Discussion Recap / DoctorWhoS32E12ClosingTime

Figured River was the astronaut ever since the astronaut's first scene in "The Impossible Astronaut," when she shoots it, fails to kill it and knowingly mutters "No, of course not." Kind of The Un Twist there. I didn't predict the way it happened, as I try to think of River Song as little as possible.

I didn't...

It wasn't much of a Reveal, really, remember how 'Let's Kill Hitler' had that character that hunted her down for killing The Doctor?

The suspect pool has always been pretty small, and we've known since "Let's Kill Hitler" that the Silence and Madame Kovarian are using River as their personal Doctor assassin. What's interesting isn't *who* the astronaut is, it's the final bridge between the end of Closing Time and the start of Impossible Astronaut, and how this whole situation will resolve. Besides, like with the "A Good Man Goes To War" cliffhanger, the fact that they're giving us the reveal at the end of 6x12 indicates that there's much more to the story — possibly even an entirely different outcome — than we think.

It could equally have been the Doctor, given the similarities between Eleven's conversation with the astronaut and Four's conversation with the Watcher in Logopolis. Could still be - remember who entered and who left the Pandorica.

I for one didn't see it coming at all, but that's because all along we've been lead to believe that it's Young River in the space suit, not older River! And now I can't wait for the finale, as Bronzethumb noted, "the fact that they're giving us the reveal at the end of 6x12 indicates that there's much to the story - possibly an entirely different outcome - than we think" And I for one can't wait to see it!!! I am so excited!!! :D

OK, that makes much more sense than River trying to kill the Doctor after Melody already did it as a child... But does that mean it's ending? no more Doctor Who? that'll be really hard to accept for me :(

Of course it's not ending! The Doctor will either change time, trick out time, or simply death will not be The End (ala the Master).

Besides, the Christmas episode casting and theme has already been announced!

"I for one didn't see it coming at all, but that's because all along we've been lead to believe that it's Young River in the space suit, not older River! "

That was a pretty good twist even though it never made any sense it had to be River at all. There's nothing special about her, any idiot in the suit could have pulled the trigger...

^ Technically true, but making it hot Time Lord on Time Lord action made it far more likely for it to become a fixed point in time, thus drastically decreasing the odds that the Doctor could do some timey-wimey stuff and save himself.

What?

River is part Timelord, or at least part Timelord-ish.

^^ Making the killer a Time Lord (or the closest they could approximate) increases the odds that the Doctor's death be a fixed point in time, that cannot be undone. It's really quite Dangerously Genre-Savvy; if it weren't a fixed point in time, then the Doctor would've found a way to Take a Third Option (as he always does) and undo it. This way he can't do that without, you know, destroying time.

"^ Technically true, but making it hot Time Lord on Time Lord action made it far more likely for it to become a fixed point in time, thus drastically decreasing the odds that the Doctor could do some timey-wimey stuff and save himself. "

Thank you Larkman you just plugged up what felt like a huge plot hole to me - felt like River's superpower was being the only person to invoke Why Don't You Just Shoot Him? until I read that.

He's getting tired of living. (or at least, that's what they're making it look like)

He was in the 2nd episode too, then grew old, and received a letter.... what's the confusing part about him?

Uh, definitely too gruesome for a saturday evening family show methinks :P

That's a pretty good idea, story wise...but incredibly dark. Especially for, as Carnivac said, a family show. ;)

It was a breather episode. The last three episodes were all dark/upsetting, before that was the River storyline, which is hardly sweetness and light, and before that were the gangers... they most likely decided there should be a bit of a break before the big dramatic finale.

And it still had inevitable darkness with the Doctor being so very tired and the return of the Silence.

It's basically a rule that kids can't die on this show.

That part honestly didn't make a whole lot of sense. Basically, if I understood it properly, River was reading the eyewitness account those three kids gave of The Doctor's last moments. The "thoughts" we were hearing were what they later wrote down.

Really? Huh. Well, that's disappointing. I thought i'd be something more.

I honestly thought for a moment it were Rose and Micky (and...? another girl? I don't know). They kinda reminded them, didn't they? Maybe it was a very short red herring?

^Exactly! That's what I thought too!

That wouldn't have made any sense at all...

Yeah, but it's not like being well thought-out is Moffat's strong suite.

Doesn't entirely make sense that River would have pictures of them as children, but it's plausible enough that she tracked down witnesses and spoke to them. The kids would have watched the TARDIS disappear shortly afterwards, so it's definitely something they would remember for the rest of their lives.

Is it fair to assume that River doesn't have access to time travel technology of her own at this point?

Anytime he's seperated from Amy and Rory for a long while could be any number of years such as before he picks them up again in Let's Kill Hitler or before the events of this episode. Sure gives a big gap where possible stories of the Eleventh Doctor having other companions can be made later on and inserted here much as they do with audio stories of classic Doctors having previously never before mentioned companions.

I'm personally convinced that the 200 years or so occurred during the summer break, and is marked by the acquisition of the Doctors new coat.

According to Wikipedia's page on this episode it's been over two hundred years (for the Doctor) since the last episode. I don't know how correct that is, but it's kind of sad if it's right.