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openFollow-up query to RedMoonAlgesco
The original query is long buried by this point, but consider this new query a "bump" of sorts because Red Moon Algesco is still displaying very bad editing issues. Most notably on Characters.Genshin Impact Archons (history here
).
Here's an example they added to Baal's profile, which is a clear violation of Example Indentation in Trope Lists.
- Jerkass: Baal is a very self-centered, arrogant and egotistic Archon who rules Inazuma as more of a ruthless Dictator than a proper Ruler. To summarize...
- Jerkass Gods: Compared to the mischievous Venti and the collected Zhongli, Baal is a massive Narcissist who holds her country in an iron grip and even initiates a decree to seize all vision-holders inside her domain. It is said that as of currently, it has been a year since she granted anyone an Electro vision. Reasons for this is currently unknown.
open Disproportionate Retribution
So Ferot_Dreadnaught has been removing a bunch of examples from DisproportionateRetribution.My Little Pony Friendship Is Magic on the grounds that it needs to be In-Universe or intentional. The problem is that the trope itself never states that it needs to be In-Universe or intentional only that some for retribution to be disproportionate to what happens. So I don't think that these removals are valid.
Edited by Ordeaux26openRaya and the Last Dragon - Villain has a Point Western Animation
This has been added and removed by various tropers, the most recent of which is rva98014:
- Villain Has a Point: Downplayed. Namaari isn't a villain so much as she is the story's antagonist, but towards the climax, she's not wrong when she soberly points out two things. First, she tells Raya that while Sisu was the bigger person and bothered to trust Namaari, the disasterous outcome happened because Raya didn't trust Sisu's judgement nor anyone else. Second, although Namaari bringing a crossbow played a part in Sisu's Disney Death, Raya causing the misfire technically makes it Raya's fault as well.
For some context, the hero accidentally causes a crossbow bolt to kill a supporting character who could have saved the world. The person who she made accidentally shoot said character blames her, and the animation supports this.
Can we get a consensus, here? For the record, I really do think it was solely Namaari's fault, but it's not supported in the movie itself, and Word of God hasn't said anything on if both characters were in the right/wrong.
Edited by FishiousRendopenTheReasonYouSuckSpeech and the "commentary community" Web Original
In December 2019, this
discussion in the "Is this an example?" thread led to the removal of all examples on TheReasonYouSuckSpeech.Web Original that involve reviewers bashing works/characters/writers they don't like or that were posted in the form of comments on YouTube videos, etc. In that thread, I noted
that the folder for the "commentary community" that used to be on the page seemed like a bunch of questionably valid examples dripping with drama importation, and everyone there was okay with me cutting them.
But earlier today, I found out that TheReasonYouSuckSpeech.The Commentary Community was made from the deleted examples in May 2020 by Blazing_Larvesta, with the edit reason of "Turning a deleted section into its own article. Really hope I don't wind up clowning myself here..." The examples are still pretty questionable, and they're still taking sides in internet fights, so can I cutlist that page?
Edited by SeracopenPossible fanfic page "ownership" issue
Happened to look at the Cut List and see that Muse Hysteria and its Trivia subpage are listed, with the reason of "fanfic is being retooled". The page looks like a stub, but all its content was just removed
by HotmanX32, who, it turns out, is also the author
. The story itself does seem to still exist
.
openQuestionable WMGs
Recently, I have come across a few WMG pages/entries that may go against the rules.
- The Mysterious Mr. Enter. Most of the entries are about his reviews and what he'll review next, which is fine. However, there are a couple that are based on him as a person. The first WMG in particular is downright absurd, considering it's talking about a real life personnote by contrast, the "Mr. Enter will turn into an enter keyboard button" entry seems to be referring to his avatar, not him as a person.
- Perfect Hair Forever only has one entry, and it's about the show being brought back for another season (or at least more episodes). While WMG guesses are supposed to be about what happens in the work itself, this one skirts the line a bit, although the reason given seems to lean more into the "not allowed" territory; it basically says the show may get more episodes just to fill more Adult Swim timeslots. Speaking of which...
- Adult Swim is the one that really stuck out. Entries about Adult Swim execs take the piss out of anime, blaming Adult Swim for both Cartoon Network's downfall and a bomb scare, and guessing Adult Swim's schedule in the years to come (which may go against WMG rules, but is comparatively tame compared to some of the other entries).
openFranchise Killing in Digimon Anime
So, Digimon is registered in Franchise Killer under the following context: The decline of the virtual pet craze caused Digimon to take a few major knocks in the merch sales, and it wasn't helped by Digimon Tamers underperforming in its target demographic (though it did end up Vindicated by History when older audiences rediscovered it). Digimon Frontier attempted to reverse the decline by retooling itself as a Henshin Hero series, but this alienated a chunk of existing fans and failed to create enough new ones, putting the franchise on ice until Digimon Data Squad four years later. And then it went on hiatus until Digimon Fusion four years later again. And then another hiatus until Digimon Adventure tri. four years later yet again (five'' years later with Digimon Universe: App Monsters if only counting TV shows). Needless to say, the franchise has had it rough since its heyday.
I have to ask, is this valid? Considering the franchise still continues to this day, does it really belong on the Franchise Killer page?
openA bizarre occurrence
So, Vif119 is currently involved in an Edit War on YMMV.Transformers Beast Wars 2021 over whether an example fits Fan Dumb, Hatedom, or Hate Dumb. The twist this time is that he’s at war with himself, as the majority of recent edits to that page are him editing that example. Any solutions?
Edited by GeneralGiganopenIs Harry Potter an Adaptational Badass? Film
Much like the DC Extended Universe, the Harry Potter saga is no stranger to controversy and this time I wanna focus on our boy Harry
. His character page lists him as an Adaptational Badass under the following conditions:
- In the first book, Harry is barely able to hold off Quirrell, with the effort nearly proving fatal. In the film, Harry kills Quirrell with relative ease, and is still on his feet before being downed by Voldemort's soul when he escapes.
- When confronted by Snape in the Shrieking Shack in the third film, Harry sends him flying into the wall with an Expelliarmus from Hermione's wand, which is supposed to be more difficult with a wand that hasn't chosen him. In the books, this same effect was achieved by him, Ron, and Hermione trying to disarm Snape simultaneously.
- In the fifth book, his duel with the Death Eaters in the Ministry had him fumbling spells a few times including reversing his own spell by accident. The film portrays him as being far more competent overall.
I have to ask: are these entries valid? Adaptational Badass has seen a lot of misuse in recent years and the AB page has a paragraph that says: At its core this causes a significant dissonance with those familiar with the original character. It is not about a change in personality (Martial Pacifist to Blood Knight), method of fighting (defensive Simple Staff to offensive BFS) or battlefield intelligence (Dumb Muscle to Genius Bruiser), but in terms of how relevant they are in a fight. The key is how they are able to navigate through the story. Consider as a result of Power Creep, Power Seep that Superman himself has varied from simply "above human" in strength to near godlike, but he has always been Superman.
Also, I've always believed that Adaptational Badass applies when the character, in his/her entirety, becomes a badass in the adaptation, not when he/she is given small moments of badassery, even when he/she is already a badass in the source material. So, what do you think?
openMore YMMV/BlackWidow2021 issues?
YMMV.Black Widow 2021, which had prior ATT
, has these entries I find suspect.
- Epileptic Trees: Given the controversy around Taskmaster barely resembling the comic character, people are already theorising how to give the character a 'do-over', specifically calling to how Mandarin and Deadpool (two characters who were similarly, controversially overhauled in their respective film debuts) got revamped years later. Ideas range from a Legacy Character approach, having "Antonia" get a sudden personality change, or even just straight-up introducing a comic accurate version with no relation to the version in this movie.
- Narm:
- Dreykov being unable to be harm by the Black Widows through pheromones of all things has been met with a lot of eye rolling from fans, with many raising the question on why Natasha can't simply shoot him from across the room.
Epileptic Trees I think is off the wall improbable speculation about the work itself, not future works, but this could be valid. Narm I'm very certain is misuses as this is more Fridge Logic than unintentionally funny. Thoughts?
openA note encouraging use of zero context examples
Spotted this note on Close on Title —
Looks like it was added back in 2015 by someone who was not a mod. Since this obviously flies in the face of Zero-Context Example, would it be cool if I removed it?
openQuestionable Entry
On Breast Expansion, in the Web Originals tab, there's an entire section for the Breast Expansion Archive, which is... almost certainly a fetish website. I'm a bit unsure of whether or not to remove the entry because some of the stories do seem to be more than just the fetish (one of them even has its own page), but on the other hand, it feels a bit weird to have a huge entry be solely from a fetish site with only one story having its own page. What do you guys think?
Edit: The stories themselves are listed as separate sub-entries, so it appears to be listing the stories as the actual entries, not the site itself.
Edited by idonomopenThis Wiki as audience reaction proof?
I will be adding this to TooBleakStoppedCaring.Fan Works per Cleanup
.
- The Dear Sweetie Belle Continuity shifting to foreshadowing/setting up an apocalyptic conflict has put off many who enjoyed the series character-driven Slice of Life, especially since the characters it made them so attached to are now at high risk of getting unhappy endings. Not helping is said conflict is being caused in part by the controversial actions of the series more controversial characters while likable characters are denied agency, most notoriously Pinkie Pie dying of unspecified causes prior. The first story fully set in this darker direction, The Changelings Have a King, had a high body count and higher ratio of dislikes to likes than any other work in the seres. While later works were much better received, their having only one-fifth the likes shows a large majority, all save the most dedicated fans, stopped caring about the series to the point its cancelation went largely without notice.
I was thinking of adding that, despite having a tropes page, it took nearly a year for this wiki to acknowledge its cancelation as more evidence its fans/readers have stopped caring. Would that be OK to add if it is only secondary evidence to the primary out of wiki proof? Or should such be avoided if unnecessary (there's other proof enough) and/or overly myopic/self-referential? (I asked the cleanup but they seemed mixed on it.)
openSpringfield as a whole is a Card Carrying Jerkass?
I found this entry on the recap page of The Simpsons episode "The Boys of Bummer"
- Card-Carrying Jerkass: The whole town quite proudly (literally, as in has it on billboards advertising the place) labels itself "The Meanest City In America".
But is this really why there is billboard that labels the city as such? For all we know, somebody outside of Springfield could've put that billboard up.
Edited by BrianKTopenDisagreement over rerailment
So lately, user Bowbowis and I have been in disagreement over Sonic Forces. He adds the following:
- Character Rerailment:
- Knuckles is a Reasonable Authority Figure as the leader of the Resistance, restoring some of his dignity after years of Badass Decay and Flanderization. Even when his plan to assault the capital city literally goes sideways, it's because of an unprecedented display of power from Infinite, rather than genuine stupidity on Knuckles' part. The "guardian of the Master Emerald" thing is still ignored though.
- Forces returns Shadow to the levelheaded and heroic (if not always friendly) personality he had in Heroes and '06, in contrast previous Sonic media of the 2010s, where he's portrayed as more of a petty thug.
I've disagreed with these statements for a while now, because Character Rerailment, as I understand it, refers to when a character returns to their original characterization, not to any form of dignity. In the case of Knuckles, he was never a team leader, much less the leader of an army; if anything, this example is just further Character Derailment, as it feels a different character was written with Knuckles's face and name.
Just because he is taken "seriously" (despite the fact he commits one stupid mistake because he planned the operation in a minute and a half) is just further derailment to me. Heck, the entry itself aknowledges that the "guardian of the Master Emerald" thing is ignored. despite being core of Knuckles character, with him being a treasure hunter the second core.
Likewise, the only form of rerailment involving Shadow is his interpretation in a racing game from 2010 where he was a petty thug, and even then he returned to his established characterization by the next main line game (Generations). This entry also adds a different incarnation of Shadow that has no place in here. This would be like saying the PS 4 Spider-man is Character Rerailment compared with the MCU Spider-man; a false equivalent. So Shadow is shoehorned in this entry because of a AU spin-off.
I cut these entries off with my judgement (and I'll admit I was a bit rude, mostly calling the 2010 game "stupid") twice, and it has been re-added twice.
I cut another entry involving Amy, mostly because someone has been adding the same entry every time she appears, pretending she still has her Sonic Battle characterization. So far, no one has brought it up again.
Edited by Tomodachiopen Omega Character Page Western Animation
I would like to argue against the inclusion of Ambiguous Gender Identity on the official character page for Omega of The Bad Batch. Throughout the entire show she has been presented as female and identified as such by other characters. She was identified as female in the very first episode by Tech who specifically said that he was looking at her DNA. In the episode "Bounty Lost" Tech explains that she has unaltered Jango DNA. Tech referred to the alterations in question as rapid aging, and increased obediance. Furthermore this trope implies that Omega herself is unsure what her gender is, when she has been presenting herself as female throughout the entire show. She did not correct Cad Bane when he referred to her as "little lady" nor did she do it to anyone else that referred to her as a girl. The point here is that there is no ambiguity that Omega sees herself as female regardless if she was born that way or not. There is absolutely no problem with fan interpretations of her as transgender but it should be delegated to the YMMV page.
open People who "helpfully" cut stuff entirely instead of trying to fix it
Inspired by [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=VideoGame.LegendOfMana#edit30094066
this edit]. Yes, I'm aware that he was correct on the fact that the section wasn't organized per TVT policy. I do, however, think that cutting it entirely without making any attempt to integrate it properly was not good. Furthermore, this is far from the only time I've seen self-appointed janitors muck up articles with hamfisted "cleanups."
Could we maybe get some kind of policy regarding this? Like don't take a weedwhacker to a page without trying to fix it up first, and if you muck the page up in the name of overzealous cleanups it's basically vandalism?
openTitle Drop
Just stumbled upon TitleDrop.TV Tropes, which feels bizarre to say the least. It has only two examples (one with natter), hasn't been edited for seven years, and is affected by the AC markup bug (if anyone cares about that). Doesn't seem like the second one applies, and I don't think the wiki itself really has examples of this trope. Do we actually have them, or should this just be cut?
Edited by PiterpicheropenUncertain Audience examples?
Questions about the validity of the following Uncertain Audience examples:
YMMV.My Little Pony The Movie 2017: One reason for its mediocre reception. Fans of the show were less than impressed with the lack of continuity past Season 4 and it not doing anything the show hadn't done better prior, while non-fans who wouldn't mind or appreciate the lack of Continuity Lock-Out still had little reason to care for The Movie if they weren't already interested in the show.
Animation Lead Time meant this was due to it being written right after Season 4 and wouldn't be able to include later continuity beyond cameos if it wanted. If it was not caused by a deliberate chose by the writers on which audience to target does UA count? If not is there anything it does fall under?
YMMV.Fantastic Beasts The Crimes Of Grindelwald: A common complaint from critics, especially after the underwhelming box office receipts came back. Unlike Harry Potter, which focused on kid heroes and self-contained adventures with interesting lore and scope underneath, Crimes of Grindelwald is heavy on backstory, exposition, and lore, but does little in advancing its own story or major arcs forward. Thus, detractors of the film point out it lacks the elements that appealed to young audiences in the original films while also being downright impenetrable to anyone who doesn't have a Ph.D. in Wizarding World mythology. This is cited as one of the reasons Warner Bros. halted production on the third to give Rowling more time to figure out how to remedy this.
This sounds like it put off general audiences, but fails to explain how those it was supposed to appeal to (like those with a "Ph.D. in Wizarding World mythology") were put off by the work as well. Is there a reason they were so put off (normally don't care for the movies?) or should this just be moved to Continuity Lock-Out?

I've noticed that many, many fanfic recs on the various Fanfic Recs/ pages don't follow the template listed on Fanfic Recommendations. Normally this isn't too bad - just swapping the order of the lines or adding the review button - but it's also pretty common for people to add a "comments" line and provide their (sometimes very long) thoughts and opinions on the fic, when that's apparently supposed to be reserved for reviews.
Since I don't think it's possible to move these comments to the proper place myself, what do we do about this? Delete the comments outright? Message the (active) tropers and warn them that the comments belong in a review, and, if nothing's done, will be removed after X amount of time?
I feel a bit bad deleting all this information outright, especially if it could go elsewhere, but moving it wouldn't be easy and all the comments are really bloating some pages.