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openArthur Election Episode Western Animation
Does this entry from FunnyAneurysmMoment.Western Animation (not written by me) break the Rule Of Cautious Editing Judgment? I haven't touched it because I don't have neutral views on how the election turned out.
- The Arthur episode "The Election"
is about a mock election that Arthur's third grade class holds as they learn about the American government. Muffy is an ambitious female candidate with Power Hair, Arthur is a down-to-earth candidate who wants to help people out, and Binky is a self-aggrandizing Cloud Cuckoolander candidate with unfeasible ideas who somehow wins the election. Fifteen years after this first aired, it comes across as an uncanny prophecy for the 2016 U.S. presidential election, with Muffy as Hillary Clinton, Arthur as Bernie Sanders, and Binky as Donald Trump.
openBlatant Lies Real Life
The "Not Real Life" folder for Blatant Lies starts with "This kind of lie has never actually worked in Real Life. Therefore, what follows are all aversions and subversions." But most of the following Real Life examples are straight uses.
The line was added by Thesedaysthosedays, I can't see anything to suggest it wasn't a unproved unilateral decision. Is it supposed to be a self-demonstrating?
Also, they added political examples to it violating ROCEJ
, and we cut BlatantLies.Real Life Politics And War because of the controversy.
What should be done?
openSpam alert
raopooja800
Check the edit history out
, this user posted a link to some unknown website for no reason.
Cleaning out spamlink myself now.
openLunatic0verlord and complaining
Lunatic0verlord seems to habitually add negative comments
or irrelevant details to the page and/or the edit reasons.
- Fire Emblem
: added "for some reasons" because "It makes about as much sense as Emalf's Latino Accent."
- Fake Crossover: adding "Tokyo Mirage Sessions ♯FE might just be one of the fakest crossovers there is." because "I can't call it a REAL Crossover. So it can only be a fake one."
- Invincible Hero: adding "Alice from the Resident Evil Movies. She goes from an unbeatable Badass Normal to an overpowered Empowered Badass Normal across the films. Has hardly faced many things that she could consider a threat to herself and as if that wasn't enough, in order to ensure her invincibility, EVERYONE around her is an Adaptational Wimp (yes, even Nemesis and Wesker)!" because "I guess that's the closest thing we have to talk about her Mary Sue traits."
- Heartwarming.South Park The Stick Of Truth: added "However, they seem to drop it after what he did to Chef, not batting an eye over Cartman pushing him down his fortress.]]" because "What he did to Chef was totally uncalled for. But what Cartman did to him was totally called for."
- Rookie Red Ranger: added "(and, in Echoes, there's Fernand who outright LEAVES in frustration)" because "As a major villain, it's important to mention Fernand." which has nothing to do with the trope, and seems to be there purely to point out "Canon Foreigner gets UPSET".
- Adaptational Wimp was where I first noticed something seemed off... replacing "Alice" with "Alice (and even then, she's a Canon Foreigner)" because "Less flame baity, Alice is exclusive to the films". It seems someone spoke to them because they later changed "[[CreatorsPet Alice]]" to "[[BoringInvincibleHero Alice]]" because "Apparantly that Trope isn't allowed either... Guess that leaves only one option..."
openYMMV Question: Length of entires?
So an issue is coming up concerning a member on a YMMV page for the fan fic A Man of Iron. Basically, this member, Cheap Sun Glasses, clearly hates the story and has over the last few days repeatedly posted entries attacking the author and the story. Nothing too extreme, mind you... just things like "The author is an Smug Snake who thinks he knows the work better than everyone else" or "The author has no idea how to write the characters". This member first put these on the main page where they were removed as they were opinions. He has now put them in YMMV.
The issue isn't what he is posting it's the length. Nearly 3/4ths of his entries are massive walls of text that he even states are cut and pasted from a review he did of the story. Here is an example:
- Draco in Leather Pants: Mr. Chaos loves Tywin Lannister as much as he hates Catelyn Stark (see Ron the Death Eater), and tries to add a level of Hidden Depths to him. This scathing review of the story sums it up best:
"You spent a lot of time on the Lannisters, Tywin in particular. I'm kind of impressed by the image you presented of Tywin: cold, efficient, emotionless, and highly rational. A nice image, one Tywin himself would probably love. Too bad it has nothing to do with the Tywin Lannister as presented in the books. Tywin Lannister was a damn emotional being. He went to overkill on multiple occasions because of his emotions. The Reynes and Tarbacks were screwing his father and family for years: exterminate both families and destroy their castles. Rhaegar married Elia instead of Cersei: have Gregor and Amory kill Elia and her children in a monstrously violent manner. Tyrion married a peasant woman: have his guards rape her while Tyrion and Tywin watch, and then have Tyrion rape her while he still watched. Tyrion kidnapped by Catelyn: send in Ser Gregor and the Lannister army to invade the Riverlands (which, if Robert hadn't died when he did, would have meant Tywin disrupted the peace and would have faced severe reprisal for it). For all the people who praise him even while acknowledging his evilness, too few understand so much of who he was depended on the image he build for himself. There's a reason GRRM makes sure Tywin died in the priory and his very corpse stank: to make it clear how everything Tywin built was ultimately fragile and nowhere near as great and awesome as he claimed it was. Seven Hells, just look at how the Lannisters are doing in AFFC and ADWD compared to the Starks: where the Lannisters and their allies are destroying themselves, the Starks and their bannerman are the ones still around, still gaining in strength, and still very much willing to fight on for 'Ned's Daughter.'"
- He also tries to paint Rhaegar's relationship with Lyanna as a tragic love story. In reality, it was based on the paranoid narcissism of a selfish prince convinced that he was The Chosen One, or that his third child would be. To that end, he abandoned his wife (who was too weak to bear a third child) and ran off with a woman who was betrothed to someone else—even annulling his first marriage along with way—thus kick-starting a destructive war that got his not-wife and "bastard" children killed and his family displaced.
Now, to me that seems overly long. I have always assumed that T Vtropes likes to keep entries short. A sentence or two. Not the college essay this was. So I edited down his post to a more reasonable length and also added a bit for the other side. This is the edited version:
Draco in Leather Pants: Some fans feel that the author is doing this with Tywin, giving him more depth than there is. Others argue this is merely him developing the character, especially since he is given POV chapters here.
After I did this though it occurred to me that maybe I was in the wrong and it was perfectly within that member's right to have such walls of text in YMMV. And if so I will revert it back to what it was.
What are the rules on this? Am I correct that Tvtropes would prefer short, to the point entries? Or should it remain as posted, no matter the length? I don't want an edit war in any way, shape, or form, so coming to you guys.
Thank you
openBest way to clean up Self-Fulfilling Spoilers on character sheet? Videogame
Hi everyone! What is the best way to deal with Self-Fulfilling Spoiler and Spoilered Rotten examples on character sheets?
I've been working on the character sheet for the visual novel The Letter , and some of the characters' examples are inherently spoilers on their own. The most obvious examples are Character Death and Plotline Death for the characters who always die in the visual novel regardless of player choice. Currently for these examples, the trope name is visible, with the rest of the description spoiler-tagged.
Some things I could do (not sure what is best):
1. Do nothing.
If the way this character sheet handles spoilers is fine, then I won't do anything else.
2. Add an "Unmarked Spoilers" policy to the page.
I can add an "Unmarked Spoilers" notice at the top of the character sheet, and simply un-tag all spoilers. Since the visual novel is plot-heavy, this might be a good idea.
Besides the main page for The Letter is still spoiler-tagged, and people who want to avoid spoilers can simply read that.
3. Remove those examples.
The main page for The Letter already has a Killed Off for Real example, which AFAIK is already properly spoiler-tagged. I can just merge the examples from the character sheet into that one.
Thanks!
Edited by craleigh318openRegaridng all white entries... Anime
I found a couple spoilered entries on Anime.Pokemon The Movie Black And White. Specifically The Bad Guy Wins and Earn Your Happy Ending:
- The Bad Guy Wins: All of Damon's goals are accomplished successfully despite his Heel–Face Turn; this only means the Kingdom of the Vale was restored without the unintended and unaccounted-for side effects happening.
- Fridge Brilliance: The Dragon Force became destructive as a result of the two brothers of yore fighting their battle with Reshiram and Zekrom. It was neither the truth of collapse/the ideal of harmony that Ash bore nor the ideal of rebirth/the truth of vigilance Damon possessed that saved the Kingdom of the Vale in the end, but the cooperation between them, and between Reshiram and Zekrom in turn. Hate and zeal only destroy themselves and everything around them.
- Earn Your Happy Ending: How Damon's goals are accomplished without world destruction happening.
I am asking if the examples should be reworded or if the markup should be removed (On the one hand, Its canon status is dubious at best and it could be considered independent of the anime, a Non-Serial Movie. On the other hand the movie itself is a decade old at this point)? I will move the Fridge Brilliance bullet to the YMMV page once I edit these entries.
Edited by MorningStar1337openminor edit war and questionable edit on YMMV OOT Videogame
garthvader on YMMV.The Legend Of Zelda Ocarina Of Time removed the Water Temple from a Base Breaker entry,citing that "You see nobody dislikes the water temple because it's *hard*, the dislike it because you're constantly farting around in the menu". I put it back as the WT has become shorthand for 'hard Zelda dungeon', the master quest version and remakes made it easier because of its notorious difficulty. and the level designer even apologized for how hard it was, and the BB entry cited positive thoughts on the level as well, with some really loving it.
They re-removed it, saying " No, it's NOT notorious for being difficult, it's notorious for the fact that every time you mess up you have to repeat a sequence of annoying steps and menu transitions. Lying about why people don't like it makes a poor example. As an addition, the level designer did not apologise for how hard it was, quote: "I am most sorry that it was not easy for you to put on and take off the heavy boots, that all the time you had to visit the inventory. I am very sorry about that. I should have made it much easier to switch to the heavy boots," Aonuma said."
However, right before that Aonuma said "“The Water Temple in the Ocarina of Time was notorious for being very tough to conquer," implying he was being sarcastic about the boots, and even if not he does say the temple itself is difficult. I found the edit reasons a bit rude as well ^^;
But even more than they they added this to the YMMV page, which seems questionable. "**Naming Link as "Hitler" also results in a, um, interesting new interpretation of the story."
Edited by lalalei2001openVery poor grammar from an editor
jokevv
kinda has really poor grammar and etc. While I believe their edits are done in good faith, alot of them really fail basic writing rules. Improper use of punctuation marks and spelling errors such as using "munch" instead of "much" are some of their mistakes. It's so bad in one place that I made an inquiry in Is this an example?
partially because some if not all the entries they made were really hard to decipher.
Here's part of what I'm talking about which includes one of their most recent edits:
- Alternate Character Interpretation: What does Zeldris plan to do as Demon king? He has so far been the only one to describe the demon clan as a race of outcasts and those despised by the other clans and accepting of other outcasts. He was in willing lovenote Given her powers and how ruthless and evil Meliodas was described back then. It seem incredible unlikely he was in a state to fall in love with Elizabeth without use of her magic to sway his heart with a member of a race below his own, let alone his status as prince. Does Zeldris for all his villainy see kingship the same way that King does? He cared for how his men were slowly being killed off (though it could be because of pride), he opposes Meliodas as king for the implication of he was a traitor more then it seems because he covets the throne and the fact he choose to seal the vampires brings up another question. Why seal them all when he could have just wiped out all the other vampire's except Gelda, but he choose to seal them all. Meliodas fought and killed his comrades for his love despite supposedly being more moral by that point. Zeldris came up with a compromise to fulfill his duty and kept the one he loved alive something Meliodas did not do. These seem to point towards Zeldris as more inline with Meliodas ideal of a good king embodied by King then Meliodas himself.
- Chapter 247 give even more credit to this interpretations by showcasing Zeldris outrage toward estarossa comment of killing the other demon's for their commandment's despite it being unlikely to get them any other given their loyalty to the demon king and how his desire to become king is for a single purpose. Yet he still showed anger to kill other member's of his race because their loyalty get's in the way of his goals. Something Meliodas back to his ten commandment day's did not show or even emote when the idea was brought up.
- The demons themselves bring this up. While the demon are portrayed as vicious and have no issue taking innocent lives. The question of whether they are like this by nature and the goddess opposed them justifiably despite not being munch better or devolved into the beasts the demons are stereotyped by the other clans as thanks to having to fighting for their very existence from all other races who despise them for who they are. The fact that there was a truce between the goddess and demon which the goddess broke at the first sign of disadvantage and Zeldris description of the clan hints towards the latter interpretation but it's very munch still vague.
- The Goddesses: Are they a race of Arrogant Jerkass knight templars who are truly no better then the Demon Clan and who's bigotry keeps the demons from reconciling with the other clans and causing endless war and death on all sides thanks to their pride. Or a race of Jerkass Has a Point where while terrible, the demons are a threat to all life and so powerful all the clans united is required to defeat them.
It's really hard to decipher what they're trying to say in some parts and ascertain if what they added are really examples because of the horrible grammar.
openJeff Goldblum: Is He Adam Westing? Film
Jeff Goldblum (wonderful sweet man and the love of my internet life) has, mostly of late, been known to play characters that are basically just him being his Goldblum-iest self (ex. The Grandmaster in Thor: Ragnarok) So my question is whether this is a case of Adam Westing or Type-Casting or some other trope that I am forgetting?
openIs this an already-existing genre?
I recently found some similarities between Dante Alighieri's The Divine Comedy, Charles Dickens's A Christmas Carol and Frank Capra's It's a Wonderful Life. All three stories have elements of:
- Triparta, or “threeness”: The Divine Comedy is in three parts dealing with the afterlife and A Christmas Carol has three different Ghosts of Christmas. "Triparta" is a word I made up to mean "three parts".
- “Alterreality”: Realities that cannot be physically explored but are for the sake of the story.
- Temporal vs. Spatial: A Christmas Carol has temporal alterreality in the past, present and future; The Divine Comedy has spatial alterreality in Hell, Purgatory and Heaven; It’s a Wonderful Life has elements of both in the version of reality without George Bailey.
- Often combined with Triparta: Both The Divine Comedy and A Christmas Carol have alterrealities divided into three parts.
- Downplayed in It's a Wonderful Life: The past and present portions of life without George are told to him by Clarence and are not shown. The future is not shown at all.
- A protagonist who is past their youth who is in dire need of change lest they suffer a horrible fate: Thirty-year-old Dante in The Divine Comedy has lost his way to being in God’s love; elderly Scrooge in A Christmas Carol is a miser in need of the Christmas Spirit; and thirtysomething George Bailey in It’s a Wonderful Life is on the verge of committing suicide because he feels he’s made no difference in his life. The horrible fate in question is usually either death and/or damnation: Dante and Scrooge face eternal damnation in Hell if they don’t change their ways; George will die if he does not, and given Christian attitudes on suicide, would likely have wound up in Hell for killing himself.
- They have no power while undergoing their journey: Dante is powerless against both the environments and agents of fate of Hell, Purgatory and Heaven; Scrooge cannot escape the visions of the past, present and future shown to him by the Spirits; this is downplayed in It’s a Wonderful Life: George can communicate with people in the alternate Bedford Falls/Pottersville, but cannot convince them of who he is (justified since he never existed in this reality; they can’t remember someone they never knew).
- Spiritual guidance provided by spiritual entities: Virgil and later Beatrice guide Dante in The Divine Comedy; the Ghosts of Christmas Past, Present and Future guide Scrooge in A Christmas Carol; and the angel Clarence guides George in It’s a Wonderful Life.
- The protagonist changes to a better state not unlike youthful purity at the end of the story: Dante is reunited with God’s love at the end of the Paradisio; Scrooge becomes nicer and more genial at the end of A Christmas Carol; and George’s will to live is restored at the end of It’s a Wonderful Life. This change is required, for without it they face death and/or damnation.
- Restorative vs. Transformative: Their change is either meant to return to them something they have lost or revert them to their previous way of thinking (restorative) or convert them to a better path (transformative). Dante’s change restores his virtue; while Scrooge changes to be a nicer, happier and more charitable person. George’s change has elements of both: He is restored to his previously happy and lively self after he is made to realize something he had not known previously. Dante’s change is restorative, Scrooge’s is transformative and George’s is a mixture of both.
My question is, does this type of story exist already? I think it has merit as a trope. The gist of it is that a protagonist who is past their youth is shown the consequences for their current behavior by a Spirit Guide - whether by going on a journey or through visions - and comes out of it in a better emotional, mental or spiritual state, whether because they've been enlightened, regained something they lost, shown the error of their ways or something else. Does this already exist?
Edited by SirHandel3openThe Emoji Movie page problems Western Animation
The main Emoji Movie page has a lot of weird, shoehorned examples, as does the YMMV page, mainly about how Smiler was right and/or the movie broke its own aesops. Most of the pertinent entries were written by the same troper, MeaJae97.
Examples:
"
- If Jailbreak is meant to be a strong independent minded female role model, then why does she learn to fit in with the expectations of society? It seems to suggest that you can only save the day by following tradition. And why does the movie treat her as being selfish for rejecting Gene's fairy-tale views of romance?
- If the movie was supposed to mock the excessive use of technology, then this was sure as hell broken when sending a text ultimately saves the day. Also, none of the human characters learn the drawbacks of their obsession with technology.
- Hi-5 has to learn to stop being a narcissistic jerk and yet he still yearns for popularity through the entire movie. After he says he learned his lesson, he shouts about how "they love us" without any humility. Lesson learned.
- For a movie where women "have limitless potential"
there don't seem to be any interestingly written female characters. The generic order obsessed villain, the generic princess, the generic tough girl, and the generic love interest. Note that the only female character of significance other than the villain fits three out of those four characters.
- Wisecrack Edition made the case that
the lesson of "you should reject societal expectations and express who you truly wish to be" couldn't escape unbroken. Sure, Smiler was defeated and the Emojis learn that it's perfectly fine to express more than one emotion. However, there is still the fact that they are stuck with one function, to serve Alex. What a brilliant life. Emojis were invented for this very specific purpose, so Textopolis is a terrible metaphor. The movie constantly validates the idea that they should only peruse society's intended purpose for them. In Real Life, this can easily prevent people from being themselves.
- If Emojis wanted to become more than merely vessels of conveying ideas, then Alex could simply delete them as they would have outlived their usefulness. After all, Gene didn't stop the phone from being erased. It was Alex who prevented it because his crush was so Easily Impressed.
- Aspects of the caste system still remain intact as the unpopular Emojis remain in the Loser Lounge.
- Jailbreak learns to stop valuing freedom and reverts back to being a Princess.
- Gene quickly discards the idea of leaving the phone forever.
- Hi-5 never dumps his narcissistic ways."
"* Unwitting Instigator of Doom: If the villain had simply had her way, then the movie would be far shorter. And audiences would be better off as a result.
- Well-Intentioned Extremist: Smiler tries to delete Gene because she sees him as an existential threat to the safety of Textopolis."
openTroper editing with questionable phrasing.
Troper Euodiachloris made some entrees to the Dark Souls character page for the Dark Souls: Main Characters and Lords and the overall phrasing seems really poor to me. For example;
- Determinator: Kaathe keeps trying to end the Age of Fire, no matter how many poor saps get corrupted in the meantime. If he'd been less bull-headed in trying full-on people-experiments in closely-related places, he might have been able to step back and ask himself a little more about what connected all the failures. Instead of victim-blaming people, he might have found clues to look a little more at the flipping seal in the actual Ringed flipping City and wasted a whole lot less of everybody's time on religious frippery and lies.
This seems to be filled with a lot of natter plus the overall entree really feels off.
openPokemon Wham Episodes. Anime
From Wham Episode.Anime, I question the following from Pokémon.
- EP-015 "Battle Aboard the St. Anne". Giovanni appears for the first time and orders Team Rocket to attack the St. Anne, Ash trades his Butterfree for a Raticate (but later trades it back) and at the end the ship sinks with the group on board.
- EP-134 "Charizard's Burning Ambitions". Ash leaves Charizard, one of the anime's most loved Pokemon on the Charricific Valley.
- AG-044 "The Princess and the Togepi" and AG-045 "A Togepi Mirage". Misty comes back with new clothes, is revealed to own a Gyarados (depends if you are watching Chronicles on their Japanese air date), her Togepi evolves, and it's then released to take care of the Togepi paradise.
- AG-132 "The Scheme Team". The group separates and Ash comes back to Kanto. Ash encounters Agatha, who is the Viridian Gym Leader here and battles her. Then finds out about the battle Frontier and decides to challenge it. Then he finds Misty and an Azurill in his house, and Max also arrives there.
- DP-062 "Tanks For The Memories". Dawn gets depressed and stops believing in herself. Couple that with season-named sisters, one of them falling for Brock and Ash crossdressing as a maid, and you get an unforgettable episode.
- DP-189 "The Semi-Final Frontier". One of the most influential episodes within the fandom. Ash gets to the Sinnoh League semifinals, where he finds a strong trainer named Tobias. After many losses Ash gets to beat his Darkrai, but Tobias is then revelated to own a Latios who ends up at a tie with Ash's Pikachu, leaving Ash with no Pokémon left and thus eliminated from the League. Additionally, when the episode finished airing on Japan, Ash's return as the protagonist in the Best Wishes series was announced, complete with his controversial eye style change.
- BW-001 "In the Shadow of Zekrom". Another influential episode, but this time thanks to the rather trivial fact that Ash is still 10 years old. Additionaly, the battle between Pikachu and Snivy is also controversial and people still talk (or complain) about it today.
- BW-018 "Sewaddle and Burgh in Pinwheel Forest!" Ash captures Sewaddle, breaking the format of Ash capturing only six Pokemon per Region. Ash would go on to catch nine Unova Pokémon.
- BW-023 "Battling For The Love of Bug-Types!". The previous two episodes (that featured Team Plasma vs Team Rocket) were banned, so there were a lot of questions unanswered, and this episode at least provided the answer to one of them: Team Rocket lost. As a result of that, Team Rocket came back to their usual selves dressed in white, and acted a bit funny. Additionaly, Ash's Sewaddle evolves, James caughts a Yamask and Ash gets his third Unova badge.
- BW-096 "Meloetta and the Undersea Temple!" and BW-097 "Unova's Survival Crisis". Team Rocket gets to control Meloetta, Tornadus, Thundurus and Landorus, Ash faces Giovanni for the first time, albeit briefly, Giovanni gets mad for power but loses in the end, causing Team Rocket to be withdrawn from Unova.
- XY-060 "A Showcase Debut". Serena participates on her first Pokemon Showcase, but loses in the Theme Performance round. Early the next morning, Serena goes to a dock and cries for her failure, but after being reconfortated by her Pokemon, she proceeds to cut her hair and change her style permanently. Additionaly, a mysterious woman and a former performer named Palermo is introduced.
- XY-062 "The Future Is Now, Thanks to Determination!" Clemont's Luxio evolves, but more importantly, Clemont decides to leave the group temporarily in order to prepare his battle with Ash. This is the first instance of a travel companion leaving the group in the middle of a series, though Clemont comes back after said battle.
- XY-064 "Battling with Elegance and a Big Smile!" The writers really were on a good run here. Serena meets her idol Aria (disguised as Ariana) and gets to battle her, with her Fennekin evolving into Braixen in the process. Also, Ash's rival Sawyer gets an Early-Bird Cameo.
- SM-021 "One Journey Ends, Another Begins..." The episode begins with the recurring Litten panicking and worried because the elderly Stoutland that took it in hasn't been in good health. Ash and Nurse Joy do what they can, but it isn't injured or sick. Stoutland dies of old age.
Any objections/thoughts?
open What to do about a rude edit reason?
I was casually browsing through the site when I came upon a rather rude edit reason left by someone. The edit reason wasn't directed at me personally or an edit that I made, but it was still needlessly vicious, and it seemed like something I should report. I noticed that you can click the "Send a message" button to send users an automatic message, and that "rudeness" is one of the issues that can be reported. However, I'm not really comfortable sending the rude user in question a PM myself (and having him/her see that I sent it) when it wasn't an issue that I was directly involved in.
So, my question is, is there another way to report rude edit reasons? I'm asking partly in regards to the rudeness I saw just now, but also for future reference in knowing what to do if I come across something like this again.

I'm doing a mass edit on the Soul Nomad & the World Eaters page to change most of the pronouns for Revya, a character who can be either male or female, to "they" or "them" from "he/she" or "him/her". However, I'm unsure of what to do with "him/herself". Do either of the above work or is there better word to put in it's place?
Also, is "they" or "them" preferable to "he/she" or "him/her"? What exactly is the policy for characters whose gender can be chosen and don't have default options?
Edited by AkoSiKuya23