I'm sure there's been discussion about this before, but given that this trope has a pre-esisting name, "Eucatastrophe", why is it being called "Near Villain Victory"?
'Crisis or no, nothing should interfere with tea!' Hide / Show Replies
Glad at least one Maya thinks so. ;)
I also think the current name is overly specific. What if there's no villain? You could still have a situation where all hope seems lost, but the heroes pull through at the last minute.
Edited by 198.91.156.166 'Crisis or no, nothing should interfere with tea!'
I don't think at all that "eucatastrophe" is recognizable. It doesn't have general use.
Let's just say and leave it at that.
I have *never*, before this moment, heard or seen the word "eucatastrophe". "Near Villain Victory", however, has a pretty obvious meaning.
sdmitch16
It seems like this trope occurs so frequently, subversions should be listed instead instead of it being played straight. Even in cases where the audience is expecting a fight at the end, there's usually a point where it looks like the bad guy will win the fight.
Will I be informed if people reply to my discussion post?
Contrast with Deux es Machina?
Should the description of this trope include a contrast between it and Deus ex Machina, since the two are kind of related - the protagonist is saved at the last moment by a sudden twist of fate. What do people think differentiates this trope from Deus Ex Machina? I suggest that thist trope fits into the established framework of the story, while deus ex machina just asspulls something that has no prior reference in the narrative. Agree or disagree?
Hide / Show Replies
The two have nothing to do with each other. Consider:
All-powerful villain is about to win; hero shows up, uses magical powers never shown before to wipe the floor of villain and army. Deus ex Machina + Near-Villain Victory.
Villain with unusual background that makes him essentially impervious to harm, unites a group of disparate elements which would inevitably collapse without him. Hero, throughout the course of the story, gains powers which allow him to remove the villain's invulnerability. The villain almost conquers the capital, but the hero kills him at the last moment. Near-Villain Victory; no Deus ex Machina.
The hero carves through thousands of mooks with ease. The invincible villain shows up; the hero pulls a Wave-Motion Gun out of his rectum. Or: Jenny needs a cake to bring to a party, but her oven is broken! She spends time trying to avoid the obligation and manipulating a friend to make a cake for her, but her mechanic next-door neighbor drops by and repairs her oven. Deus ex Machina; no Near-Villain Victory.
Deus ex Machina refers to the plot resolution; specifically, it comes from nowhere. Near-Villain Victory refers to the situation pre-plot resolution, specifically that it is very bad.
I believe that a large part of the reason for this (in visual mediums anyway) is due to the fact that special effects and stuff blowing up looks cool. If the villain builds an awesome superweapon, and then the hero shuts it down before we get to see the nifty visual effects it generates, the audience is going to feel cheated.