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May 31st 2019 at 2:24:21 PM •••

How are we going to go about Strange Klug\'s name going forward? I\'m asking this since I do intent to correct all the now changed names from Champions across all pages, but I\'m not sure about SK. It\'s official and just got changed on the Fever character page, but it strikes me that nobody wanted to change it until now, because it was another Satan situation. Like sure, there\'s a official localized name, but everyone hates it and prefers to not use it across the whole fandom.

So how do we go about that? Figured this would be good to discuss, for the sake of future clarification.

Edited by warelander Hide/Show Replies
May 31st 2019 at 2:48:02 PM •••

I like \"The Demon\", but even I have trouble sticking to that habit.

May 31st 2019 at 2:55:55 PM •••

We \"should\" be going with the English version of everything including Demiserf and Dark Prince, because that\'s really the only thing that makes logical sense, but what I got from the discussion surrounding Dark Prince is that folks don\'t care about it being logical and just go by what sounds cool to them.

I could be wrong, but I don\'t think you\'ll get an edit war for using Possessed Klug over Strange Klug.

May 31st 2019 at 2:58:18 PM •••

Possibly, I\'m perfectly willing to use Possessed Klug, even though I don\'t personally like the name, but the Satan situation and how everyone kept using Strange Klug made me unsure about that.

May 31st 2019 at 5:40:43 PM •••

... I kinda like the name. It\'s Exactly What It Says On The Tin, but I won\'t deny the problem that exists when referring to the Demon as a character.

May 31st 2019 at 11:47:32 PM •••

For the record I\'m also in favor of just using the most recent localized names for everything and that includes Dark Prince, it\'s the cleanest and most logical way to go about things.

Keeping Satan as is was always pure cherry picking, especially since his localized name has been around since the English arcade localization back in the 90s, but Strange Klug and Demon Servant\'s name changes open up a whole new can of worms that I don\'t feel is worth the trouble just because of preferences.

Jun 1st 2019 at 3:51:22 AM •••

A fair point, but then again the arcade localization back in the 90s changed the name of everyone (Arle became Silvana, Harpy became Dark Elf, Rulue was localized as Lulu because Japanese Ranguage I guess, and more stuff that you can find on this page of The Cutting Room Floor).

Also, is it just me or do links simply not work here in discussion pages?

Edited by CybranGeneralSturm
Jun 1st 2019 at 4:11:10 AM •••

True, but I meant that more in the sense that his name actually stuck and has been the same in English localizations since, aside from the odd exception of Sonic Runners, so it\'s about as much Satan\'s western name as Bowser is well, Bowser\'s name in the west, rather then King Koopa.

Edited by warelander
Jun 1st 2019 at 2:11:59 PM •••

Yeah, it was a bit different when Dark Prince was the only name that was being disregarded. (As in, I still disagreed with it but at least it was consistently applied.) It has been nearly a month since the western release of Champions and it seems like people still don\'t know what to make of all of the name changes. If how we list the characters are going to go against preferences either way, it makes more sense to just use the Tetris and Champions names for everything.

(Also, I\'m kinda...the author of almost all of that TCRF page, so I\'m aware of the changes. Silvana and the like are one-offs, while Dark Prince is consistent. It\'s not really the same thing.)

Edited by LtQuattro
Jun 1st 2019 at 2:33:19 PM •••

The whole thing also just raises the question of where the line is drawn, when it comes to what names to keep, not just with Strange Klug and Demon Servant, but also alternate spellings like Ragnus or Serilly. There is always going to be a group that prefers the old spelling, but we adopted the new ones on TV Tropes soon after Champions came out.

I just don\'t feel that preferences should dictate how to name the characters here, someone\'s preferences are always going to take a backseat either way (I\'m not a fan of Dark Prince either, but I accept that it\'s the most set in stone name change) so might as well go with a approach that doesn\'t bring up these kind of questions.

May 5th 2019 at 10:17:52 AM •••

I\'ve noticed there\'s some contempt with the Ambiguous Disorder trope being applied to Sig; one camp wanting it in, another camp thinking it\'s shoehorned and want it out. Opening this discussion for you guys.

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May 6th 2019 at 9:23:15 AM •••

I added it back yesterday because I saw someone get really upset over it\'s removal, but to be honest, I really feel it doesn\'t fit.

I get the comparison to autism and I don\'t even mind it, but the backstory bit about his ancestor and how he becomes more emotive as Black Sig have always pointed pretty specifically towards a lot of Sig\'s quirks being linked to him being a incomplete being.

I just think there is a point where something is just too rooted fanon and doesn\'t fit on the character page but would be fine in WMG or something.

Edited by warelander
May 8th 2019 at 10:25:59 PM •••

All for moving it to YMMV or WMG on the basis of being borderline Fanon, if it wasn\'t obvious from my history note on the character page.

Edited by LtQuattro
May 9th 2019 at 4:40:18 PM •••

I do think WMG is the most fitting for it, but I\'ll let others decide what happens with it.

Jun 8th 2019 at 11:56:13 AM •••

I know this conversation is kind of old but from what I\'ve seen I think it makes sense for Sig to be autistic. In the ARS trios all the A\'s R\'s and S\'s have something in common. For Schezo Sig and Maguro that similarity seems to be that they display autistic traits. That\'s just my own thoughts though. I\'m trying to keep this short so feel free to ask for clarification if you want it. (As a side note, I hope it doesn\'t seem like I\'m only here just to say that. I want to make good edits I\'m just only good at explaining a small amount of things, this being one of them.)

Jun 8th 2019 at 1:26:37 PM •••

Sig, Maguro and Schezo have nothing in common with each other and Risukuma at most only very superficial similarities to Rulue and Raffina, there is no obligation at all.

Besides, the case has already been made with Sig and his description even already notes that his nature as a half-complete half-demon is the likely cause of his quirks, he even becomes more expressive when he becomes Black/Dark Sig and his ancestor was said to be similarly spacey, right after the sealing of the demon. It\'s not even just behavior, but also his twitching hair anteanne, red arm or how his spirit exits his body, Sig has a lot of quirks about him, which are whenever the subject is brought up ALWAYS linked to the unnatural nature of his existence.

Don\'t get me wrong, I get the autism comparison and don\'t even mind it at all, I just feel like this is a case where things point too strongly towards a different intent.

Jun 8th 2019 at 4:54:00 PM •••

I don\'t wanna comment on the incomplete being stuff about Sig but the way I see it is: The A members are all optimistic and energetic The R members are passionate but chaotic with their passions And the S members are the \'weird\' but well meaning support to the A members. (Maguro is described as weird in his Puyo Quest flavor text, so it seems like what they were going for.) I think the ARS trios have a lot of similarities but it can be hard to see before it\'s pointed out. Edit: I also think that just being more or less expressive isn\'t really telling of anything? I hope I don\'t sound rude it just sounds off to me.

Edited by Mr0rangeJuice
Jun 8th 2019 at 8:37:43 PM •••

I\'m saying that in the context of Sig\'s quirks being tied to his incomplete half-demon nature, whith his monotone manner of expressing himself being one of the most striking ones.

Also again, you are looking for a obligation where there isn\'t any, also passionate but chaotic with their passions is something you could say about a lot of characters is a cast like Puyo Puyo, where everyone has a pretty exaggerated personality for the sake of comedy.

Also Schezo only counts as support for the odd team-up with Arle, he\'s usually a antagonistic presence, unlike Sig and Maguro, who are fulltime friends to Amitie and Ringo. Not to mention the two never tried to slice their respective A Girl in half, in the name of a selfish pursuit of power.

Edited by warelander
Jun 9th 2019 at 5:05:08 PM •••

I meant to hit cancel on that edit but I guess it didn\'t work oops... But as for the obligation stuff, I\'m trying to show that it\'s a valid possibility and shouldn\'t be shut down just because another possibility exists. But Rulue Raffina and Risukuma undeniably have that in common in a way other characters don\'t and it\'s not a coincidence. They were made to have that in common. If the trios had nothing in common I don\'t know why SEGA would even bother to make them an ARS trio in the first place. It just doesn\'t make sense to me. I might talk for too long here because... hoo boy do I know a lot about Schezo and hoo boy can I not stop myself. Feel free to skim this. When it comes to similarities between the ARS trios we\'re only going to be talking about SEGA content because they introduced new trios. Schezo being an antagonist is only present in the Compile era, and it wasn\'t as prevalent towards the end. Even if we are talking about Compile, he did die to save Arle in The Final Test. But onto SEGA, because their interpetations matter mor here. Arle and Schezo have been friendly since his reintroduction in 15th Anniversary. In 20th he doesn\'t let her go alone to fight Satan, and tells her stay away from him during the ending. In Tetris he casually agrees to help her even after she called him a pervert/creeper. In Everyone\'s Dreams Coming True parallels that of siblings, arguing on the surface but still really caring about each other. His thirst for power is more of a habit than a goal at this point. But besides all that, Maguro did get possessed by Ecolo causing mischief once. And don\'t forget Sig\'s Secret. Sorry for going on so long I just know everything and it seems like if I\'m not overspecific then my point fails to get across.

Jun 9th 2019 at 5:32:31 PM •••

I already said my piece and my point still stands, I\'ll let others carry the discussion now.

I already put it back on last time because I was bullied off-site for removing it, instead of yah know, people actually discussing concerns regarding it\'s removal with me in a civil manner, especially since as I said, it\'s not even like I mind the autism comparison.

I just have no passion left to discuss this subject, my point still stands and that\'s that.

Edited by warelander
Jun 9th 2019 at 6:02:02 PM •••

I already know the story of the edit. I was just adding my thoughts for everyone to see and trying to explain them further when you replied. I have a hard time getting my point across with only a few words, sorry if I sounded rude or condescending at any point.

Jun 9th 2019 at 6:04:40 PM •••

Oh, you were perfectly polite, regardless whether I agree with you or not, my mind\'s just made up and I\'m tired of the subject after what happened.

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