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I would like to recommend \"Super Girl: Contributions to Society\"
Status: Ongoing (Updated Weekly)
Crossover with: Arrow (TV Show), Flash (TV Show), Legends of Tomorrow (TV Show), Batwomen (TV Show)
Tag: Alternate Universe, Shipping Fics, Crossovers
Do you think we should split the page into medium-based pages? It\'s just that each folder isn\'t getting any shorter.
What do we do if we find an author who has recommended their own fanfic? Isn't it against the rules to recommend your own fanfics?
Is there a preferred format for linking to multiple sources, for fics that are available from multiple sources (e.g., both fanfiction.net and archiveofourown.org)?
We could throw another detail in the Synopsis section. Or we could add a new Alternate Sources section. Or we could add a (Link) link at the end of the title line, the way it is done with fics that have their own trope pages.
Where could I recommend a Joker fanfic of the Batman universe? (I'm new btw)
Are upcoming fanfics with a preview allowed?
By the way, how do I recommend a fanfic?Do I recommend it here in discussion board? I'm confused.
Hey guys, I'm a new guy here (though i've been reading tv tropes for years now). I've got a question.
I've just recently started to use the tropes fanfics page to look for some really good fanfics. But I noticed that there's no fanfic page for High school DXD even though it's got its trope page and even pantheon. I'm just curious why it doesn't have one even though there's some real good high school dxd fanfic out there.
Because so far nobody thought of making one. You can create the Fanfic Rec page of this show yourself, by clicking on the "Create new" button of the main page and starting to add your recs.
Someone recommended a fanfic I wrote, but there's a bunch of misspellings and such in their rec, can I edit that, or does me manipulating the entry count as a self-rec?
Fixing spelling is always a free action.
Is there anybody I can ask for advice for posting a reccomendations(specifically I wanted to post one but I could not think of a synopsis so I canceled my edit as I am no good at that)?
Because there are two authors I really want to reccomend but I am completely new to posting on here so I'm not sure what to do correctly(especially when reccomending entire authors and not just one fic).
I apologize if this is long but I am completely new to this and I don't want to screw up.
this page itself is the place where you can get help.
Is there a list of tags or can I use tags that are stated on the Fanfiction page?
Also what if there is a small bit of Lemon in the story(one chapter)?
One small bit is not very relevant. I am not sure if we ought to use tags at all.
So are tags optional and if not then is there a list of tags?
Ok I added the recommendations in the Five Nights At Freddy's Recommendations page(right before it goes to the crossovers near the bottom of the page)
I don't know how I did when formatting it(since it's two at once) and sadly no italicized text since I cant do that on a phone.
I tried to add a Doctor Who fanfiction recommendation (The Blonde Girl by Lumendea), but instead of displaying the title, all it says is , with a link to the story. I'm not sure what I did wrong, but shouldn't it say the title?
Never mind, I fixed it! I just had to add the title in again, sorry!
any fics that i could get a good laugh out of reading?
Would it be okay to recommend a Troll Fic here?
I'd be careful.
Sorry if I'm being a pain in the backside by asking this, but I'm not 100% sure what you mean by that answer? Could I have a less vague response please?
A Troll Fic is a deliberately offensive fic. A number of things called Troll Fics aren't. And others are best left unmentioned least they kick off a fight.
And honestly, why would you recommend a Troll Fic?
I would like to recommend "Inu Yasha: Legacy of the Cursed Mask Michiru's Return" and its sequels "The Wolf Demon Crisis" and "Battle Across Time."
Sure, head over here.
I want to add a few Forgotten Realms (novels) fanfic recs. Should I add them under the Dungeons and Dragons page?
Eh, I think these should get their own page (FanficRecs.Forgotten Realms). Forgotten Realms-the-game-setting is part of Dungeons & Dragons but the novels are less closely related.
Would I list that page under Literature, Franchise, or Tabletop Games?
Literature, since as you said the recs are about fanfics of the novels.
Okay, thank you. :)
What if I want to recommend a fic that isn't on fanfiction.net?
That's absolutely fine.
Question: If a Fan Fic has a sequel, what is the appropriate formatting?
Personally, I think it would go something like one of these options:
Since no one has made a standard format for this, I suggest that you do whatever, so that everyone who reads the recommendation knows about the sequel.
If a fan fic is recommended here, and does NOT have a page of its own, is it all right to put a negative comment under a recommendation, as a caveat lector? I'm reading a "Community" fic that's been praised to the sky as a substitute for season 4, while being even more OOC than that season was.
Yes, you can write a negative review of it.
Thanks! I'll try to think of the politest way of putting it.
I am very new here and I tried to recommend a fanfic but when I previewed it, it turned out all wrong. Can someone please tell me exactly what I need to do, step by step? I am utterly and completely confused.
Hi there, and welcome to TV Tropes!
What fanfic do you want to recommend? With more specific information it'll be easier to help you.
Anyway, let's see. To make a link to the fanfic, use a Pot Hole like this: [[http://www.fanfiction.net/ Title of the Story]] becomes Title of the Story. That goes on the very first line of the recommendation.
Then you need to make a bullet point list. These use * (an asterisk) for each item. Here's how it looks for a fanfic rec, although you can skip "pairings" and "tags" if there aren't any:
* Recommended by: * Status: * Synopsis: * Pairing(s): * Tags:
When you write that and fill it in, that's most of the rec done already; the only thing left is the review button. Those don't work in page previews so that might be what you had trouble with. You make one by going [=[[reviews:TitleOfTheFicAllMashedUpInCamelCase]]=] (if it's one word, just type it without spaces).
As long as you do that and ensure that you aren't putting your recommendation halfway through somebody else's (add it to the bottom of the list if there isn't any other way of sorting them), you should be good to go.
Thank you. I was trying to recommend Fallen Legends, by the way. Is there anything else I should know?
Pretty good, Cure-Anthony. :-) Two things — one, you don't need to tag it "Pretty Cure" because it will be on the Pretty Cure page, and two, potholes work like this:
[[https://www.fanfiction.net/s/10018755/1/Futari-wa-Pretty-Cure-Heart-Protectors Futari wa Pretty Cure Heart Protectors]] becomes Futari wa Pretty Cure Heart Protectors.
I have been moving things out of the Franchise folder, and sending them to their primary mediums.
The Franchise folder should only be for things like Pokémon and Star Trek that have no primary medium. Otherwise the folder would become too full and things would become too hard to find.
I tried to look for Mario and got confused when it was not in Video Games. The franchise does have a few comics and TV shows, but mostly has games. Mario comes under Video Games in the FanFic.Fan Fics index and in most trope pages, so I assume that Mario should also come under Video Games here at Fan Fic Recommendations.
How do we note dead links and what do we do with them?
I would do Title (dead link)
Is it possible to write a review for a Fan Fic Recommendation if the story doesn't have a trope page?
Yep; go here, insert the fic name into the URL, and start writing. To make the review show up on the fanfic recs page, put [=[[reviews:TitleOfTheFic]]=] below the rec.
Okay, just making sure it didn't need a trope page to work.
Someone really should go through the crossover fics pages of different fandoms, cross-reference them, and merge the entries. An example of that can be seen on Naruto and Negima recs pages, for "Broken Faith" fanfic.
Not only does it allow to better evaluate the popularity of the fic in question and share the opinions, it also opens possibility to increase total number of entries, sometimes.
I'm kind of new here, so can anyone tell me how I could add a recommendation to a fanfic page?
You'll see variations but the basic template (remove the spaces between the brackets):
[ [Link to the fanfic Title of Fanfic] ] by [ [ link to the author if applicable Author] ]
What's the proper way to handle a fic you suspect was recommended by its author? I know that self-recommended fics are to be zapped, and I'm fairly certain that the troper and the author were the same person, given the fact that the handle included a rather unique name from the author's FF.net profile, but do you need to be absolutely sure before taking any action?
You can do a couple of things. A: Drop them a non-confrontational PM asking if they have an account on FF.net and what its name is/to confirm whether they are the same person. B: Remove the rec with an edit reason to see the discussion page. There, post it for future reference and explain that you removed it because it's probably a self-rec and therefore not allowed; if it is, then it's gone, and if it's not, someone will be able to put it back.
So...about incomplete fics, I found a really good fanfiction a while back, but it wasn't at all finished so I'm not sure whether or not to add it. Should I or should it be left out?
You can add it, just put a small note somewhere that it's not finished.
Hey. there's now a "Chobits" fanfiction recommendation page. That should be indexed here, right?
Furthermore, the MLP:Fi M page is now split into sections. Shouldn't they also be listed here?
I'm not objecting to the rule, but can I get some clarification about the "no sexualisation of minors" requirement? What does "sexualisation" mean in this context? Fanservice? Explicit sex? Hints of sexual activity? Awareness of sexual orientation?
I'd like to reccomend a fic, but there's hints that a side character (15-16 yo, it's never specified) is having a consensual affair with his semi-immortal teacher. The affair is only heavily implied, and it's overall just a sidenote in the story. Would this be an inappropriate fic to reccomend?
I'd hazard a guess that as long as it's not a focus of the story and it's not blatantly sexual (e.g. a lemony scene, obvious comeons) it's safe. Definitely a grey area though.
For Crossover Fics, should it be mentioned which universe it crosses over? So far only about half the descriptions mentions that. I know that the work would be listed twice under each fiction's page, but it'd be easier to add another bullet to tell which other world is mixed with the story.
Works that qualify as Crossovers usually have a Fandom section that has both the name of the original work and the work it's being crossed over with. Just an FYI.
Oh, okay. Thanks :D
There is a fanfic on the Halo page that was self recommended but was later a different troper also recommended it. Is it still breaking the rules now?
Also, if a fic is recommended and only gets bad reviews should it get taken down?
No and no, as far as I can tell. Since the rec is no longer just advertising for the author, it's okay; it would be zapped if there wasn't the other troper recommending it. Also, getting bad reviews isn't a reason to remove something.
Who hates Stargate SG-1? The link to its recommendations is a red link. I'd fix it but the page is locked.
Take it to this thread. When I sorted the recommendations by medium, I must have messed up the link slightly as it has a hyphen. Sorry!
Fanfic Recs are back online. Unfortunately, the main page is a mess; it badly needs cleanup and restoration of original formatting, and the recs page links need cleaning up and re-sorting into their original media subsections.
Glad to see the page is getting better, but the Web Original section seems to be missing (OK, technically those aren't fanfictions, but...)
When can we expect editing the main page to be unlocked again, so we can add links to pages for particular works?
Are we going to have any articles left when this is done?
Because so far the entire genre of Hentai is apparently completely worthless, obviously the entire genre of fanfiction has nothing new to say, and anything even remotely erotic can add anything new to the world of fiction.
There seems to be a phrase I remember from somewhere, goes like this:
'Whether the work, taken as a whole, lacks serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value.'
Was a guy called Miller who said that, he was trying to determine a test that would determine what was obscene and could be censored by the government, but do you know what else he said?
'Whether the average person, applying contemporary community standards", would find that the work, taken as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest,'
The average person on this wiki adds to fanfic recs, they discuss erotica and hentai, they talk about getting crap past the radar and above all they talk about sex, baby. So if by applying the contemporary community standards of the average person on this wiki you in fact mean bowing to outside pressure, then yeah, I totally see where this is going.
If the fanfic recs are brought back (and can I point out that I said this was inevitable and people told me it wasn't going to happen ever, I'd like to now turn this over to Dr Reid to explain how I feel.) can we take the opportunity to just cut all the problematic "comments:" threads where all the alleged creepy stuff was happening and simply slap on the "reviews" code without mucking about trying to preserve the unpresevable.
Can anyone tell me why Tv Tropes has stopped reccing fanfics? I can't find a forum topic or anything giving a reason for this. That's a lot of disappeared content right there...
Check out the recently-opened New Content Policy thread on Wiki Talk. I have already asked my question and gotten my answer: the committee that's been recently formed to deal with porn wants to pore through the recs and weed out the most explicit stuff before bringing back the page and the recs.
...That could take months, if not years.
Also, there are some amazing stories that contain explicit sex scenes. Why not just ask for content warnings? Tropers could even help with that.
^You need to go to the forums to discuss that.
Still, I think that the whole "removing porn" thing is kind of weird. Sure, some stories are nothing more than porn for the sake of porn (and those should be removed, though I have no idea how such a thing would find its way onto any of the recommendation pages), but some stories are pretty good by themselves and simply contain one or two naughty bits (that are much shorter than the whole story, often being 1~2% of the whole story, and can be skipped without reading them) and in these few cases I think it would be better to simply add a content warning and let them be.
Also a newbie. How do I add recommendations for fanfictions? I can't seem to find where to edit the pages. Where is the 'edit' button?
I want to add recomendations for the stories "Book of Magik" by Xakko, "Skin of Ice," "Mina Aino Witch in Training," "The Enemy in the Dark" and "Can You Keep a Secret" by hersheyman, "Awakening," and "Obligations" by Tim Nolan, all of which I found on fanfiction.net. I don't see recommendations and they are my favorite fics.
Edit: I found the edit button, but I can't seem to put the link in the name of the story. Either I get the name of the story without the link, or the link, saying only 1. How do I make the recommendation link to the story like the other recommendations
Edit 2: OK. I got it done.
Newbie question: How can I add a category for fanfic recs? *is curious* I'd like to add a category for <a href="http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Series/TheCape"> The Cape"</a>.
Are OC fanfictions allowed to be recommended on this site?
My personal favorites are fanfics with a cast from a series paired with a character created by the author. I haven't come across any here unless I didn't search well enough. Or the case may be that OC's are looked down upon? I'm not entirely sure on this matter.
Yes, they are allowed. The criteria for being on these pages is that it must be a fanfic, a troper must be willing to put their name to it, and that that troper cannot also be the author. Although I personally would explain in a review that a major character is an OC. And if it is a shipping fic then it is listed under pairings with OC. It doesn't matter who looks down on it, only that someone enjoyed it and is willing to recommend it, tastes vary after all.
I would heartily recommend this fanfic Arrangements Shall Be Made, for sheer Crazy Awesome and hilarity. It's made by @Sam Jaz however, HERE IS MY QUESTION: It's based on Super Smash Bros. which is a Massive Multiplayer Crossover on it's own. but it's much bigger than that and really puts the mega in Mega X-Over, so which category should I put it in? It's also on hiatus until the author comes back. If somebody wants to recommend it before me go right ahead.
Are we allowed to have negative reviews/comments? Because I had made a comment on the Total Drama page stating a few problems I had with a series of fan fics (which were, by the way, recommended by their own author) and it was deleted, appearantly (there were many things done on the edit, so it's not completely clear) because the edittor thought negative comments were complaining. But I thought that ffr pages were only for what really was recommended as good, and if enough tropers oppose it, the fan fic will be removed from the list, so that every single fan fic won't be listed up there. Plus, there are other pages (Such as the Naruto page) where people can comment against a fic last time I checked.
For refference, here's the comment: [About a series of Fix Fics]
I tried to point out specific flaws, as a sort of constructive review.
put it in "reviews", not on the page itself.
Can we have a music/bandfic/music real person fic and/or stage persona fic section?
A kind of secret vice of mine is reading Visual Kei slash (and there ARE some canon pairings even in this field - one I especially love was confirmed to have happened many years ago, recently).
Anyway, there's a variety of fics I'd love to recommend (and I even had a few for my favorite band on a page recommended but I think it must have been cut since I can't find it :( ) and I'd love to see what other people recommend.
I'd also like to see the section folderized by band/artist, since the band I like to read slash for the most kind of lost popularity among writers and one of my biggest pet peeves in looking for fic is wading through 100 Gazett E or Dir En Grey fics to find one for the guys I like...
can we do this? Please?
ETA: found the page I was working on at one point http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/FanFic/XJapan . Not cut but wrong namespace. So once (if) we get the bandfic page up I'll move the stuff to it and cut list the linked page here.
I think we should ban recommending blocked fics. There's nothing more frustrating then clicking on the link to a fan fic that's supposed to be really good only to find that there's no way for me to actually read it.
I wouldn't go as far as banning them, but definitely note in the "Tags" that is in a closed community and you might have to ask to join before being able to read.
Same with fics that are on now varnished sites, note that its recommended, but will need work to find a copy (Keep Circulating the Tapes applies to fics as well).
Would anyone else think that drafting a full template page, for users to copy'n'paste for each new fandom's recs, would be a good idea? It could be linked to at the top of the index (outside the folders, or even above the header) with a name like Template Page For New Fandom Recommendations and just need copy'pasted and the name of the fandom filled in.
I second the motion.
I want to recommend a Xiaolin Showdown fic, but I honestly have no idea how. Could I get a little help? :)
Create a new Fanfic Recs page here, using the format you see on all the other pages, and then add your review using the format you see on the main Fan Fic Recommendations page.
Sorry if this is annoying...I'm not exactly the best computer person ever (this laptop is basically a glorified typewriter for all I know), so could I have some more detailed instructions. If it's not too much of a bother...
I've created the page for you, just use the information on it to fill in the fic(s) you are interested in recommending.
This troper made a fanfic starring a ton of cartoon characters from various mediums. It involves them all banding together to stop a bad guy from throwing the world into total chaos by having everyone's bad dreams and weird dreams becoming reality. What kind of fanfic is this?
(I included characters like Phineas and Ferb, Timmy Turner, Calvin and Hobbes, and quite a few others.)
Mega Crossover, it's under "other". Remember you cannot self recommend, you can make a page about the work as long as you refrain from obvious gushing or pushing, but an author cannot recommend their own work, that is vanity.
Thanks, troper. Unfortunately, I haven't posted it on the web, mostly because of some writing issues and a couple of plot holes. Could I still make a TV Tropes page for it, though? Or does it have to be on the fanfic website?
(The fanfic is called: EPIC DREAM)
If it isn't posted then it goes on Unpublished Works over on the Darth Wiki.
Thanks! I'm actually a new troper, so I don't really know how to make a page, though, please don't be annoyed.
go here, click "edit page", add a short synopsis and a list of applicable tropes. If you do ever publish it, make sure to ask for it to be transferred to the main Fan Fics index.
I think I'll put more stuff on the page when I can get the Fan Fic published, but thanks for the poointers!
Why isn't there a Count Duckula Fan-Fic Reccommendations page? I saw a few good ones on Fanfiction.net, so it can't be a lack of good fic.
because no one has made one. Feel free to do so, but please remember to use the correct format from the main page.
There also was no Chobits Fan-F Ic Reccomendations page, but how does it get added to the index?
I want to add a Play-by-Post Game called Sburb Patch Notes to Homestuck Fanfic Recommendations. I have two questions: 1. I'm a somewhat active participant, can I still add it? 2. Where should I put it? Alternate Universe, Crossovers, or just General Fics? It has no Shipping. (Please read the page for information about it)(I added this to another discussion page but nobody seemed to answer.)
Do I need a verification to recommend a fic? I have a really well written fic that I found that I would like to reccomend, but I'm not sure if I should just post it, get it checked, ect.
Nope. Just sign your rec and put it up with the appropriate format (plus a linked review explaining why you liked it, if possible).
That way, if someone disagrees, they know who to blame. ;)
The Fanfic Recommendations template requires editors to divide stories into Gen Fic and Shipping Fic. Now there are fandoms with fan fiction which cannot be split into these two genres as easily as in your average anime fandom, which do not allow for drawing a clear and definite line between Gen Fic and Shipping Fic because they don't play by established anime fan fiction rules.
Rescue Rangers fanfics, for example, are almost never devoid of quite obvious shipping, if not even downright romantic subplots, but at the same time, they almost never focus on said shipping, much less treat it as more important than, say, the case the Rangers have to solve. For example, First Date does, Last Date does to a lesser degree, but of the fanfics listed as shipping fics under the CDRR fanfic recommendations, not a single one does to a degree that the shipping in the story would become more important than any of the other story elements. These stories do ship Chip and Gadget, but they do not explicitly focus on shipping Chip and Gadget. It does happen, yes, and it doesn't happen in the background, but it's not the one main #1 driving plot element like it is in
In such a case, would it be frowned upon if the split into Gen Fic and Shipping Fic was done away with entirely to avoid confusion, misunderstandings, and misjudgement by people who aren't familiar enough with the fan fiction in the respective fandom?
For if this split is absolutely required to remain in place, this would mean that some 98% of all Rescue Rangers fan fiction would end up under Shipping Fic, implying that they're about these pairings—which they aren't. Or else, depending on how Gen Fic is defined, 99% of all Rescue Rangers fan fiction would end up under Gen Fic despite clearly shipping characters with one another.
Shipping fic is where the primary subject is the romance. There is plenty of precedent for fics with incidental ships ending up in the Gen Fic section.
Of course, this may require further splitting - on the bigger pages, you'll note how Gen Fic bcomes split into Alt Fic, Dark Fic, Peggy Sue, and so on. All this means is that there'll be a shortage of pure shipping fics on the page.
I hope that's a definition a majority can settle with.
As for more genres, I'm not quite sure if splitting Fanfic Recommendations into further genres mandatorily will work out for every franchise and every fandom out there. Again, the lines between these genres may be blurred especially for the best and most popular stories out there. Some fandoms' members don't write fanfics with specific genres in mind (to stay with Rescue Rangers as an example, pretty much nobody does, at least not the people who are actually aware of the fandom's existence, of the network of Rangerphiles, and of the big and legendary must-read stories which inspired and still inspire the core fandom).
Instead of splitting fanfics into one firmly defined genre each, I'd rather recommend listing up fanfic genres per story because you can pretty well have, say, a Groundhog Peggy Sue Shipping Fic, and where would that go? Only genres, though; further tropes should still go onto the stories' respective pages. This would also prevent empty categories which are especially awkward if a fanfic genre is simply never used in a certain fandom.
As per Here, template moved to top and wording tweaked.
Hey guys, new member Stormpaw here. I just found a fanfic for Van Beuren's Tom and Jerry on Fanfiction.net. Should the Fanfic Recommendations page go with Van Beuren Studios or should I create a page in the Main Namespace for just that series, and put the Fanfic Recommendations page there?
Since it's a Tom And Jerry fic, it would be best to just make a Fanfic Recs page for said series and add your recommendation there.
Even though it's one for Van Beuren's human Tom and Jerry, and not MGM/Hanna-Barbera/Warner Bros cat and mouse duo the original page is made for?
Wait, does Van Beuren's Tom and Jerry have anything to do with the cartoon Tom And Jerry?
The only things they have common with each other is that the main characters have the same name, and that William Hanna and Joseph Barbera are rumored to have worked on it.
So yeah, not much.
Oh, in that case, just make a Fanfic Recs page for Van Beuren Studios and add your recommended fic there.
This may be more of a site-wide question, but where do animated films belong? Currently they're spread between the western animation and film categories.
This is why there's an Animated Films part of the site.... Although technically according to the trope index pages Film has the priority over western animation.
Thank you, just added the section and moved the relevant pages to there. Hope I didn't screw anything up too badly. It doesn't feel right for the Anime section not to be on top, but that's alphabetization for you.
Is it okay to link to fanfiction communities? Because I'm working on a fanfic recommendation.
Do you mean websites or communities on Fanfiction.net? Either way it's probably better to just recommend single fanfics than a whole website or a community. The only Fanfiction.net community I saw recommended was the one on Naruto's page, but even that is somewhat contested.
A number of pages have room for communities under 'websites', but don't expect them to actually get clicked.
They sometimes are clicked, actually.
The thing is, most people do prefer single recommendations instead of whole sites because unless the site itself only accepts "good" fictions, it's merely a site where Sturgeon's Law is in effect rather than a reliable (for the purpose of Fan Fic Recs page) archive.
What's with the mind control archive thing being listed here? It's not fanfic.
I'm not sure, but we do also have a whole category for Web Original stories that aren't fanfics, like Sailor Nothing. So it isn't without precedent.
I don't see Sailor Nothing listed on this page?
And it should probably be in Web Original, not fanfiction recommendations since a) it's a website and b) none of the recommendations in that folder are for fanfics.
I recommend this collection of kaiju battles. No plot, But the way they're written is magnificently done.
I've come across a couple GI Joe fics that are pretty good, but the authors are working with a mix of animated series canon and comic book canon — what's the best place to enter these?
Probably whatever category the Transformers recs are in. The two franchises have a similar, Merchandise-Driven history.
How does Fan Fic Recommendations fall under Fan Fic Tropes? Shouldn't it go under Fan Fic instead?
Fanfic Rec falls into Fanfic Tropes because it contains GOOD fanfics instead of crappy ones.
GOOD fanfics according to OUR judgment, There Is No Such Thing As Notability, remember? Feel free to give plus and minus according too your honest belief, although it could be better if you discuss it with fellow troper (beware of Flame War though).
Why oh why is there no Hellsing section in the fanfic recs folder?
Because it hasn't been made yet.
If you want it, grab a few of your favourite fanfics and fill 'er up.
"Do warn when a fanfic may head into homosexual or non-canon territory. Some people just don't like it, and as we all know, Shipping is Serious Business."
God, this sentence bugs me.
"Some people" just don't like lots of stuff, including het. Why only warn against Teh Gay? (And we are aware that sometime gay people are already there in the source material, right?)
And isn't all fanfic, by definition, non-canon? What does that even mean?
Wouldn't it be a little more helpful, and a lot less homophobic, to just say "Shipping is Serious Business, so help readers decide if they want to read a fic by noting all pairings clearly?"
Some fanfics try to stick close to canon, stories that could fit between episodes. At the other extreme, there are fanfics that discard large chunks of canon, often retaining only a couple of characters. The distinction between the two is fuzzy, of course, but warning about the extreme cases is fair enough.
Yeah, but calling it "non-canon" seems extremely fuzzy, as you note, and ultimately inaccurate, because as much as some fanfic writers would love to deny it, it's all non-canon. I can see the value of mentioning if your rec is a sci-fi AU of a Jane Austen novel or set in the same universe but with an all OC cast, but isn't that the sort of thing that should already turn up in the plot summary? Once again, wouldn't it be less judgey (in the sense that it marks one kind of fic as something to be warned against, while assuming that everyone wants to read "canon" fic) and more accurate to just say something like "give a clear indication of what the story is about?"
Plot summaries tend to only describe what the summariser thinks is important, in a way tilted to make the fic sound good, which can leave to key details being omitted. Tell people only that they should 'give a clear indication what the story is about' and they're quite capable of neglecting to mention that the setting has been shifted forwards three centuries, or that the canonical sexual orientation of all the characters has been reversed.
We could perhaps use a less judgemental word than warn, but we do need to make very clear that some things ought to be mentioned, even though the summariser does not personally consider them important, because other people certainly will.
Well, I'll take your word for it. I don't think I've encountered much AU fic that neglected to say that it was AU (that's usually the selling point of the fic, after all) and the Everybody Is Gay things is covered by clear shipping labels, but if this is a rampant problem in fic recs on this site, then okay. We are shooting for clear advertising here.
I agree that I'd be less bugged with the removal of the word "warn." But I still feel like setting up this dichotomy where some fanfic is "non-canon" (and some is implicitly "canon") is mushy and subjective to the point of meaninglessness. I'm not sure what a better way to frame the issue would be, though.
Shipping labels don't suffice. Consider a story where fire falls from the sky, Cthulhu rises out of the sea, and everyone in Frasier enjoys a last night of passion, all of it purely homosexual, despite canon. That's not a shipping story; it's a story about how the cast face disaster, with sex as a small part of the response. Labelling that story with ships would be misleading, suggesting they had rather greater prominence, but people do want to know in advance that everyone acts out of character, without acknowledgement by the narration.
In the same way, being AU is not always the selling point of an AU fic. Sometimes the AU-ness is mere set up for the main point, or even an authorial foible, thrown in because they like it, without impact on the actual plot.
The dichotomy isn't between canon and non-canon. If anything, it's between original-flavour and AU, though a look at the way we actually classify fanfics here will show there are more than two options.
I feel like I've drifted pretty far away from my larger point, which is that once we bring in the idea of warning for plot elements because some reader out there might not want to read them, we're opening up a big can of worms, since there's lots of things a given reader might find squicky or annoying.
If we're going to go there at all (and I think we probably should), then we need to do a much better job of hashing out what a fanfic rec reasonably needs to warn for, rather than just throwing out "homosexuality" (why single that out?) and "non-canon," which is vague and subjective because reader interpretations of canon will often vary wildly, not counting A Us and other blatant, intentional deviations from canon (which I don't really have a problem with warning for, if people are really concerned it won't be in the summary.)
(BTW, I'd personally still note the pairings in your hypothetical fic, even though the sex is not the point of the fic. Pairings are a huge deal to a lot of readers, and by noting specific couples you're warning both for any general squicks the couple might represent to a reader (slash, het, incest, age gap, whatever) and the specific ship itself. A reader might not have a problem with homosexuality, but they might have a big problem with Frasier/Niles.)
In the hypothetical fic, I'd agree that marking the pairing would be sufficient (Daphne/Lillith, Frasier/Niles, Martin & the dog would make things very clear), but the problem is that many people wouldn't, arguing that the sex wasn't the point of the fic.
More generally, I do agree we ought to hash out clear standards for the minimum that should be revealed the plot summaries, including the things you suggest - but that will take more than two of us.
If no one else wants to chime in here, perhaps we should ask in the forums.
Just passing by: you could reuse some information from here. The part about warnings is pretty extensive, even if it mostly talks about what is usually warned in fanfic sites like fanfiction.net.
I also think this change would probably be better decided in the forums. It would be nice if you leave a link here, so we can follow the discussion more easily.
"Do warn when a fanfic may head into homosexual or non-canon territory. Some people just don't like it, and as we all know, Shipping is Serious Business."
Face it, most of us actually prefer Homosexual one (I look at you, Slash Fic). However, Not EVERYONE like it, a pro-het can be more fierce and witless when enraged compared to pro-gay, albeit less prone to blind anger as well (Myself is a pro-het and can be total moron when it comes to Shipping). Remember, Conservation of Ninjutsu sometimes works...
Some people also don't like angst, myself included. Some people don't like original characters, and react badly to even a minor cameo by an original character.
Why should you warn especially against homosexual characters? There's plenty of things someone might disagree about with a fic. Homosexuality is just one of them.
Good point, although I'd probably pull the argument into "try to mention all of them in the description" territory, than "mention nothing".
That's what I was aiming for. Reviewing my above comment, I kinda didn't mention anything about a possible solution, there.
Anyway, the warning line is gone. Or I don't see it when I load the page, at least, so this discussion's kinda pointless.
Is that Frasier fanfic real? I'd like to read it.
Okay, concerning the whole "warning about homosexual pairings" thing, I just want to say that the word homosexual was most likely just thrown in as an example. Also, what constitutes a "warning" to some may be an invitation to others. Plus, it's usually presumed that the given characters in a cast are heterosexual unless otherwise stated, so the assumption would most likely be that a shipping will be het.
As for what counts as "non-canon examples," it's mostly a relative term. Granted, a fanfiction is technically 'non-canon' in itself (otherwise it wouldn't be written, right?), but some are more faithful to the canonical guidelines, so to speak, than others. 'Non-canon' would probably include Shippings of characters who've never even met each other, CrackFic, and major OOC.
The warning is on some individual pages. Probably just a remnant since the majority do not have it and the warning is not specified as required in the generic template of what's required.
Anyways even disregarding the blatant discrimination in putting a warning for homosexual pairings, the pairings thing already indicates if there are any homosexual pairs.
As for the non-canon part, fanfics can vary between going against canon directly and just adding on to canon, but unless people really want to make a canon-contradiction scale, I don't think that it matters and would be way too much into YMMV territory whether a particular pairing is so much against canon except in the rare case we have word of god about it.
Looks like it's time to do some comprehensive editing.
I've been changing it as I update pages to the reviews code to being
"Quote: "Do warn when a fanfic may head into sexual or non-canon territory. Some people just don't like it, and as we all know, Shipping is Serious Business."
Since this makes it a bit more general and less homophobic. It should be in the "Tags" field if there is sex involved.
e.g. "Tags: Lemon, Dark Fic, graphic sex, comedy, Crack Fic, Fuku Fic, Use of Rubber Chickens thoughout."
The non-canon part still has major issues concerning all fanfics being non-canon...I think that part should be axed entirely as people aren't going to care all that much that a fanfic changed something.
As for any sexual content, I think that you'd have to be Completely Missing the Point to be looking thru a list of shipping fics (they do have their own folder in all pages I've seen) and not expect sexual content in most of the ones listed. Specifying what kind of sexual content is in the fic is a good idea, but I would not recommend saying to "warn" about it (neutral wording please, one person's squick is another's fetish.) The tags section is a good idea and is what most fanfic sites seem to use.
Also, I think the last sentence's bit about Serious Business (a sarcastic meme...) is really unnecessary. "One person's fetish is another's squick" would do nicely if the non-canon part is removed.
All fanfics are non-canon in the sense that they aren't canon... but that doesn't mean they're incompatible with canon, which is how I at least understood the "non-canon" thing. Maybe "non-canon" isn't the best word for it, but there's a difference between fanfic that merely adds something to canon or expands upon it and fanfic that outright rewrites or contradicts something that is seen in canon.
I don't see why you shouldn't warn for sexual content. Some people are underage. Some people are at work. It's not a pure personal preference thing.
So, I wanted to recommend a fanfic, I'm fairly new here and only joined to recommend a fanfiction centering on Iris and Drayden I came across months ago and, of course, keeping in my typical fashion I'm just now getting to that. Could one of you point me toward the page to that specifically? Sorry for my green behavior ^^;;
@Kairyu: Iris? Drayden?
Well, assuming you're talking about Pokémon, this is where you need to go.
I'd say that instead of "non-canon", it's "A Us" that should be mentioned.
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How well does it match the trope?