Line #94 WMG/PeterPan


1	[[WMG: Rufio was destined to be Peter's true successor as leader of the Lost Boys.]]
2
3	Nether Rufio or any of the other boys in the movie ''Hook'' are so much as mentioned, suggesting that they simply weren’t there at the time. Also, Rufio seemed to be the oldest of the boys from ''Hook'', as Peter seemed the oldest before.
4
5	All of the other Lost Boys accompanied Wendy and her brothers back to London. Peter ventured to London out of lonesomeness and chose to stay as the story goes.
6
7	The next boy to enter Neverland was Rufio. He may have entered only days after or several years since Peter's departure. He became the leader of the next bunch of lost boys, explaining his words that “I've got Pan's Sword, I'm the Pan now!” Rufio seemed to have little or no regard for Tinker Bell, suggesting that he'd never been under Peter's influence and never respected her. It also gives more ground to Rufio's hostility towards Peter, seeing him as a challenge to the position that is rightfully his.
8
9	[[WMG: Neverland is Limbo and its inhabitants are somehow FlyingDutchman-style lost souls.]]
10	They're all stuck in a StableTimeLoop, which would work nicely except that time has no meaning on the island--which makes it more of a GroundhogDayLoop thing. Everyone who comes in does so at a certain age and is stuck there. Hence Hook is an adult, Tiger Lilly's a child as are the Lost Boys and Pan himself.
11	* Flying Dutchman corollary (and slight refutation): everyone has the ability to escape, what with free will and all, but chooses not to. The "game" is more interesting that way.
12	* The lost soul thing is ''sorta'' true in the case of the Lost Boys. They get to Neverland when they fall out of their bassinets as babies and nobody notices or claims them. But everyone in Neverland actually ages except for Peter, including them. Where the pirates and Indians come from is beyond me, though. Maybe the Indians went there to escape the white man's greed.
13	** In the novel (and in the Fox animated series) its stated that the pirates are in Neverland essentially by accident: a freak tornado lifted them up and set them there.
14
15	[[WMG: Captain Hook is Peter Pan's "adult" form, and that's why they hate each other so. It also explains why they have so much difficulty ridding themselves of each other.]]
16	Peter's leaving as a child was influenced not only by the window being closed, but also by catching a glimpse of the future, where he'd actually ''become'' none other than his hated enemy, Captain Hook. Peter hated his older self out of fear (that's he'll become strict and boring), and Hook hated Peter because he saw his younger self as flighty and deficient. Unlike Peter, Hook (naturally) knew who he was all along.
17	** [[Film/{{Hook}} But Peter's adult form is Robin Williams, and Captain Hook is Dustin Hoffman, NOT Williams!]]
18	** [[{{Nettik}} This troper]] thinks that WMG is brilliant. Especially when you consider that in the Mary Martin version of the musical, Peter knows just how to catch Hook's eye in "Oh, My Mysterious Lady."
19
20	[[WMG: Captain Hook was responsible for the death of [[WesternAnimation/TheLittleMermaid1989 Queen Athena, Ariel's mom]].]]
21	In the prequel to ''WesternAnimation/{{The Little Mermaid\|1989}}'', the cove where Ariel's mother is kidnapped looks a lot like the mermaid cove in Neverland. And the ship responsible flies a pirate flag. Who's the local pirate of Neverland? Captain Hook. Ergo, Captain Hook indirectly caused the events of ''The Little Mermaid''.
22	* So Neverland is Elba?
23
24	[[WMG: Neverland is sort of an afterlife for children.]]
25	Peter Pan is sort of a kid-friendly Grim Reaper who guides children to their ideal afterlife (it says so in the original book). The Lost Boys were all dead and in their version of heaven, perhaps the pirates were all dead as well and in their version of hell. Wendy, John and Michael were all having a near-death experience.
26
27	* Wouldn't that make Peter's comment about "girls are too clever to fall out of their prams" a reference to the fact that boys are more vulnerable to Sudden Infant Death Syndrome, among other things?
28
29	* This actually works for the Disney movie, but for the book and other adaptations, it leaves a pretty big plot hole in the case of the Lost Boys, who all at the end leave Neverland, are adopted by the Darlings and go on to grow up and lead normal lives as adults. Are we talking some sort of miraculous resurrection, or are they ghosts or zombies or what?
30	** By escaping the afterlife they were able to somehow reincarnate perhaps.
31	** Near-death experience?
32
33	[[WMG: Peter Pan is a ghost.]]
34	Unlike in the above guess, the Lost Boys and Darling children are all alive, but Peter is dead. Peter doesn't realize he's dead, nor does anyone else, but this is the real reason why he never grows up. He died in infancy: this is what actually happened when he "ran away from home the day he was born," and it explains why his mother didn't wait for him to come home and instead "replaced" him with [[PosthumousSibling another child]]. The reason why he appears as a preteen instead of a baby is because he doesn't have a real physical form, so he can appear as whatever age he wants to be. It also explains why he doesn't need to eat, but can survive on make-believe meals, and why, in the original play, he never lets anyone touch him, though he doesn't know why: he instinctively avoids it because if anyone did touch him, their hand would go through him and they would realize what he is. This guess was allegedly first made by one of the first actresses to play Peter onstage, who suggested the "No one must ever touch me" line to Barrie. It also fits with the fact that Barrie was inspired to write the story by his brother David, who would "never grow up" because he died as a boy.
35
36	[[WMG: Peter Pan is secretly a ninja.]]
37	That'd explain why he seems to dislike pirates so much.
38
39	[[WMG: Peter Pan had, has and will have adventures with other children, ''not just the Darling children.'']]
40	The [[WesternAnimation/PeterPan Disney adaptation]] begins with the following narration: "All this has happened before. And it will all happen again. But '''this time''' it happened in London..." Emphasis on the "this time".
41	* Confirmed in most, if not all adaptations, including the original book itself.
42
43	[[WMG: Neverland changes as kids' imaginations do]]
44	The Pirates and Indians thing was just around because that's what kids played at. By now it's probably full of superheroes and giant robots.
45	* Nowadays, the Pirates probably occupy themselves with fighting cliche ''Manga/{{Naruto}}''-style ninjas when Peter Pan is having another adventure.
46	* Confirmed by the original book. Neverland is different for each individual child. It's not even always an island, although in most cases it is.
47
48	[[WMG: Hook is Peter's younger brother]]
49	Peter mentioned seeing a younger brother in his old room and that's what made him believe his parents didn't want or remember him anymore. So, thinking he could take care of his brother better than his parents, Peter stole little James away and raised him as a lost boy. As the years went by the brothers began to drift further and further apart, eventually having an argument/disagreement so bad they permanently went separate ways. Due to being in Neverland, they forgot their relationship entirely.
50	** {{Jossed}} by WordOfGod. Peter's younger brother is actually named Michael (no relation to Michael Darling), and J. M. Barrie actually started to write a sequel to the book featuring this character. The sequel was eventually scrapped, though some of its ideas were included in later revisions of the stage play.
51
52	[[WMG: Peter Pan and Wendy are both teens.]]
53	Although most/all productions make them be about 8-11, but judging by the fact that [[ToyShip Wendy]]/Tinker Bell/[[IndianMaiden Tiger Lily]] have crushes on him, it's more likely they're all 13-15. Peter has all his milk teeth because he is still a child mentally.
54	* This certainly seems to be the case in the Disney version, where Peter looks about 14-15 (which was actually Bobby Driscoll's age at the time of the film's development/release), with Wendy at 13-14, which would be around the right age for her to enter puberty and start menstruating.
55	* Doesn't the book say Wendy is 11 or 12 (it's one of the two, I think it's said she's 12) or so, and Peter is "just her size"? I think Wendy is meant to be 11/12, John is 8, and Michael is 2, but I can't think where I got those numbers from. Peter would logically be around Wendy's age, though there's a slight hole in the plot in that the first two lines of the book state that only Peter never grows up, that all children know "soon" that they must grow up, and that Wendy knew it from when she was two, which would imply Peter would not be much more than two, as it's implied he less chose not to grow up, than it was he doesn't think he WILL grow up and that's completely stopped him from it.
56	* It's generally accepted that Peter is between 12-15 years old and strange as it sounds, its entirely possible for a teenager to still have their baby teeth. It generally happens because of a condition called dental ankylosis that causes baby teeth to fuse to the jaw bone and prevents them from falling out. It is also possible that there is no permanent tooth under the gums pushing on the baby tooth. Some teenagers retain baby teeth because of trauma, obstructions, pathology, or misaligned permanent teeth under them.
57	** Could his dental condition also be caused by living on a magic island that inhibits growth?
58
59	[[WMG: Peter Pan is a [[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime Kokiri.]]]]
60	Or a relative. I mean, come on. Green clothes? Sidekick fairy? Never grows up?
61
62	[[WMG: Peter Pan grows up to become [[Series/DoctorWho the Doctor.]]]]
63	Great adventures? Favorite city is London? Taking on companions from time to time? Peter just learned a new way to fly.
64	* It's scary how awesome that would be.
65	* And he wants to be ginger! Only it will be the first time since his first reincarnation.
66	* Peter Pan, ''grow up''? C'mon, this ain't ''Film/{{Hook}}'', y'know. (That said, the Doctor might, just might, be an exception to Peter's belief that all grownups are worthless.)
67	** He doesn't grow up. Hook kills him, he regenerates into a new shape.
68
69
70	[[WMG: Aunt Millicent (in the 2003 film) really is Slightly's mother.]]
71	Think about it: they look and act so much alike, always think they have a handle on things even when they don't, are a little pompous but well-meaning and affectionate deep down. Aunt Millicent's not a maiden aunt; she wears those black matronly dresses and hangs out with the Darlings because she was widowed long ago. She also sadly misplaced her infant son, who found himself in Neverland (since they're both so flighty and incompetent). Tinker Bell just reunited them at the end.
72	* Could also apply to Liza the maid from the stage play and book.
73
74	[[WMG: Children in Neverland ''do'' grow up, just at a much slower pace.]]
75	In Neverland, time moves more slowly, but is perceived at the same pace as it is on Earth. For example, the Darling children are in Neverland for three or four days, but only a few hours have passed in London.
76	* Jossed in the official sequel (ie approved by GOSCH) when the reason children grow up is that they look ahead.
77	*** The novel is a little vague on whether ''all'' the Lost Boys grow up while in Neverland, or if this is just some individual cases, but it's at least mentioned that it does occasionally happen, upon which Peter either kicks them out or outright kills them (it's never completely made clear which it is).
78	*** It's probably manipulable. The island kind of weeps without Peter as he's the perfect inhabitant. He can fly without dust, he can stop aging all together. The others are trying but have doubts, so they age slower but would never be able to be on Peter's level when it comes to that belief.
79	*** ''Peter Pan in Scarlet'' expands on this idea and introduces the concept that the Lost Boys ''can'' avoid growing up, but only by utterly refusing to even entertain the idea. If a Lost Boy ever seriously speculates about what he'd like to be when growing up, he ''will'' start growing up, upon which he is banished by Peter. The same book also introduces the Roarers, a band of former Lost Boys who grew up and were banished by Peter, but since grown-ups can't fly they're stuck in Neverland, and basically lead a miserable life, hating everyone and everything.
80	*** Ironically a similar idea was used in ''Fox's Peter Pan and the Pirates'', in an episode where Hook proudly exclaims he's superior to Peter Pan because he got to experience the wonder of being an adult, something Peter will never know... and now Peter wants to grow up, and he ends up doing so (though somehow things get reset at the end of the story).
81
82	[[WMG: There is a portal to Neverland somewhere in the Atlantic Ocean in the early 1700s.]]
83	That's how period pirates keep winding up there, even when kids from TheEighties start joining the Lost Boys.
84	* TheBermudaTriangle, perhaps?
85	** Or something similar to it.
86
87	[[WMG: Never Never Land was an early 1900s Kids Next Door experiment into halting the aging process.]]
88	It was created to test a cure for adulthood; the result being that the children were too busy playing with each other to actually send in their experimental data to Moon Base. Thus, KND considers Never Never Land a failed experiment, having received no contact from the operatives there.
89	* This would've made for an insanely awesome episode.
90
91	[[WMG: Peter Pan is ''not'' native to Never Land]]
92	He somehow discovered Never Land after running away from home under similar circumstances to Wendy being forced to leave the nursery.
93	* The book does support half of this - Peter tells Wendy that he left home and stayed away "for moons and moons and moons" until he came back to find the window barred and his mother with another little boy. Whether or not this actually happened is questionable, but Peter believes it did.
94	** If J.M. Barrie's ''Peter Pan in Kensington Gardens'' is any indication, it did.
95
96	[[WMG: Captain Hook is a vampire.]]
97	There are clues that point to Captain Hook being close to two hundred years old. (Contrary to popular belief, Neverland doesn't magically stop everyone from aging - fairies live out full lifespans and die of old age in approximately or even under a year, and it's made clear that the Lost Boys do grow and age - Peter banishes if they start looking like they're growing up.) That said, Hook has some other... peculiarities about him. He is described as looking "cadaverous" (ie, corpselike), his eyes glow red when he's angry, and his blood is unusually dark in color. All of these would make sense if he were an undead vampire.
98
99	[[WMG: Mamie Mannering from ''Peter Pan in Kensington Gardens'' grew up to be Wendy's mother...]]
100	...or at least one of her female ancestors. Consider:
101	* "Mamie" can be a nickname for either "Mary" (Wendy's mother's name) or "Margaret" (Wendy's granddaughter's name, and so quite possibly a family name).
102	* There's some serious GenerationXerox going on in the Wendy line, and Mamie has nearly the same dialogue with Peter as Wendy does...the fairies in Kensington Gardens even built a house around her!
103	* Mamie has a "fairy wedding" with Peter without being aware of it. This created a mysterious bond which tied Peter to Mamie and her descendants--that's why he came to Wendy's house in the first place, though he'd nearly forgotten Mamie.
104	* The Audible Original radio drama adaptation takes this idea and runs with it, with much of the first episode dedicated to a Mary telling her children about the time when she was a child and stayed the night in Kenshington Gardens, where she saw a fairy ball and met a boy named Peter Pan. Though the events of ''Kensington Gardens'' are heavily altered to fit better in with the more familiar story (Peter isn't a baby here, and he doesn't live in Kensington Gardens, he's just visiting), but [[CompositeCharacter the adaptation is very clear that in this version at least, Mary and Mamie are the same person]].
105
106	[[WMG: Peter Pan in Kensington Gardens is one of Peter's stories]]
107	He just made it up to spread to people as the truth, but like others it's a big lie with some possible truths mixed in.
108
109	[[WMG: Related to the top theory, the 2003 ''Peter Pan'' is the true prequel to ''Hook''.]]
110	Hook was able to get out of the crock's belly by cutting through his belly, killing him.
111
112	[[WMG: ''Peter Pan'' takes place in the same universe as ''Film/MaryPoppins'']]
113	And takes place a year or so later. Or at least, the 2003 film does. If you look at the men who run the bank when George Darling is working there, it's a group of little old men, and one younger, dark-haired man. Which is how it ends in ''Mary Poppins'', with the dark-haired Mr Banks joining on as a manager with the old Dawes men. ''Film/MaryPoppins'' was also shot to take place in 1910 (according to Mr Banks), and ''Peter Pan'' is usually shown to take place in 1911, when the original novel was written (although the play premiered earlier, in 1904). You could also make an argument that Mary Poppins is herself a denizen of Neverland, which is how she stays unaging (even though this usually only applies to Peter), and maybe even how she has magic.
114
115	[[WMG: Captain Hook lied: Losing your shadow does not affect your ability to fly at all.]]
116	In ''Peter Pan in Scarlet'', Hook claims that if you don't have a shadow, you can't fly. This directly contradicts the original novel, where Peter seems to be flying about just fine after losing his shadow. ContinuitySnarl, then? Not necessarily. In ''Peter Pan in Kenshington Gardens'' it's established that if you ''doubt'' your ability to fly you won't be able to do it. Hook may just have made up the "shadow" claim to sow doubt in the children's hearts, to stop them from flying away. It's not like it would be out of character for him to try something like that.
117
118	[[WMG: Peter's ban on adults isn't a blanket ban.]]
119	Some adults can and are welcome to join Peter in Neverland. In the 1955 musical, we see Liza, the Darlings' maid, go to Neverland with the children. Now, as a maid of all work, Liza would've been 16 at the very youngest and quite likely at least 20. If all adults were indeed banned from Peter's gang, surely Liza wouldn't have been welcome. Yet we see her fly in and join the Lost Boys, and even aid in the capture of the Jolly Roger. And the only reaction we see between her and Peter? He teaches her how to crow. Not exactly what we'd expect of someone who's put a blanket ban on all adults in his ranks.
120
121	[[WMG: Captain Hook is Israel Hands from ''Literature/TreasureIsland'']]
122	The only real description ever given to Hooks true identity is that he had been the boatswain of UsefulNotes/{{Blackbeard}}, and was the only man "Barbacoa" feared. Barbacoa is another name for Long John Silver, and what do these two pirates have in common? The only survivor of Blackbeard's crew was a man named Israel Hands, and a man of the same name worked for Silver. Granted, Hands did technically die during ''Treasure Island'', but that could simply serve as an origin story for why he would be in Neverland in the first place.
123	* While this is really an interesting idea, this is sadly {{Jossed}}. ''Literature/PeterPanInScarlet'', Peter Pan's official sequel, reveals that [[spoiler:Hook being with Blackbeard was a lie created by rumours started by his enemies, as he would never have served such an uneducated man]]. Still, considering that this book is copyrighted while the original isn't (and therefore people can make their own canon), and the sequel wasn't written by Barrie anyway, it's not crazy to make a background story for him based on this. Plus, in ''Literature/TreasureIsland'', while it's true that Jim Hawkins gave him two shots using his pistols and Hands fell into the water, [[UncertainDoom it's never specifically said he died after that]]. And even if he did, Hook is said in the book to have blood with unnatural colour and that "two red spots appeared in [his eyes] and lit up horribly" when he was angry, while also looking "cadaverous". It's not weird to think there's something supernatural in him, considering these traits, so Hands must've very well being either cured or revived using some sort of magical item or fenomena. Then again, this is just {{Fanon}}.
124
125	[[WMG: Peter didn't cut off Hook's hand just because.]]
126	During one of their first confrontations, Hook snatched Tinker Bell away from Peter, threatening to harm her if he didn't turn himself in. And if Hook wasn't going to let Tink go, Peter figured he'd have to make him do it, by cutting off Hook's hand so Tink could break free.
127
128	[[WMG: Hook and his crew are former lost boys.]]
129	When lost boys grow up, Peter "thins them out", whatever that means. Those who managed to escape their ill fates formed a pirate crew. This also gives the pirates a justified reason to hate Peter.
130
131	[[WMG: There was always a Pan, but it wasn't always Peter.]]
132	When Peter first came to Neverland, he was brought into the Lost Boys by the previous Pan. Presumably, said Pan was killed by the pirates (either by Hook's blade or maybe even [[EatenAlive fed to the crocodile]]), and Peter had to step forward and become the new Pan himself.
133
134	[[WMG: Mrs. Darling is related to [[WesternAnimation/AliceInWonderland Alice]].]]
135	Not only does the Disney version of Wendy both look and sound uncannily like Alice (Creator/KathrynBeaumont served as the voice and live-action model for them both), but her mother looks and sounds like Alice's sister (they were also voiced by the same actress, Heather Angel). Since both stories' "real world" settings are in England, about forty or fifty years apart from each other, maybe Alice's sister was the mother of Mrs. Darling. Maybe soon after the events of ''Peter Pan'', Wendy will tell the story of her adventures in Neverland to her Great-Aunt Alice, who will be surprisingly willing to believe it was more than just a dream.
136
137	[[WMG: Neverland is [[TabletopGame/ChangelingTheLost realm of Arcadia]]; Peter is a True Fae, and the Lost Boys are Changelings.]]
138	How the Indians, the Pirates and Tinker Bell fit into this is debatable; perhaps they are ''all'' Changelings, perhaps Captain Hook is a rival Fae with the Pirates as his own set of Changelings, or perhaps they're all just "set dressing" and the only real beings in the realm are Peter, the Lost Boys, and Wendy's bloodline which passes down the role of Mother.
139
140	[[WMG: Captain Hook is Lord James Beauclerk, bastard son of King Charles II]]

Context WMG / PeterPan