Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 92 (click to see context) from:
* The symbolism of the ending's events was a little ''[[EveryoneIsJesusInPurgatory peculiar]]'' in that Koholint disappeared before the "celestial area" where Link held an audience with the deity's consciousness, he was later ejected out through [[WaterGeyserVolley a column of water.]] Was he blown out through a spout? Was he not just in the Wind Fish's dream, but also cryptically [[SwallowedWhole inside the whale god]] the entire time? Would the survival rates be higher or lower?
to:
* The symbolism of the ending's events was a little ''[[EveryoneIsJesusInPurgatory peculiar]]'' in that Koholint disappeared before the "celestial area" where Link held an audience with the deity's consciousness, he was later ejected out through [[WaterGeyserVolley a column of water.]] Was he [[BlownUpwardByABlowhole blown out through a spout? spout]]? Was he not just in the Wind Fish's dream, but also cryptically [[SwallowedWhole inside the whale god]] the entire time? Would the survival rates be higher or lower?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** I believe that message means that the longer Link remains in the dream, the more likely his body is to run into some sort of deadly risk, the most obvious one being falling off the bit of driftwood and drowning or being caught in another storm, so he should wake from the dream and reclaim control of his body before that can happen. I don't think it refers to Link being felled by a monster during gameplay.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
[[folder:Miscellaneous]]
* In the tower, you break four pillars on one floor... And cause ''the floor above'' to collapse ''on itself'' [[spoiler:(probably because it's AllJustADream)]].
** The pillars are actually holding the center section even higher, but that still begs the question of why it didn't fall all the way to the floor Link is on since nothing's holding it up.
* If the enemies from other Nintendo games are there because of the big twist, how do they exist in Hyrule? Several of them appear in ''A Link to the Past'' and ''The Minish Cap''. And then, they also exist in [[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOracleGames Holodrum and Labrynna]].
** Simple, they ''aren't'' there because of the twist, that's just a fan theory. A Link to the Past also had its fair share of Mario enemies (Chain Chomps and Pokeys, both enemies that also show up here), before Link's Awakening's idea was even conceived.
** Anyway, them being there because of the twist ties into the fact that some of them also exist in the real world, [[spoiler:in that Link's supposed to be dreaming about enemies he's encountered before, just like how he dreams of characters based on those he's interacted with in the ''Oracle'' games.]]
* Link holds Marin above his head when she follows him for awhile... Wait a minute. He's looking up her skirt!
[[/folder]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
*** Actually, the ending implies that the island was a part of the real world. During the final Ballad performance where the island fades away, it’s only the island itself that disappears, not of the water or the sky surrounding it. As to how Link ended up back among his ship’s wreckage, the Wind Fish could’ve dropped him off there to ensure he didn’t drown before he regained consciousness.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
The Headscratchers page is for in-universe questions.
Deleted line(s) 9 (click to see context) :
** I attribute it to the Windfish being a Semi-Divine Jackass. (Is that a trope?) He considers assisting him a great honour in itself, and thus doesn't feel like he needs to help the insignificant Hylian after all Link went through.
Deleted line(s) 11,13 (click to see context) :
** He almost certainly did. He wakes up to the sound of seagulls calling, and seagulls are never very far from land.
** Not quite correct. Gulls sometimes do venture far out to sea. Tighter groups follow foraging '''whales''', groups of dolphins, or schools of large fish in open water, hovering to nab small prey driven to the surface. Guess '''what''' the Wind Fish is?
** I like to joke that Link grabbed some driftwood and started paddling while singing "Row Row Row Your Boat" to the tune of "Marin's Song".
** Not quite correct. Gulls sometimes do venture far out to sea. Tighter groups follow foraging '''whales''', groups of dolphins, or schools of large fish in open water, hovering to nab small prey driven to the surface. Guess '''what''' the Wind Fish is?
** I like to joke that Link grabbed some driftwood and started paddling while singing "Row Row Row Your Boat" to the tune of "Marin's Song".
Deleted line(s) 16 (click to see context) :
** LiteraryAgentHypothesis would solve this. Link obviously had to survive in order to tell somebody about the story. If Link had died without sharing the story, we wouldn't know about it. Or maybe I misunderstand the trope.
Changed line(s) 49 (click to see context) from:
to:
** Also, pray tell, just what is it that needs saving, exactly? The only time the Nightmares bother anyone besides Link is in an attempt to stop Link from waking the Wind Fish. Otherwise, the normal island residents don't have a ton to worry about. The most anyone has to say is that the heightened presence of monsters makes venturing outside the village dangerous, but most of them don't show a desire to leave the village anyway.
Deleted line(s) 52,60 (click to see context) :
[[folder:Skip text]]
* Why did the developers remove the ability to skip the text from common dungeon items (keys, compass)/
** Lazy programmers?
** Remove? I don't think that ever ''was'' an option, especially not in the games that came before ''Link's Awakening''. You can make the text go by more quickly, but never skip it entirely.
** Hardware limitations for the '93 release. Between the 64 KB file size of Game Boy cartridges at the time and the way the game processed displaying text, making the message play faster or adding a function to skip a message entirely would have meant cutting something from the game.
** ^ The original GB release had text skipping. It was just removed from the DX version for some inexplicable reason.
[[/folder]]
* Why did the developers remove the ability to skip the text from common dungeon items (keys, compass)/
** Lazy programmers?
** Remove? I don't think that ever ''was'' an option, especially not in the games that came before ''Link's Awakening''. You can make the text go by more quickly, but never skip it entirely.
** Hardware limitations for the '93 release. Between the 64 KB file size of Game Boy cartridges at the time and the way the game processed displaying text, making the message play faster or adding a function to skip a message entirely would have meant cutting something from the game.
** ^ The original GB release had text skipping. It was just removed from the DX version for some inexplicable reason.
[[/folder]]
Deleted line(s) 69,70 (click to see context) :
** It's a common superstition that dying in your dreams will make you die in real life. But the question of how real everything was is still a bit vague. Was Link actually asleep the entire time? Or did he just get sent flying by the column of water at the end that made him land in the wreckage of his ship as the island disappeared? [[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaPhantomHourglass The Ocean King]] is commonly speculated to be related to the Wind Fish in some way (both are whales trapped in a deep sleep that creates a world that is only accessible while dreaming), and ''Phantom Hourglass'' ended not with the World of the Ocean King being destroyed by him waking up, but instead the connection between the two worlds is severed. Link and Tetra had to get back to their ship before the connection was broken or risk being trapped until the next time the Ocean King fell asleep.
** Uhh, pardon me, but the Ocean King was never said to have been “asleep” or to have created a world through his dreams. The world that he watches over is just a separate universe from Hyrule’s, one where time apparently passes differently in between them. Link could not have ended up on the Ghost Ship at the end of the game if the events of the story were a dream, because the opening shows he lost his grip and fell into the sea before he could climb aboard.
** Uhh, pardon me, but the Ocean King was never said to have been “asleep” or to have created a world through his dreams. The world that he watches over is just a separate universe from Hyrule’s, one where time apparently passes differently in between them. Link could not have ended up on the Ghost Ship at the end of the game if the events of the story were a dream, because the opening shows he lost his grip and fell into the sea before he could climb aboard.
Changed line(s) 76,77 (click to see context) from:
** Depends on which version of the timeline you go by. According to ''Hyrule Historia'', the ''Oracle'' games come before this one, and in a Linked ending, we see Link departing Holodrum/Labrynna in the same boat seen in this game's intro, so that's how he boarded it. If you go by the ''Encyclopedia'', which says that the ''Oracle'' games come after this one, we don't have reason to assume there isn't any way over Hyrule's mountains [[GameplayAndStorySegregation just because Link isn't able to go past them.]] Either way, we know that Impa and the Knights of Hyrule made it from Hyrule to Holodrum to protect the Oracle of Seasons (unlike Link, who was sent via the Triforce), so there must be some way for them to have done it.
** Simply put, and other games aside, he travelled out of Hyrule by land, ''then'' boarded a boat.
** Simply put, and other games aside, he travelled out of Hyrule by land, ''then'' boarded a boat.
to:
** Depends on which version of the timeline you go by. According to ''Hyrule Historia'', the ''Oracle'' games come before this one, and in a Linked ending, we see Link departing Holodrum/Labrynna in the same boat seen in this game's intro, so that's how he boarded it. If you go by the ''Encyclopedia'', which says that the ''Oracle'' games come after this one, we don't have reason to assume there isn't any way He climbed over Hyrule's mountains [[GameplayAndStorySegregation just the mountains. Just because ''A Link isn't able to go past them.]] Either way, we know that Impa and the Knights of Hyrule made it from Hyrule to Holodrum to protect the Oracle of Seasons (unlike Link, who was sent via the Triforce), so there must be some way for Past'' shows them to have done it.
** Simply put, and other games aside, he travelled out of Hyrule by land, ''then'' boarded a boat.be impassable in-game doesn't mean it's impossible to pass them in-story.
** Simply put, and other games aside, he travelled out of Hyrule by land, ''then'' boarded a boat.
Deleted line(s) 110,121 (click to see context) :
[[folder: Questionable dub name changes]]
* Why were Stretchy Ghosts [[DubNameChange renamed Camo Goblins]] in the English translation, when they look nothing like goblins?
** That was Prima's name for them, not Nintendo's.
*** The Zelda Encyclopedia confirmed that the name is official. Several of the other monsters in that guide have names that were at odds with other guides at the time but are now considered correct.
*** The Dreamer Art Book included with the Switch update renames them Goo Specters.
** Besides, how do you know what goblins look like?
** Goblins have had lots of depictions in folklore and popular culture. But more importantly, they're not ''ghosts'', either. ''Obake'' is often translated as "ghost" in English. But more often than not, myths about ''obake'' portray them as inanimate objects that have come to life or monsters that can shapeshift.
* Several enemies are taken from ''Mario''. But why do some have the same English names as they do in ''Mario'' while others don't? Several of them - Boo, Goomba, Piranha Plant - share their ''Mario'' names in both languages. But then others - Spiked Beetle (Spiny), Evil Eagle (Albatoss), Camo Goblin (Boo Blah) - have the same name in Japan for both series but different names in English. Obviously some are more recognizable than others, and the localization team would notice them right away. But if they knew some of them were shared between the series, why not double check to make sure they stay consistent?
** It seems someone at Nintendo agreed, and Spiked Beetles had their name changed to Spiny for the Switch remake. Camo Goblins at least have a descriptive name (''biyon obake'', translated as "stretchy ghost" but see above) and don't appear to have been directly based on the Mario enemies (but based on the same mythical creature).
** The localisation team probably didn't realise those were also Mario enemies. And really, of the three examples given, only one actually looks like the Mario enemy.
[[/folder]]
* Why were Stretchy Ghosts [[DubNameChange renamed Camo Goblins]] in the English translation, when they look nothing like goblins?
** That was Prima's name for them, not Nintendo's.
*** The Zelda Encyclopedia confirmed that the name is official. Several of the other monsters in that guide have names that were at odds with other guides at the time but are now considered correct.
*** The Dreamer Art Book included with the Switch update renames them Goo Specters.
** Besides, how do you know what goblins look like?
** Goblins have had lots of depictions in folklore and popular culture. But more importantly, they're not ''ghosts'', either. ''Obake'' is often translated as "ghost" in English. But more often than not, myths about ''obake'' portray them as inanimate objects that have come to life or monsters that can shapeshift.
* Several enemies are taken from ''Mario''. But why do some have the same English names as they do in ''Mario'' while others don't? Several of them - Boo, Goomba, Piranha Plant - share their ''Mario'' names in both languages. But then others - Spiked Beetle (Spiny), Evil Eagle (Albatoss), Camo Goblin (Boo Blah) - have the same name in Japan for both series but different names in English. Obviously some are more recognizable than others, and the localization team would notice them right away. But if they knew some of them were shared between the series, why not double check to make sure they stay consistent?
** It seems someone at Nintendo agreed, and Spiked Beetles had their name changed to Spiny for the Switch remake. Camo Goblins at least have a descriptive name (''biyon obake'', translated as "stretchy ghost" but see above) and don't appear to have been directly based on the Mario enemies (but based on the same mythical creature).
** The localisation team probably didn't realise those were also Mario enemies. And really, of the three examples given, only one actually looks like the Mario enemy.
[[/folder]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** The game itself seems to go with the interpretation that the island was in a separate, "dream world", since when Link awakens, he's still tied to the mast like he was during the intro, implying that the lightning strike was what summoned him into the dream.
** As for the inconsistency of certain characters' memories, that's probably just a byproduct of the whole island being a dream. The four kids don't have memories to think back on because the Wind Fish's psyche happened not to give them any, but Old Man Ulrira is supposed to be wise and all-knowing with regard to the island and its mysteries, so the dream gives him more of a experienced backstory so as not to contradict that.
** As for the inconsistency of certain characters' memories, that's probably just a byproduct of the whole island being a dream. The four kids don't have memories to think back on because the Wind Fish's psyche happened not to give them any, but Old Man Ulrira is supposed to be wise and all-knowing with regard to the island and its mysteries, so the dream gives him more of a experienced backstory so as not to contradict that.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
added question about the nature of the dream
Added DiffLines:
[[folder: The Nature of the Wind Fish's Dream]]
* Is Koholint Island a physical place created by the Wind Fish RealityWarper style, and Link drifts ashore normally after being struck by lightning? Or is the real Link adrift and unconscious, entering the Wind Fish's otherwise normal dream a la ''Inception''? The former scenario is much more tragic, as it implies the Nightmares and other islanders are self aware beings that will vanish into oblivion when the Wind Fish wakes up. However, the last few dungeon bosses say that Link is a part of the Wind Fish's dream, sort of implying the latter. There are a few other lines of dialogue that muddy the waters. When Link (presumably) asks one of the kids in Mabe Village when the kid arrived on the island, the kid can't grasp the concept and gets a headache when trying to think about it. However, One of Old Man Urira's (the aforementioned kid's grandfather) hints implies that Urira remembers his childhood on the island. How can the grandfather have past memories while his grandson doesn't? If the ''Inception'' interpretation is correct, then the islanders are merely philosophical zombies: beings that appear externally to possess consciousness, but actually have no subjective experience.
[[/folder]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 18 (click to see context) from:
to:
** When Link awakens in the Switch version, we also see that the water around him is littered with the remains of his destroyed ship, including a few barrels. And after a cut, we're shown that he's tied a few beams together to form a makeshift raft and has one of the barrels sitting next to him, which probably contains some form of provisions, before he looks up and notices the Wind Fish flying by. Even if the Wind Fish and Marin neglected to help him get to shore again, for some reason, it's likely he knows enough to have a chance of survival on his own, or else he wouldn't have been sailing by himself in the first place.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** ^ The original GB release had text skipping. It was just removed from the DX version for some inexplicable reason.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** The Hyrule Encyclopedia goes with the theory that Koholint was a physical place that was actually brought temporarily into existence by the Wind Fish's dream. If that were the case him being able to die would be perfectly plausible.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 7 (click to see context) from:
* Okay, let's talk about the ending of ''Link's Awakening''. Why does the Wind Fish just ''leave Link behind''?! Link just went through loads of dangerous battles to save the Wind Fish from endless sleep, and had to cause DreamApocalypse in the process... the Wind Fish even says that the island will continue to exist in Link's memories, so ''why not give him a ride home'' so he can ''tell people about it?!'' Stupid inconsiderate whale.
to:
* Okay, let's talk about the ending of ''Link's Awakening''.this game. Why does the Wind Fish just ''leave Link behind''?! Link just went through loads of dangerous battles to save the Wind Fish from endless sleep, and had to cause DreamApocalypse in the process... the Wind Fish even says that the island will continue to exist in Link's memories, so ''why not give him a ride home'' so he can ''tell people about it?!'' Stupid inconsiderate whale.
Changed line(s) 13 (click to see context) from:
** This Troper liked to joke that Link grabbed some driftwood and started paddling while singing "Row Row Row Your Boat" to the tune of "Marin's Song".
to:
** This Troper liked I like to joke that Link grabbed some driftwood and started paddling while singing "Row Row Row Your Boat" to the tune of "Marin's Song".
Changed line(s) 43 (click to see context) from:
* We all know the infamous shopkeeper, who kills you with his super lightning spell, if you steal? Why isn't he the one saving the day? Couldn't he just walk into all the dungeons and fry every monster inside leaving the easy part?
to:
* We all know the infamous shopkeeper, who kills you with his super lightning spell, if you steal? Why isn't he the one saving the day? Couldn't he just walk into all the dungeons and fry every monster inside leaving the easy part?making it easy?
Changed line(s) 53 (click to see context) from:
* Why did the developers remove the ability to skip the text from common dungeon items? (keys, compass)
to:
* Why did the developers remove the ability to skip the text from common dungeon items? items (keys, compass)compass)/
Changed line(s) 81,82 (click to see context) from:
*** Or a maybe Rito?
to:
*** Or a maybe a Rito?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** I guess we're supposed to assume that calling her a "pro" means he's calling her out on cheating/hacking (grabbing him requires moving the crane in a way it's usually not able to go). Link has won a lot, but he's done it honestly.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
[[folder: Pro vs. champ]]
* In the Switch remake, once you've won all of the figurines at the Trendy Game, the proprietor acknowledges you as a "champ" and offers you a discount on the playing price in the future. That's all well and good, but that version also keeps the scene where he kicks Marin out of the shop after she "wins" him as a prize in the game, as he says she's too much of a pro and that pros aren't allowed in. Where's the logic in getting kicked out if you're a "pro", but getting celebrated and rewarded for being a "champ", exactly?
[[/folder]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Simply put, and other games aside, he travelled out of Hyrule by land, ''then'' boarded a boat.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Deleted line(s) 72 (click to see context) :
Changed line(s) 74,86 (click to see context) from:
** Since the release of Hyrule Historia, this was answered quite nicely: from Labrynna. (In fact, if you compare the two, the ship at the end of a linked completion of [[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOracleGames Oracle of Ages]] already had a strong resemblance to the ship in the intro of Link's Awakening.)
*** Hyrule Encyclopedia retcons this again. The Link of the ''Oracle'' games is a different character.
*** Do you have the exact source for that statement? I don't mean to offend, but I have a hard time believing two books released by the same company would contradict each other so much.
*** [[https://www.nintendo.co.jp/character/zelda/history/index.html This page on Nintendo's official website]], which puts the ''Oracle'' games ''after'' Link's Awakening, though apparently it still maintains that ''Oracle'' Link is the same guy as the one from ''A Link to the Past'' and ''Link's Awakening''. To answer your other point, the devs have said [[https://www.famitsu.com/news/201808/01161782.html here]] that they still intend to keep the timeline somewhat fluid; while they're almost certainly not going to change, say, the relationship between ''Wind Waker'', ''Twilight Princess'', and ''Ocarina of Time'', games that are shakier in their placement, like the ''Four Swords'' trilogy, may still be shifted around depending on the circumstances.
*** I'm not quite buying what their website says. (And I especially don't buy anything the encyclopedia says -- that's the same book that tried to explain away Termina as being an imaginary world that disappeared at the end of the game.) There are things about ''Link's Awakening'' that only really make sense by assuming the ''Oracle'' games came first, like many of the residents of Koholint being based off of people Link met in the ''Oracle'' games, and Link making it a point to write his name on his sword and shield after what happened with the Tokay in ''Oracle of Ages''. Distancing these games from one another in the timeline would be one thing, but just reversing the order in which they occurred makes absolutely no sense.
*** Whether you buy it or not, this is Nintendo's new canon. While there are definitely some errors in the book, Miyamoto and Aonuma have talked about the change to the timeline a few times leading up to the release of the Switch remake. As far as "Termina stopped existing", the book was written by Nintendo employees but is supplementary material. It also appears to be a recent reinterpretation of the game, and the Encyclopedia didn't have much of the producers' input since it wasn't supposed to have a lot of new information anyway. My guess is either some notes got mixed up (conflating Termina with Koholint) or it was made up to explain away things like the Moon having a face.\\
\\
In any case, Link putting his name on his sword and shield because of the Tokay is only obvious in hindsight. ''Link's Awakening'' came out 8 years before ''Oracle of Ages''. I think it's more likely he did it because he's a Knight of Hyrule after the events of ''A Link to the Past'' and he didn't want other people using ''his'', since they were heirlooms from his uncle rather than standard issue equipment. As for the characters being based off of people he knew, even the on character from his chunk of the timeline that seems similar isn't; Zelda and Marin have different hair color, skin tone, and ear shape. The rest of the [=NPCs=] are unique to this game, and the majority are talking animals. It also begs the question of why Link didn't have the mark of the Triforce on his hand in ''Link's Awakening'', since it was an important plot point in both of the ''Oracle'' games.
*** ...But “in hindsight” is how all prequels work. If you’re going to say that the events of the game can’t be viewed in hindsight, then that means the Encyclopedia shouldn’t matter either. It would mean that every new game shouldn’t matter, that each one exists entirely in a vacuum with no effect on or from the ones that came before it, if we aren’t allowed to look at any of them in hindsight.\\
\\
And even if they’re the creators, their word should not be able to trump so much in-game evidence like this. The Oracle games weren’t prequels just because the developers said so — it’s also because there are a lot of things about them that mesh together with this one and fill in some of its holes.
*** Also, don’t know if you realized this, but your point about Zelda and Marin not resembling each other works against you, because the Oracle games are the only related titles to this one where Princess Zelda resembles Marin — they even used the same sprites for the two of them! But as you’ve pointed out, setting the Oracle games after Link’s Awakening means that the only iteration of Zelda Link has met before (the one from A Link to the Past) does not look remotely like Marin without the Oracle games to retcon her design. If anything, what they should’ve done is disconnect A Link to the Past from the saga rather than relocating the Oracle games, since it’s the one that doesn’t make as much sense.
*** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline?
*** Hyrule Encyclopedia retcons this again. The Link of the ''Oracle'' games is a different character.
*** Do you have the exact source for that statement? I don't mean to offend, but I have a hard time believing two books released by the same company would contradict each other so much.
*** [[https://www.nintendo.co.jp/character/zelda/history/index.html This page on Nintendo's official website]], which puts the ''Oracle'' games ''after'' Link's Awakening, though apparently it still maintains that ''Oracle'' Link is the same guy as the one from ''A Link to the Past'' and ''Link's Awakening''. To answer your other point, the devs have said [[https://www.famitsu.com/news/201808/01161782.html here]] that they still intend to keep the timeline somewhat fluid; while they're almost certainly not going to change, say, the relationship between ''Wind Waker'', ''Twilight Princess'', and ''Ocarina of Time'', games that are shakier in their placement, like the ''Four Swords'' trilogy, may still be shifted around depending on the circumstances.
*** I'm not quite buying what their website says. (And I especially don't buy anything the encyclopedia says -- that's the same book that tried to explain away Termina as being an imaginary world that disappeared at the end of the game.) There are things about ''Link's Awakening'' that only really make sense by assuming the ''Oracle'' games came first, like many of the residents of Koholint being based off of people Link met in the ''Oracle'' games, and Link making it a point to write his name on his sword and shield after what happened with the Tokay in ''Oracle of Ages''. Distancing these games from one another in the timeline would be one thing, but just reversing the order in which they occurred makes absolutely no sense.
*** Whether you buy it or not, this is Nintendo's new canon. While there are definitely some errors in the book, Miyamoto and Aonuma have talked about the change to the timeline a few times leading up to the release of the Switch remake. As far as "Termina stopped existing", the book was written by Nintendo employees but is supplementary material. It also appears to be a recent reinterpretation of the game, and the Encyclopedia didn't have much of the producers' input since it wasn't supposed to have a lot of new information anyway. My guess is either some notes got mixed up (conflating Termina with Koholint) or it was made up to explain away things like the Moon having a face.\\
\\
In any case, Link putting his name on his sword and shield because of the Tokay is only obvious in hindsight. ''Link's Awakening'' came out 8 years before ''Oracle of Ages''. I think it's more likely he did it because he's a Knight of Hyrule after the events of ''A Link to the Past'' and he didn't want other people using ''his'', since they were heirlooms from his uncle rather than standard issue equipment. As for the characters being based off of people he knew, even the on character from his chunk of the timeline that seems similar isn't; Zelda and Marin have different hair color, skin tone, and ear shape. The rest of the [=NPCs=] are unique to this game, and the majority are talking animals. It also begs the question of why Link didn't have the mark of the Triforce on his hand in ''Link's Awakening'', since it was an important plot point in both of the ''Oracle'' games.
*** ...But “in hindsight” is how all prequels work. If you’re going to say that the events of the game can’t be viewed in hindsight, then that means the Encyclopedia shouldn’t matter either. It would mean that every new game shouldn’t matter, that each one exists entirely in a vacuum with no effect on or from the ones that came before it, if we aren’t allowed to look at any of them in hindsight.\\
\\
And even if they’re the creators, their word should not be able to trump so much in-game evidence like this. The Oracle games weren’t prequels just because the developers said so — it’s also because there are a lot of things about them that mesh together with this one and fill in some of its holes.
*** Also, don’t know if you realized this, but your point about Zelda and Marin not resembling each other works against you, because the Oracle games are the only related titles to this one where Princess Zelda resembles Marin — they even used the same sprites for the two of them! But as you’ve pointed out, setting the Oracle games after Link’s Awakening means that the only iteration of Zelda Link has met before (the one from A Link to the Past) does not look remotely like Marin without the Oracle games to retcon her design. If anything, what they should’ve done is disconnect A Link to the Past from the saga rather than relocating the Oracle games, since it’s the one that doesn’t make as much sense.
*** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline?
to:
** Since Depends on which version of the release of Hyrule Historia, this was answered quite nicely: from Labrynna. (In fact, if timeline you compare the two, the ship at the end of a linked completion of [[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOracleGames Oracle of Ages]] already had a strong resemblance go by. According to the ship in the intro of Link's Awakening.)
*** Hyrule Encyclopedia retcons this again. The Link of''Hyrule Historia'', the ''Oracle'' games is come before this one, and in a different character.
*** Do you have the exact source for that statement? I don't mean to offend, but I have a hard time believing two books released byLinked ending, we see Link departing Holodrum/Labrynna in the same company would contradict each other boat seen in this game's intro, so much.
*** [[https://www.nintendo.co.jp/character/zelda/history/index.html This page on Nintendo's official website]],that's how he boarded it. If you go by the ''Encyclopedia'', which puts says that the ''Oracle'' games ''after'' Link's Awakening, though apparently it still maintains that ''Oracle'' Link is the same guy as the one from ''A Link to the Past'' and ''Link's Awakening''. To answer your other point, the devs have said [[https://www.famitsu.com/news/201808/01161782.html here]] that they still intend to keep the timeline somewhat fluid; while they're almost certainly not going to change, say, the relationship between ''Wind Waker'', ''Twilight Princess'', and ''Ocarina of Time'', games that are shakier in their placement, like the ''Four Swords'' trilogy, may still be shifted around depending on the circumstances.
*** I'm not quite buying what their website says. (And I especiallycome after this one, we don't buy anything the encyclopedia says -- that's the same book that tried have reason to explain away Termina as being an imaginary world that disappeared at the end of the game.) There are things about ''Link's Awakening'' that only really make sense by assuming the ''Oracle'' games came first, like many of the residents of Koholint being based off of people Link met in the ''Oracle'' games, and Link making it a point to write his name on his sword and shield after what happened with the Tokay in ''Oracle of Ages''. Distancing these games from one another in the timeline would be one thing, but just reversing the order in which they occurred makes absolutely no sense.
*** Whether you buy it or not, this is Nintendo's new canon. Whileassume there are definitely some errors in the book, Miyamoto and Aonuma have talked about the change to the timeline a few times leading up to the release of the Switch remake. As far as "Termina stopped existing", the book was written by Nintendo employees but is supplementary material. It also appears to be a recent reinterpretation of the game, and the Encyclopedia didn't have much of the producers' input since it wasn't supposed to have a lot of new information anyway. My guess is either some notes got mixed up (conflating Termina with Koholint) or it was made up to explain away things like the Moon having a face.\\
\\
Inisn't any case, Link putting his name on his sword and shield because of the Tokay is only obvious in hindsight. ''Link's Awakening'' came out 8 years before ''Oracle of Ages''. I think it's more likely he did it because he's a Knight of Hyrule after the events of ''A Link to the Past'' and he didn't want other people using ''his'', since they were heirlooms from his uncle rather than standard issue equipment. As for the characters being based off of people he knew, even the on character from his chunk of the timeline that seems similar isn't; Zelda and Marin have different hair color, skin tone, and ear shape. The rest of the [=NPCs=] are unique to this game, and the majority are talking animals. It also begs the question of why Link didn't have the mark of the Triforce on his hand in ''Link's Awakening'', since it was an important plot point in both of the ''Oracle'' games.
*** ...But “in hindsight” is how all prequels work. If you’re going to say that the events of the game can’t be viewed in hindsight, then that means the Encyclopedia shouldn’t matter either. It would mean that every new game shouldn’t matter, that each one exists entirely in a vacuum with no effect on or from the ones that came before it, if we aren’t allowed to look at any of them in hindsight.\\
\\
And even if they’re the creators, their word should not be able to trump so much in-game evidence like this. The Oracle games weren’t prequelsway over Hyrule's mountains [[GameplayAndStorySegregation just because the developers said so — it’s also because there are a lot of things about them Link isn't able to go past them.]] Either way, we know that mesh together with this one Impa and fill in some the Knights of its holes.
*** Also, don’t know if you realized this, but your point about Zelda and Marin not resembling each other works against you, becauseHyrule made it from Hyrule to Holodrum to protect the Oracle games are of Seasons (unlike Link, who was sent via the only related titles to this one where Princess Zelda resembles Marin — they even used the same sprites Triforce), so there must be some way for the two of them! But as you’ve pointed out, setting the Oracle games after Link’s Awakening means that the only iteration of Zelda Link has met before (the one from A Link them to the Past) does not look remotely like Marin without the Oracle games to retcon her design. If anything, what they should’ve have done is disconnect A Link to the Past from the saga rather than relocating the Oracle games, since it’s the one that doesn’t make as much sense.
*** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline?it.
*** Hyrule Encyclopedia retcons this again. The Link of
*** Do you have the exact source for that statement? I don't mean to offend, but I have a hard time believing two books released by
*** [[https://www.nintendo.co.jp/character/zelda/history/index.html This page on Nintendo's official website]],
*** I'm not quite buying what their website says. (And I especially
*** Whether you buy it or not, this is Nintendo's new canon. While
\\
In
*** ...But “in hindsight” is how all prequels work. If you’re going to say that the events of the game can’t be viewed in hindsight, then that means the Encyclopedia shouldn’t matter either. It would mean that every new game shouldn’t matter, that each one exists entirely in a vacuum with no effect on or from the ones that came before it, if we aren’t allowed to look at any of them in hindsight.\\
\\
And even if they’re the creators, their word should not be able to trump so much in-game evidence like this. The Oracle games weren’t prequels
*** Also, don’t know if you realized this, but your point about Zelda and Marin not resembling each other works against you, because
*** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 86 (click to see context) from:
*** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline.
to:
*** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline.timeline?
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Changed line(s) 86 (click to see context) from:
** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline.
to:
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** Also also, you say that I am wrong for refusing to accept a portion of the book as canon, yet at the same time, you try to reason that another portion of it is not canon. Why are you right to reason about Termina’s existence, yet I’m not right for debating the timeline.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
*** The Dreamer Art Book included with the Switch update renames them Goo Specters.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None
Added DiffLines:
** The localisation team probably didn't realise those were also Mario enemies. And really, of the three examples given, only one actually looks like the Mario enemy.
