And with that, couldn't they just find it on the net?

** The Critic passes the low quality of ''Series/TheSuperMarioBrosSuperShow'' and ''WesternAnimation/TheLegendOfZelda1989'' cartoon off on the fact that they were intended for children; however he does comment that just because something is for kids doesn't really give its makers an excuse to be lazy with it.

* The typical argument used by ''[[WesternAnimation/UltimateSpiderMan2012 Ultimate Spider-Man]]''[='s=] creators, especially, Creator/ManOfActionStudios, to defend the show against the many complains about its lack of quality, is that it's intended to be a kid's show. Usually, this kind of argument only results in the fans being even more pissed off. As Creator/BrianMichaelBendis pointed out, the show does quite well with younger demographics, who are Disney's target audience to begin with. The [[PeripheryDemographic adult fans complaining on the message boards aren't the ones Disney and the toy companies are after]], which is sadly one of the reasons ''WesternAnimation/TheAvengersEarthsMightiestHeroes'' (which did well with adults but not as well with kids) was not renewed.
* Used on occasion by the producers behind ''WesternAnimation/TeenTitansGo'', which is heavily disliked by some adults, ''especially'' fans of the 2003 ''WesternAnimation/TeenTitans'' series. [[https://www.cbr.com/teen-titans-go-producer-revels-in-stupidity-of-young-justice-crossover/ The creators have noted]] multiple times that the juvenile, QuirkyWork nature of the cartoon is the entire point, and that it isn't supposed to be the story arc-heavy action/drama that its predecessor was. Some episodes use the "kids show" defense when poking fun both at itself and at its massive {{Hatedom}}. Though, in an ironic example of this trope, this show actually managed to get two Primetime Emmy nominations.

* The Creator/MichaelBay ''Film/{{Transformers}}'' movies get this a lot, with complaints about their humor, characters, plot, and so on met with, "Look we're just here to see giant robots beat each other up, what do you expect?". Granted, "[[JustHereForGodzilla We're just here to see giant robots beat each other up!]]" is also a major complaint against [[DevelopingDoomedCharacters the humor, characters]] [[{{Filler}} and plot]], which take up a ''very'' large chunk of the usually lengthy runtime. The production crew has in fact outright admitted that their goal is not to rival other movies that may be released around the same time as the ''Transformers'' flicks, but to provide an alternative for fun free-time activities such as theme-park rides.

** After ''Film/{{Transformers The Last Knight}}'' finally broke the streak and did so poorly that Paramount was estimated to have lost 100 million dollars, you could write an essay on how ''Film/{{Bumblebee}}'' finally got good reviews for a film franchise so openly hated by critics by dropping all the more infamous Michael Bayisms. A female lead whose not objectified, less and smaller combat scenes after the [[ActionPrologue first 2 minutes]], more characterization of all the characters including the villains, romantic tension without becoming a couple, no Eagleland portrayal of the US military, little to no [[SlowMotion slow motion]], no EthnicScrappy, meaningful emotional beats, no vulgar humor, the list goes on and on.

* After it became critical failure and surprise BoxOfficeBomb over its cliched story, sloppy PaintedCGI animation, and underwhelming songs, a common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/Wish2023'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans.

* After it became was over its cliched story, sloppy PaintedCGI animation, and underwhelming songs, a common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/Wish2023'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans.

* After it became a critical failure and surprise BoxOfficeBomb over its cliched story, sloppy PaintedCGI animation, and underwhelming songs, a common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/Wish2023'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans. Counterarguments in response are 1) that the film ''isn't'' "a gentle, simple film, as a tribute to simpler structured films like ''Cinderella'' and ''Sleeping Beauty''", but rather needlessly complicated (i.e. Magnifico starting as a nuanced antagonist then JumpingOffTheSlipperySlope, all the issues surrounding how wishing works, and too many secondary characters such as Asha having ''seven'' friends inspired by the Seven Dwarfs '''on top of''' a talking goat and a CuteMute star) and quippy, 2) that all the references are distracting and even contradict the intended morals (i.e., one is that people have to actualize their own dreams, and yet [[spoiler: Asha becomes a fairy godmother at the end]]), and 3) that a ''real'' tribute to the artists who came before them would have been a distinctive, original fantasy rather than one dependent on evoking nostalgia for better movies.

* A common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/Wish2023'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans. Counterarguments in response are 1) that the film ''isn't'' "a gentle, simple film, as a tribute to simpler structured films like ''Cinderella'' and ''Sleeping Beauty''", but rather needlessly complicated (i.e. Magnifico starting as a nuanced antagonist, then JumpingOffTheSlipperySlope, or all the issues surrounding how wishing works) and quippy, 2) that all the references are distracting and even contradict the intended morals (i.e., one is that people have to actualize their own dreams, and yet [[spoiler: Asha becomes a fairy godmother at the end]]), and 3) that a ''real'' tribute to the artists who came before them would have been a distinctive, original fantasy rather than one dependent on evoking nostalgia for better movies.

* A common argument made by defenders of the film ''WesternAnimation/Wish2023'' ([[https://www.reddit.com/r/DisneyWish/comments/18888q0/comment/kbkqe97/?utm_source=embedv2&utm_medium=comment_embed&utm_content=whitespace and by at least one of its animators]]) is that being the MilestoneCelebration Franchise/DisneyAnimatedCanon film, it makes sense for it to be a ClicheStorm of tropes from the FairyTale-inspired films in particular with BlackAndWhiteMorality, and that its numerous CompanyCrossReferences ([[https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/CompanyCrossReferences/Wish2023 enough to warrant their own page]]) are expressions of love and admiration for the creatives who made those films and a treat for Disney mega-fans. Counterarguments in response are 1) that the film ''isn't'' "a gentle, simple film, as a tribute to simpler structured films like ''Cinderella'' and ''Sleeping Beauty''", but rather needlessly complicated (i.e. Magnifico starting as a nuanced antagonist, then JumpingOffTheSlipperySlope, or all the issues surrounding how wishing works) and quippy, 2) that all the references are distracting and even contradict the intended morals (i.e., one is that people have to actualize their own dreams, and yet [[spoiler: Asha becomes a fairy godmother at the end]]), and 3) that a ''real'' tribute to the artists who came before them would have been a distinctive, original fantasy rather than one dependent on evoking nostalgia for better movies.

* Website/RottenTomatoes's "critics' consensus" system does this sometimes. Chances are, if a movie turns out bad (but not [[DarthWiki/SoBadItsHorrible below 10% bad]]), but is catered toward a specific demographic (children, fans of the source material, etc.), the consensus will be written along the lines of, "This movie is bad, but at least its target demographic will enjoy it." For example, the [[http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/thunderbirds/ consensus]] for ''Film/{{Thunderbirds}}'' is, "Live-action [[AnimationAgeGhetto cartoon]] for [[ViewersAreMorons kids]]." Which, in cases where [[Film/StarTrekNemesis the target demographic actually hated it]] this comes across as quite insulting. An exception was made for ''[[WesternAnimation/TheMagicRoundabout2005 Doogal]]'' where the consensus read: "''Doogal'' is too simpleminded even for the kiddies."

This is a line that fans have started using to [[CriticProof deter negative criticism of their favorite works]] (a common alternative seems to be "Just turn your brain off and enjoy it"). Depending on the case, this defense can be justified if the reviewer/critic genuinely [[ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontWatch lacks familiarity with the work]]. It's true that critics can on occasion be overly harsh. However, fans can get carried away with this regard as it is mostly used to defend their favorite works in general from any and all forms of criticism, even if a reviewer/critic happens to like said work and even (or especially) if the criticism is not without merit.

* Used on occasion by the producers behind ''WesternAnimation/TeenTitansGo'', which is heavily disliked by some adults, ''especially'' fans of the 2003 ''WesternAnimation/TeenTitans'' series. [[https://www.cbr.com/teen-titans-go-producer-revels-in-stupidity-of-young-justice-crossover/ The creators have noted]] multiple times that the juvenile, WidgetSeries nature of the cartoon is the entire point, and that it isn't supposed to be the story arc-heavy action/drama that its predecessor was. Some episodes use the "kids show" defense when poking fun both at itself and at its massive {{Hatedom}}. Though, in an ironic example of this trope, this show actually managed to get two Primetime Emmy nominations.

* ''Film/TheRoom'' was immediately panned as one of the worst movies of all time when initially released. After it became extremely popular as a SoBadItsGood film, writer/director/producer/star Tommy Wiseau started saying that [[ParodyRetcon he always intended it to be a black comedy]], which doesn't exactly work as the funniest scenes in the film are clearly intended to be serious, including Tommy's [[MemeticMutation "You are tearing me apart, Lisa!"]], a character casually dropping that she has breast cancer, only to be ignored, one actor being switched out for another, and even the sex scenes.

* Shawn Levy, director of ''Film/RealSteel'', used this argument in defense of his movies. He claimed he didn't really care about what critics and snobby award shows thought of his movies and was glad that audiences had a great time watching his work.

* [[https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/21450999/disney-remakes-live-action-plus-animation According to Polygon]], this appears to be a reasonable argument for the mediocrity of many Film/DisneyLiveActionRemakes.

* [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xl7Y9bC4rnY John Lasseter was at the premiere of Cars 2]] in Paris to assert that he "doesn't make movies for critics" and that it was one of the most fun movies he's ever worked on, which doesn't automatically make it a good viewing experience for others.

* Website/RottenTomatoes's "critics' consensus" system does this sometimes. Chances are, if a movie turns out bad (but not [[DarthWiki/SoBadItsHorrible below 10% bad]]), but is catered toward a specific demographic (children, fans of the source material, etc.), the consensus will be written along the lines of, "This movie is bad, but at least its target demographic will enjoy it." For example, the [[http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/thunderbirds/ consensus]] for ''Film/{{Thunderbirds}}'' is, "Live-action [[AnimationAgeGhetto cartoon]] for [[ViewersAreMorons kids]]." Which, in cases where [[Film/StarTrekNemesis the target demographic actually hated it]] this comes across as quite insulting. An exception was made for ''[[WesternAnimation/TheMagicRoundabout Doogal]]'' where the consensus read: "''Doogal'' is too simpleminded even for the kiddies."

* WebVideo/TheNostalgiaCritic:
** The Critic passes the low quality of ''[[WesternAnimation/SuperMarioBros The Super Mario Bros. Super Show]]'' and ''WesternAnimation/TheLegendOfZelda1989'' cartoon off on the fact that they were intended for children; however he does comment that just because something is for kids doesn't really give its makers an excuse to be lazy with it.

* Website/RottenTomatoes's "critics' consensus" system does this sometimes. Chances are, if a movie turns out bad (but not [[DarthWiki/SoBadItsHorrible below 10% bad]]), but is catered toward a specific demographic (children, fans of the source material, etc.), the consensus will be written along the lines of, "This movie is bad, but at least its target demographic will enjoy it." For example, the [[http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/thunderbirds/ consensus]] for ''Film/{{Thunderbirds}}'' is, "Live-action [[AnimationAgeGhetto cartoon]] for [[ViewersAreMorons kids]]." Which, in cases where [[Film/StarTrekNemesis the target demographic actually hated it]] this comes across as quite insulting. An exception was made for ''[[Series/TheMagicRoundabout Doogal]]'' where the consensus read: "''Doogal'' is too simpleminded even for the kiddies."

* The director of ''Film/TheOogielovesInTheBigBalloonAdventure'' [[https://www.thewrap.com/oogieloves-worst-ever-box-office-bow-notoriety-we-were-looking-54471/ made the exact excuse that]] "this wasn't made to win the Academy Award." Bafflingly, he said that the measly box office returns didn't bother him either.

* ''Series/ICarly'' had an in-universe AuthorTract that was LeaningOnTheFourthWall to say that the webshow (and by extension, the actual real-life show), was just a "stupid pointless comedy" and looking for deeper moments or any kind of continuity or emotional moments was pointless and against the intention of the authors. An interesting example as it wasn't directed at outside critics, but at fandom and its desire to turn the show into a {{Shipping}} drama. Its spin-off, ''Series/SamAndCat'' ran into the exact same criticism -- and ironically enough it was compared as a pale imitation of ''[=iCarly=]''. The problem in ''[=iCarly's=]'' case is that the first 3 seasons before that episode came out had a good number of episodes that expressly fueled shipping and other things through having genuinely heartfelt moments and continuity, so it felt like either Dan Schneider saw the show very differently than everyone else, or he was lying through his teeth and punishing people for watching and paying attention. Even afterwards, the show genuinely tried for some more heartfelt moments and used continuity very effectively.

* ''Series/ICarly'' had an in-universe AuthorTract that was LeaningOnTheFourthWall to say that the webshow (and by extension, the actual real-life show), was just a "stupid pointless comedy" and looking for deeper moments or any kind of continuity or emotional moments was pointless and against the intention of the authors. An interesting example as it wasn't directed at outside critics, but at fandom and its desire to turn the show into a {{Shipping}} drama. Its spin-off, ''Series/SamAndCat'' ran into the exact same criticism -- and ironically enough it was compared as a pale imitation of ''[=iCarly=]''.

* The Creator/MichaelBay ''Film/{{Transformers}}'' movies get this a lot, with complaints about their humor, characters, plot, and so on met with, "Look we're just here to see giant robots beat each other up, what do you expect?". Granted, "[[JustHereForGodzilla We're just here to see giant robots beat each other up!]]" is also a major complaint against [[DevelopingDoomedCharacters the humor, characters]] [[{{Filler}} and plot]]. The production crew has in fact outright admitted that their goal is not to rival other movies that may be released around the same time as the ''Transformers'' flicks, but to provide an alternative for fun free-time activities such as theme-park rides.

** The Critic passes the low quality of ''[[WesternAnimation/SuperMarioBros The Super Mario Bros. Super Show]]'' and ''WesternAnimation/TheLegendOfZelda'' cartoon off on the fact that they were intended for children; however he does comment that just because something is for kids doesn't really give its makers an excuse to be lazy with it.