Discussion Characters / Persona3Protagonists

First of all, let's deal with your edit on the page.

• In the games, it's Aigis — the protagonist has a heart above his head when first seeing her, and several non-optional scenes emphasize their bond. The most noteworthy is the ending of the game where the protagonist spends his last moments with her, falling asleep in her lap. Their bond is also expanded upon in many of the spin-offs, such as Chie assuming the two are dating in Persona Q: Shadow of the Labyrinth. She is upgraded to the Official Love Interest in the films. Yukari also has a number of scenes early on in the game, but hers are more subtle, the most explict being a player-optional hug.

First off, there is no heart above the Protagonist's head upon first meeting Aigis in any version of P3, as seen here in P3 and P3P and here in Reload which immediately disproves one of your claims.

Secondly, there are not "several" non-optional scenes that emphasise their bond, because after her introduction, Aigis doesn't contribute to the story in any meaningful way until the events of November 4th. Outside of Full Moon operations, she's either used for comic relief one-liners because she doesn't understand human conventions, or she remains silent - something that continues through to early December, when she's briefly written out of the plot.

Thirdly, Aigis is not an option for either the Summer Festival (at least prior to Reload) or for the Christmas date, nor does she have any notable response in the Cultural Festival scene where Chihiro and Yuko start getting possessive of the Protagonist, whilst Yukari does have a reaction and is an option for the dates. Whilst Reload would add a Summer Festival date, it should be noted that scene also includes Mitsuru, and plays out like the Protagonist and Mitsuru are parents to Aigis the inquisitive child.

You've pointed to a specific line of dialogue from Persona Q, deliberately ignoring the overall context of the line - Chie and Yukiko assume they're dating because Aigis is in full-blown robot stalker mode, and Yukari has to tell Aigis to stop answering questions when she doesn't understand what people are actually saying to her.

You've also completely ignored the fact that Aigis didn't even have a Social Link prior to the release of FES, and was therefore not even a romance option. And even when it was added, Atlus didn't code it as a romance, as evidenced by the lack of "You are now in an intimate relationship" flags.

Literally the only scene in P3 that supports Aigis as the ILI is the ending. Even then, the romantic implications are debatable, as you can reasonably argue that Aigis is just making sure the Protagonist is comfortable as they pass on.

Your edit to the page is based off your own personal bias, rather than any actual evidence within the games.

Now, for your post here.

Yukari receives more ship tease than any other character because the player is actively able to flirt with Yukari in dialogue choices outside of her social link, which cannot be said for any other character in the game. It's not just a case of the love hotel and Yakushima beach scenes.

The bad ending is relevant, especially as Reload now includes two versions of the bad ending - if you romance Yukari, and if you romance a different character. The version with Yukari romanced remains the same as the original iteration of the bad ending, implying that without the input of the player, Yukari and the Protagonist started dating.

Yes, it's implied that the love hotel scene also happens to whoever else is in the party, but the Protagonist remains locked to Yukari, it is not possible to be paired up with Mitsuru, another potential romantic interest - implicitly because there is a mutual attraction between Yukari and the Protagonist.

About P 3 D - the argument isn't what you claim it is, but rather, in the Social Events the only character that Makoto shares any flirty responses with is Yukari. Which is factually true.

As far as the Answer goes, the reason Yukari has those feelings of jealousy is because she was actively in love with the Protagonist and the narrative really isn't subtle about it. And Yukari specifically refers to Aigis' desire to protect the Protagonist being stronger, that's it. Not her feelings in general.

And keep in mind, the original entry didn't consider anything from Reload and if it did, there would be even more evidence to support Yukari as the ILI, as they not only added more scenes that support that, they actively removed some of the stuff that supports Aigis in that role, like the Protagonist holding her hand after she gets wrecked fighting Ryoji.

I'm restoring the original entries, as you made those edits without actually discussing them beforehand and they're clearly written from a biased perspective and take things out of context. If any further edits are made on the matter without actually discussing them here beforehand, and actually proving that there are more scenes that support Aigis as the ILI, I will take the matter to Ask The Tropers to prevent an edit war.

As someone with no horse in this race (Mitsuru is best girl and I definitely like Yukari more than Aigis), as of FES at least (never played vanilla), Aigis is absolutely the Implied Love Interest.

Part of the reason she gets a "special" place here is that she does have a fundamentally unique role in the story. Arguments like "Aigis didn't even get a social link in vanilla" or "can't go on the date you can go on with every other character" kind of emphasizes Aigis' unique role here. Think of it like a meta version of Can't Act Perverted Toward a Love Interest. You can't cheat on Aigis or treat her the same as regular female NP Cs. She's essentially the Third-Option Love Interest, since writers have to keep all traditionally romanceable love interests at roughly the same level, Aigis gets some kind of unique telling.

And... I cannot emphasize enough how bonkers "Literally the only scene in P3 that supports Aigis as the ILI is the ending. Even then, the romantic implications are debatable, as you can reasonably argue that Aigis is just making sure the Protagonist is comfortable as they pass on" is. Like... that's... not just burying the lede, but drilling to the center of the earth and shoving the lede there. The protag effectively chooses when and where he goes and winds up doing so in Aigis' lap. Similarly, the The Answer dialogue definitely isn't as vaguely platonic as you make it sound. Taken at its most literal, Yukari is outright saying Aigis' feelings for the Protagonist were the strongest. What those feelings specifically were (i.e. "protection" or romance or anything else) is up for debate, but just saying "Aigis just wanted to protect him more and that carries no implications" is honestly kinda silly.

EDIT: Moved this to discussion and left a commented out note. It's bad form to revert something while discussion is still undergoing.

• In the games, it's Yukari — she has more Ship Tease moments with the Male Protagonist than any other love interest in Persona 3, her actions in "The Answer" are motivated entirely by her love for him and wanting to see him again after his death, and she is the only member of S.E.E.S. that he shares any flirty dialogue choices with in Persona 3: Dancing in Moonlight. Furthermore, dialogue in the bad ending of Persona 3 heavily implies that two are in a relationship, and Reload makes the implication even clearer, as the bad ending changes the dialogue if the Protagonist dated someone else over the course of the game, but retains Junpei teasing that he knows they've been sneaking around if the Protagonist dated Yukari.
  Junpei: Well, at least one of us knows what he wants... You seem to be getting along with a certain someone, if ya know what I mean... [An exclamation mark appears over Yukari's head] Yukari: ...what's that supposed to mean? Junpei: I dunno. You tell me. [A Sweat Drop appears over Yukari's head]

EDIT EDIT: Brought it to the Persona thread to get more eyes on the discussion.

"First off, there is no heart above the Protagonist's head upon first meeting Aigis in any version of P3, as seen here in P3 and P 3 P and here in Reload which immediately disproves one of your claims."

Your own video link has it at 11:15.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=680UEHf0OaM&ab_channel=DismArchus

It's true it's not in P 3 P nor Reload, but P 3 P does not ever show the protagonist with such reactions anyway, owing to the camera perspective shift, and Reload took the heart-above-head out generally. In neither case was it specifically this scene changed.

"Secondly, there are not "several" non-optional scenes that emphasise their bond, because after her introduction, Aigis doesn't contribute to the story in any meaningful way until the events of November 4th. Outside of Full Moon operations, she's either used for comic relief one-liners because she doesn't understand human conventions, or she remains silent - something that continues through to early December, when she's briefly written out of the plot."

Scenes include 11/30, where Makoto hangs back to talk with Aigis and Aigis tells him he is special to him. On 12/01, after her fight with Ryoji, they hold hands. Seen in this clip at 7:42. This also happens in Portable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHMyW7Fr0y8&ab_channel=BlazetheCat130

On 1/25, the two have a one-on-one talk on the rooftop where Aigis says she wants to be by his side, again. Then after returning from Nyx, there is a cutscene in the original and FES where Aigis cries and Makoto smiles, seen at 20:24 of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_VD3iFTHtY&ab_channel=BlazetheCat130

"Thirdly, Aigis is not an option for either the Summer Festival (at least prior to Reload) or for the Christmas date, nor does she have any notable response in the Cultural Festival scene where Chihiro and Yuko start getting possessive of the Protagonist, whilst Yukari does have a reaction and is an option for the dates. Whilst Reload would add a Summer Festival date, it should be noted that scene also includes Mitsuru, and plays out like the Protagonist and Mitsuru are parents to Aigis the inquisitive child."

So first off, Portable added this option, not Reload, though it is in Reload too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_NkQVBlE0U&ab_channel=Hanif

That said, I fail to see how this matters. Both the Summer Festival and the Christmas Eve event are 100% optional and thus not particularly relevant. The Christmas Date bit is also plot related, since she's out of commission at the time.

The Culture Festival moment meanwhile happens at a point where Aigis has not yet fully grown to realize her romantic feelings for the protagonist, much less to the point of understanding social situations like the one here.

"You've pointed to a specific line of dialogue from Persona Q, deliberately ignoring the overall context of the line - Chie and Yukiko assume they're dating because Aigis is in full-blown robot stalker mode, and Yukari has to tell Aigis to stop answering questions when she doesn't understand what people are actually saying to her."

This is referring to a different scene. The one I am referring to is this, at 4:19.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OE63c_1jCDM&ab_channel=omegaevolution

Oh and while we are on this subject, there's this from PQ 2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97j4h8TPHfw&ab_channel=Faz

"You've also completely ignored the fact that Aigis didn't even have a Social Link prior to the release of FES, and was therefore not even a romance option. And even when it was added, Atlus didn't code it as a romance, as evidenced by the lack of "You are now in an intimate relationship" flags."

Because it really doesn't matter, honestly. There's nothing here but speculation, and besides, Aigis' S. Link was added in the very next release of the game which came out the very next year and has been in every single release since. It's been in more releases at this point (3 of 4) then has Aigis not been an option for the Summer Festival (2 of 4).

"Yukari receives more ship tease than any other character because the player is actively able to flirt with Yukari in dialogue choices outside of her social link, which cannot be said for any other character in the game. It's not just a case of the love hotel and Yakushima beach scenes."

I assume you expect us to just take your word for this, since you didn't provide any evidence.

It's also not true, since I can pull up moments of him flirting with Aigis or hell even Fuuka too if I need to dig deep enough for this.

"The bad ending is relevant, especially as Reload now includes two versions of the bad ending - if you romance Yukari, and if you romance a different character. The version with Yukari romanced remains the same as the original iteration of the bad ending, implying that without the input of the player, Yukari and the Protagonist started dating. The bad ending is relevant, especially as Reload now includes two versions of the bad ending - if you romance Yukari, and if you romance a different character. The version with Yukari romanced remains the same as the original iteration of the bad ending, implying that without the input of the player, Yukari and the Protagonist started dating."

The bad ending isn't canon. That's my primary point here.

"Yes, it's implied that the love hotel scene also happens to whoever else is in the party, but the Protagonist remains locked to Yukari, it is not possible to be paired up with Mitsuru, another potential romantic interest - implicitly because there is a mutual attraction between Yukari and the Protagonist."

Yukari's reasoning for wanting to go to the Hotel has nothing to do with her feelings for the protag one way or another, while the same situation is implied to have happened to whoever else is in your party, even if it's Akihiko and Junpei. Do you think Akihiko and Junpei are also attracted to one another?

It's shiptease, but it's ultimately just that.

"About P 3 D - the argument isn't what you claim it is, but rather, in the Social Events the only character that Makoto shares any flirty responses with is Yukari. Which is factually true"

I've never played P 3 D, but I once again notice you putting player options ahead of what happens without player imput. That scene I linked has no player imput to it at all, it happens no matter what you decide.

"As far as the Answer goes, the reason Yukari has those feelings of jealousy is because she was actively in love with the Protagonist and the narrative really isn't subtle about it. And Yukari specifically refers to Aigis' desire to protect the Protagonist being stronger, that's it. Not her feelings in general."

Aigis is also in love with the protagonist and given that Yukari admits Aigis' feelings were stronger? Yeah. In the Japanese version Yukari says that Aigis' feelings for the protag are "bottomless".

"And keep in mind, the original entry didn't consider anything from Reload and if it did, there would be even more evidence to support Yukari as the ILI, as they not only added more scenes that support that, they actively removed some of the stuff that supports Aigis in that role, like the Protagonist holding her hand after she gets wrecked fighting Ryoji."

So you ARE aware of that scene of the protag holding hands with Aigis. Odd you didn't add that earlier when claiming Aigis and Makoto have no scenes prior to the rooftop.

Reload, btw, also added in this scene. At 16:23 the protag responds to being freed by running up to Aigis and putting his arm around her.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06isukVSu8Y&ab_channel=BuffMaister

It's true that out of 4 versions of Persona 3 not all handle every detail the same way, but when you have 4 versions the article is supposed to reflect all 4, not just whichever one best serves an argument.

So, what little consensus here is 2-1 for Aigis, and the lukewarm reaction from the Persona thread only has one person say both, one say either neither or Aigis.

I'm going to put the current vote at 2.5-1 (or 3.5-2).

A re-writeup could be reasonable, as at least one criticism (the heart thing) is somewhat valid (the Aigis entry absolutely misrepresents that, since the same symbol pops up above Junpei and Akihiko). But unless someone new chimes in, I think an Aigis entry can go back in.

Not sure what you mean by the hearts thing - if you mean that it's a valid criticism because Junpei and Akihiko aren't otherwise interested in Aigis, well the follow-up scene is this one: https://youtu.be/mvlonhL_C6g?si=8SFZm9F8UU80Cds_

3:40, Junpei says "she's so cute...but she's a robot". Both Junpei and Akihiko look at each other, sweat drops appear, and they hang their heads. The protagonist does not share in this.

Implication is that Junpei and Akihiko lose interest upon discovering Aigis is a robot. The protagonist on the other hand...eh?

That said, I'm ok with leaving it out if that's the only objection of course.