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Jun 6th 2018 at 6:35:43 PM •••

At the moment, TV Tropes is full of inconsistency regarding the naming of Dragon Ball characters, attacks, etc., and various scenes, plot points, character beats, etc. being inconsistently described due to different levels of accuracy in the translations people refer to. A lot of people use the Funimation dub as their main source(Not even the Kai dub with some minor corrections like Vegito changing spelling to Vegetto, and its far more-accurate dialogue), but it's widely-known that about 60% of Funimation's dialogue for Dragon Ball was totally made up, and the 40% that is a translation is often either incorrectly rendered, or re-contextualised in some way, and the same principle can be applied to the names they used. So, anyone who's experienced the franchise in any way other than Funimation's version(The subtitles, the manga, any foreign dubs or manga translations, or indeed someone who understands Japanese and read/watched the original version raw) would be totally confused and bewildered. Even people who watched the show on British or Canadian TV instead of US TV would be rather confused, since the UK, Canada, and a few other countries got a different English dub that used some different terminology, especially in the case of GT and most of the original Dragon Ball series, where an entirely different(And far more accurately-translated) set of scripts was used, resulting in many characters having totally different names in the UK and Canada, compared to the USA(See: The US's Ledgic vs the UK's Lezick, the US's Syn Shenron vs the UK's Ii Shenron, the US's General Rildo vs the UK's General Lock, the US's Giru vs the UK's Gill, the US's Mercenary Tao vs the UK's Tao Pai-Pai...), and many scenes going entirely differently(US, UK), usually with the UK and Canada translations being a much closer analogue to the original Japanese(And thus, closer to every other country that got a decent translation such as Latin America, Germany, etc.).

So, here's what I suggest we try doing; base information(Particularly names) off the official subtitles for the DVD and Blu-Ray releases of the anime, which were accurately-rendered and translated by well-respected translators, and cover all Dragon Ball media officially licensed in English. Essentially, there are three different people have written subtitles for Dragon Ball officially — the original 1997-1998 DVD release of the first three Z movies were subtitled by Rika Takahashi, and the original Dragon Ball series was subtitled by Clyde Mandelin, but all other subtitle translations on the official releases were subtitled by Steve Simmons — and they all use almost the exact same naming schemes, and very similar styles of rendering dialogue. The manga generally sticks quite close to these too, with a few exceptions(Majin Boo in the subs is Djinn-Boo in the manga. The manga also renamed Vegetto to Vegerot, and the Z-Sword to the Zeta Sword. There's logic behind these, but they are a little confusing to anyone not used to these names, and they're probably the names people are least-likely to be familiar with). Since Mandelin and Simmons between them cover pretty much all Dragon Ball media, with Mandelin filling in Simmons' only gap officially licensed in English, I suggest we focus on these two translators, since they're both very well-respected translators, whose name romanisation/translation choices are generally accepted on respected/reputable sources of Dragon Ball information like Kanzenshuu.

But, because a large portion of TV Tropes readers will be largely familiar with the dubs, I also suggest we put a note next to the first occurrence of each name in a given page, explaining any differing names used in the dubs people may be familiar with, and the manga. So, for instance, you'd write Vegettonote , or for a GT example, Yi Xing Longnote .

The Funimation dub is the only main piece of Dragon Ball media to use such oddities as "Frieza", or "Syn Shenron" who very quickly gets renamed to "Omega Shenron" and recast to a cheaper actor at the same time, or having Vegeta justify his rough raising of Trunks by saying he wanted to raise him to be "A strong boy", or renaming the Crane Hermit/Tsurusennin to Master Shen, causing them to rename the character actually called Shen to "Hero", or saying King Piccolo fought "All over the galaxy", contradicting all other information on this subject, even within other Dragon Ball material Funimation had dubbed... These are nonsensical changes that only stick around because of an odd stubbornness people have of clinging to a dub done in the dark ages of dubbing, using scripts that barely count as translations, adapted by a team with no respect for the source material(I'm not just throwing shade either, Chris Sabat himself as openly said as much in interviews), so I think we should make the effort to be accurate, correct, and inclusive of everyone who may be reading this site, rather than purely writing to serve those who grew up on the version of the anime that aired in the USA from 1999 to 2005. After all, we're here to describe the show, not the mostly-made-up thing Funimation threw together years after the Japanese version had been finished.

If it would be necessary and/or helpful, I'm willing to write(Or help write) a naming style guide to aid this. References to dialogue, plot points, character beats, etc. will be more difficult, but it would be start, I'd say.

Edited by Robo4900
Sep 4th 2011 at 12:18:57 AM •••

Removed:

  • ["Blind Idiot" Translation: Many, depending on your version.] Let's start by exposing the farce of the "over 9,000" meme: what Vegeta's scouter actually said about his power level was that it was over 8,000 ("hassen ijou da"). Check the manga, the anime, the scene revisit in Kai, all in the original. It's there. Over EIGHT thousand, not nine (which would be "kyuusen...").
    • Umm, you do know that the whole 9,000 thing is less of a "Blind Idiot" Translation. Rather, they deliberately changed it to 9,000 to match Vegeta's lip movement. 9,000 works better than 8,000 for lip-syncing. More like a case of pragmatic translation if you ask me.
      • Is that why they changed every Earth-based character's power ratings from the manga?
    • In the English version of Kai, at least, both 8,000 and 9,000 were used as different exclamations, in order. Which still doesn't explain the mistranslation, since why use the right one to follow it up with the wrong one in the place where the right one should be?
      • Actually, that's only in the edited for TV English version of Kai and was obviously meant a shout out to the meme, as Funimation also referenced it in the Dragon Box Vol. 1 trailer. The uncut DVD version uses the correct "Over 8,000" line.
    • Quit breaking the troper fourth wall!

Edited by MikeRosoft
Aug 25th 2011 at 11:18:12 AM •••

Shouldn't Bardock be a Main Character? He was main character in his Movie where Goku was just supportive, now it has his spinoff.

Dec 6th 2010 at 12:47:12 AM •••

Hey, I was wondering, should we start pages on the different video games of the franchise? Nowadays are a major selling point, and some like Online or Shin Budokai have different stories or a continuation of the canon one (that is also canon); apart of the usual Video Game Tropes.

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Feb 4th 2011 at 12:31:22 PM •••

Splitting off the numerous games in the series seems like a good idea at this point.

Aug 24th 2011 at 4:01:24 PM •••

Yeah, though the number of pages might end up outnumbering the number of tropes in all of them combined if you did it for everything that should logically have it's own page (all the movies, the OVAs, the games, and everything else).

Nov 22nd 2010 at 4:37:35 AM •••

I just read something on the character sheets. Does Piccolo really cry cute? I personally lol'd when reading it, and I wonder. How? Does anyone have a video?

Nov 19th 2010 at 4:23:48 PM •••

Would Vegeta fit the trope "Proud Warrior Race Guy"?

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Nov 19th 2010 at 6:29:53 PM •••

A textbook example, but it goes in the Characters page, and it is already there.

Oct 13th 2010 at 4:28:46 PM •••

in the Majin Buu saga, desperate to buy more time, Piccolo tells Super Buu that he can't fight Gotenks until he's killed everyone on Earth. Buu responds by killing every single human being on the face of the Earth (with the exception of Hercule, Tien, and Chiaotzu) in a matter of seconds.

what trope would either of these two examples fall under?

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Oct 18th 2010 at 3:53:32 AM •••

Whoa Whoa wait a sec.... I remember the part about Piccolo saying that Super Bu has to wait before fighting Gotenks, but I never remember he telling him that he has to kill all the (puny) humans. Buu just did it out of sheer boredom and jerkasseness. It's Only later that Piccolo summons the Hourglass and tell him to wait an hour to gain time... but Buu is not very known for his patience

Jan 29th 2011 at 1:23:25 AM •••

Picollo might not have said EVERY but he clearly told Buu to go back and have fun slaughtering innocents. It's just that with the Dragonballs he chose between two options. One where the only person who might be able to stop you has more time to prepare and one where he doesn't. He's gonna wish you all back anyway. Kinda makes you wonder why he didn't wait at least the full day if not two or three before tryin to escape. None of them knew Buu would try to destroy reality itself.

Sep 11th 2010 at 6:05:05 PM •••

This needs more consistency in terms of character names. Use the original Japanese names "Son Gokou, Tenshinhan, Kuririn" or FU Nimation dub names? "Goku, Tien, Krillin"

Personally, I'd go with dub names. The dub is arguably more widespread in English speaking nations (what with actual TV broadcast and such) so it wouldn't confuse people who watch dubs instead of dubs.

Such as myself.

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Sep 11th 2010 at 11:13:51 PM •••

Most of the dub names are acceptable romanizations, anyway. (Tien is one of the few that isn't.)

Sep 13th 2010 at 4:01:48 AM •••

Gokou is technically wrong anyway. I know it's used in some materials, but I believe the official romanisation is Gokuu or Gokuh.

Oct 18th 2010 at 3:59:07 AM •••

Depends.. I think it should be more correct using the original Japanese names (eg: Tenshinhan), but because of all the possible ways of translating it this makes things more troublesome. And then, some character's names are different in some countries so the Funimation names may be confusing for some people(EG: in Italy Tien is called Tensing, Piccolo is Junior (pron. Iunior) and Chiaotsu is known as Reef/Jiaozi in the manga. Oddly, Mr Satan retains his name despite the Media Watchdogs... heck, they even redubbed King Piccolo with Al Satan...... that's puzzling!!)

Nov 28th 2010 at 11:40:49 AM •••

This is an English language wiki, so we use the names either as in the original, or in English localisations. Seems to make sense to me.

Jan 29th 2011 at 1:20:50 AM •••

Correct me if I'm wrong Son Goku is like saying Obama Barrack instead of Barrack. It's not really incorrect it's a matter of what's more proper. We call him Goku cus there that's his name and also Gohan is around for all of Z and you'd have to say Son for both of them and then specify WHICH Son you meant. Seems silly specially since most of us are english speakers.

Feb 6th 2011 at 6:26:05 PM •••

@Sean Renaud In japan the first and last names are switched in comparison to American "Goku Son" Son is his last name.

Aug 24th 2011 at 3:59:15 PM •••

I think that was Sean's point, #174 (sorry, but referring to you by the entire IP is too time-wasting, and #174 sounds catchy to me). You would not refer to characters by their full names (and it bugs me that we refer to Trunks, Bulma and Bra/Bulla as Trunks, Bra and Bulma Briefs but the Son family doesn't get the same treatment) in most instances. The Buffy The Vampire Slayer page doesn't call Willow "Willow Rosenburg" every time she's mentioned, the Halo page doesn't call John "Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy John-117" every time he's mentioned, the Death Note page doesn't call Light "Light Yagami" every time he's mentioned, so why should the Dragon Ball pages call Goku "Son Goku" every time he's mentioned?

Jun 24th 2010 at 6:43:39 PM •••

Why is the article "Dragon Ball" (spaced with 'ball' capitalized) while it is referred to as "Dragonball" throughout? There should be consistency with whichever is the proper name.

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Jun 28th 2010 at 9:07:35 PM •••

Well, the title of the article depends on how you enter it. If the "B" isn't capitalised in your URL, the page WILL be called "Dragonball". However, "Dragon Ball" is the more correct spelling as most official sources spell the title as two words. (There are exceptions however where it is spelled "Dragonball" in an official context, but those are few and far between in comparison to the general presence of "Dragon Ball".) For all intents and purposes, it SHOULD be "Dragon Ball".

... And there. All cases of "Dragonball" (excluding the examples, as I don't feel like going through those) are now "Dragon Ball".

Edited by SaiyamanMS
Sep 13th 2010 at 4:51:25 AM •••

The live action movie IS called Dragonball, which confuses things a little.

Jan 29th 2011 at 1:18:15 AM •••

There just needs to be a standard HERE the rest of the world be damned.

Aug 24th 2011 at 3:52:44 PM •••

Well, there is now. I changed all instances of Dragonball, Dragonball Z and Dragonball GT to Dragon Ball (or Dragon Ball), Dragon Ball Z (or Dragon Ball Z) and Dragon Ball GT (or Dragon Ball GT).

Edited by Watergirl909
Jun 11th 2010 at 3:12:39 AM •••

I was thinking, looking at the Dragon Ball page, perhaps it wouldn't hurt to perhaps split Dragon Ball GT (And maybe even Dragon Ball Z) from here. Dragon Ball Z being the same page isn't that big a deal as it was part of the same manga anyway, but GT is an entirely distinct production, and really... each of the three series are big enough to fill up trope pages with a LOT of stuff.

It'd probably be a bit of a hassle with the initial sorting out of the gajillion things on this massive page, but in the end it'll leave us with some less cluttered pages with more focused examples.

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