Have a question about how the TVTropes wiki works? No one knows this community better than the people in it, so ask away! Ask the Tropers is the page you come to when you have a question burning in your brain and the support pages didn't help.
It's not for everything, though. For a list of all the resources for your questions, click here. You can also go to this Directory thread
for ongoing cleanup projects.
Ask the Tropers is for:
- General questions about the wiki, how it works, and how to do things.
- Reports of problems with wiki articles, or requests for help with wiki articles.
- Reports of misbehavior or abuse by other tropers.
Ask the Tropers is not for:
- Help identifying a trope. See TropeFinder.
- Help identifying a work. See MediaFinder.
- Asking if a trope example is valid. See the Trope Talk forum.
- Proposing new tropes. See TropeLaunchPad.
- Making bug reports. See QueryBugs.
- Asking for new wiki features. See QueryWishlist.
- Chatting with other tropers. See our forums.
- Reporting problems with advertisements. See this forum topic.
- Reporting issues on the forums. Send a Holler instead.
Ask the Tropers:
openMildly Concerning Attitude Anime
Joining Reaper recently edited the Isekai Quartet page. The edit reason they left is in relation to several weeks ago when an episode of the show came out and they insisted on adding a Early-Bird Cameo entry without confirmation from either Word of God or the show itself that it was the case.
The most recent episode confirmed they were right, but the edit entry they left read as follows: Oh, what's this? Did it turn out that it was Ristarte? Why, who could have told us so? Mayhaps, me', when I told you and you dismissed as speculation?!
This rubs me the wrong way and seems very aggressive. The reason we had the original entry hidden was because it wasn't confirmed.
openRegarding Spoiler Policy for characters in Naruto Anime
Regarding Characters.Naruto, while checking for example, Pain's page, it shows in the description itself a lot about his past and motivations which are revealed quite late into the arc having his decisive fight, and in Madara's folder, in his description, the exact specifics of his defeat are written in great detail.
These are just two examples out of many, and in the folders, there are marked and unmarked spoilers with irregularity. Now, Naruto is an old anime, so I wanted to ask whether to remove the excruciating details in the description and spoiler out the spoilery details, or just leave them alone?
Edited by kuchiki222openNaruto Unintentionally Unsympathetic Anime
Copying this from the Unintentionally Unsympathetic cleanup thread to give more people a chance to look at this.
- I would like to bring up the following entries from the Anime & Manga subpage of Unintentionally Unsympathetic to see which of these examples are valid or not. I'm not exactly familiar with the material so anyone who knows about the entries can help, thanks.
- Naruto:
- Sasuke Uchiha rapidly becomes this as the series progresses, at first his Freudian Excuse is very strong i.e. his brother Itachi murdered his parents and his entire clan and he naturally wants Revenge. However that excuse for all Sasuke’s misdeeds stretches thin when he antagonises his allies and dismisses the tragedies of those who have also lost their loved ones compared to his own trauma, Kakashi in particular highlights how selfish Sasuke is as he reveals to him that his loved ones (Obito and Rin) are already dead when Sasuke threatens them. After Sasuke's Face–Heel Turn it becomes even harder to sympathise with him as he betrays the village, actively tries to murder his friends, attacks the Kages and generally acts like a terrorist. It comes to the point where the whole cast (except for Naruto, Sakura and Ino) being prepared to bring Sasuke to justice is entirely justified and Naruto’s determination to redeem Sasuke is almost nonsensical. Also Sasuke being as Easily Forgiven in the Distant Finale conflicts matters more as the worst punishment he gets is being “somewhat exiled” from Konoha which is barely a slap on the wrist in the weight of his crimes. If Kakashi calls him out on his actions, isn't that intentional? If it is, cut.
- The backstory of the legendary "Salamander" Hanzo, the ninja against whom the Sannin won their titles by surviving a battle with him sets Hanzo up as a Well-Intentioned Extremist who lost sight of his goals but is honored in defeat by his rival as a man who strove for peace. By starting a lot of wars and turning his homeland into an unlivable hellhole that produced the most psychologically broken, defeated human beings in the series, just because he was arrogant enough to think his strength could unite the world. Most fans still consider Hanzo an utterly unsympathetic character whose violent death at Pain's hands was richly deserved, as his claim of good intentions didn't make him any less of a paranoid warmongering dictator. How is he supposed to be sympathetic?
- Sakura Haruno's angst over her Single-Target Sexuality - the aforementioned Sasuke - really makes her unsympathetic in many viewer’s eyes. Kishimoto claimed in interviews he tried to make her feelings for Sasuke as “realistic” as possible but that falls flat as in the manga she hasn’t even had a proper conversation with him, and when she did talk to him he just called her annoying (even after she told him she loved him and was willingly to ditch her peaceful life just to be with him) and knocked her out. After the Time Skip she mellows out... until Sasuke comes back into the story and she Took a Level in Dumbass trying to take Sasuke down herself and of course fails, requiring Kakashi and Naruto to save her ass from the boy she loves. The Final Battle and Distant Finale makes it worse as Sakura easily forgives Sasuke for trying to kill her multiple times, and she settles down and marries him having learned no lesson whatsoever. Also Kishimoto’s insistence that Sakura would be a “terrible woman” if she moved on from Sasuke didn’t help matters. Unsure on this one, if it is a valid example, it could use a rewrite to cut on the complaining.
- Tobi AKA Obito Uchiha. He's supposed to be a world-weary counterpart to the protagonist who has given up hope on any chance of world peace, preferring to put everyone in a Lotus-Eater Machine where they can escape all the problems of reality. Instead, many saw him as a whiny Manchild who can't get over Rin's death. Seems valid, though maybe revise the second sentence
- The way Utakata's master Harusame tries to extract the Tailed Beast from his disciple in an anime-only Filler is supposed to be seen as good intentions to the point that upon realizing this, Utakata eventually rebuilt the pedestal with him after accidentally killing him. The problem is, extracting the Bijuu from a Jinchuuriki will also directly kill the host, and with no indication of Utakata having trouble with his Bijuu, nor even knowing why his master does it in the first place against his will, it comes off as Harusame crossing the Moral Event Horizon with Utakata having every right to defy his master and killing him sounds more like a Kick The Son Of A Bitch than what is supposed to be. Maybe?
- Madara Uchiha, the Big Bad of the story. He’s apparently meant to be seen as someone who was forced to grow up in a ninja world full of war, and is just trying to create a utopia so his dreams of peace can become reality. This is all well and good, if you forget that the story shows that he and his former friend, Hashirama, managed to accomplish peace with the creation of the Hidden Leaf Village. Hell, Hashirama even tries to make him leader of that new village, but Madara refuses. It’s even harder for viewers to see him as someone who wants peace at any cost due to his obvious glee before every battle. Add that to fact that a part of his Start of Darkness is caused by him wanting to remake the world in his image, even screwing over his best friend to do so, and this makes him come across not as a Well-Intentioned Extremist, but more of a hypocritical Jerkass. Unsure on this one
- Boruto Uzumaki, Naruto and Hinata's son. It's hard to sympathize with the boy who only wanted his father to come home when he is as bad (if not worse) than Naruto during his childhood. Unlike Naruto, Boruto doesn't have a crappy childhood but takes it all for granted and does the same antics his father used to do, all so his father can pay more attention to him. He keeps calling his father a bad parent, going as far as to wish he was dead and is unable to understand other people's feelings (such as complaining that his father is never around in front of Sarada, whose father was never with her for her whole life). And when Naruto finally spends some time with him, he ignores him and brushes away his affections. Maybe?
openEdit War on VisualNovel.YosugaNoSora Anime
Earlier Dezz Marie 95 added a What An Idiot example to the page. My first instinct was to remove it because What An Idiot is Flame Bait, but I stopped myself because the example seemed VERY familiar. Checking the page history I saw that Dezz Marie 95 had already added the exact same example three weeks ago
(with a small follow-up edit to add extra formatting), but the previous time it was under Too Dumb to Live. I was the one that removed it at the time, with my reason being that Too Dumb to Live is a death trope and so the example did not fit.
Since it is the exact same example, even if the trope name is different, I'd like permission to remove it again, just to be on the safe side and not run afoul of the Edit War rules.
openEvilIsCool.DemonSlayer Anime
I noticed in YMMV.Demon Slayer Kimetsu No Yaiba that the villains Doma and Muzan are listed under the trope Evil Is Cool. While you might be able to argue that Doma falls into this trope (I haven't read the manga), the reasons listed line up better with Love to Hate, which he's already listed as.
Muzan himself is another matter. Not only are his actions gratuitous and very excessive (including the way he acts towards his henchmen), he's also considered to be an Anti-Climax Boss due to the fight against him being thought of as less interesting than his subordinates due to him being Unskilled, but Strong.
Edited by 227someguyopenYMMV page for Yashahime: Princess Half-Demon Anime
May I ask if a mod can look over the YMMV page for this series? For the last several months there has been an editing war going on there that I have participated in. I’m not going to make excuses for myself, but my goal in the edits has been to promote factual information about this series. However I was personally called out by Lancelot 07 in an edit on October 7th, which to me sounded like a threat against me making further edits. At this point I feel a mod needs to step in. I’m not going to make any further edits on this page, and if it’s felt that my conduct has been against website rules I will accept that. But I believe there needs to be intervention at this point.
openKaifuku Jutsushi no Yarinaoshi cleanup required? Anime
I mentioned this in the Winter Anime 2021 thread, I have not read the light novels or manga. So I didn't want to make changes to the page myself.
I got kind of a skeevy/immature vibe from how parts of this page
is written.
Specifically the "Let the party begin." part and basically all of the times Karmic Rape is potholed. For a specific example see the Karmic Rape trope. It just feels like the article is tacitly approving of those actions.
The thing is, I'm not sure if this is against the wiki policy, or if it should be left as is.
openHow do I create an Awesome Music page? Anime
(Apologies for the wall of text, TL;DR will be provided.)
Being a musician and fan of music (particularly OSTs), Awesome Music pages are my favorite thing to view on this site. However, I was disappointed to find that Dr. Stone had no Awesome Music page to speak of. I've been tempted to make it myself, but the reason why I enjoy visiting this site is to hear how other people describe things. If the majority of a page is written by me, it defeats the purpose and ceases being fun. With that aside, I've accepted that there are times when I must be that person for others, as opposed to the inverse.
Anyway, here's what I'm struggling with. Since I'm still relatively new to editing on the site, navigating the rules, forums, and resources is painfully difficult. I've searched numerous times for instructions or guidelines on how to create an Awesome Music page, but have come up empty-handed. When clicking "Create New" on the Main for Dr. Stone, there's no option for Awesome Music.
I can think of a few reasons as to why I haven't figured this out yet. One, I'm stupid and the answer is staring me in the face. Or two, I've been looking in all the wrong places. Knowing me, the former seems to be the most likely scenario.
TL;DR: I'm a newbie idiot, so I need help figuring out how to start an Awesome Music page for Dr. Stone.
Edited by NexyopenDoes this page need a cleanup? (HeartwarmingInHindsight) Anime
The bottom of the page has this note:
IMPORTANT: Do not include examples that are Foreshadowing, nor moments that came just a handful of episodes later. Those are clearly intended heartwarming moments later in the same work.
However, some users have bluntly disregarded this, the vast majority of the anime folder examples consist of stuff that is obviously foreshadowed.
Should it all be removed? I mean, disregarding the entries about voice actors, the blind photographer and the ones relating to Real Life people. I wanted to manually remove it myself but I fear it would start an edit war.
openWhich of the examples are accurate and which of the examples are just character bashing? Anime
- Neon Genesis Evangelion:
- Asuka Langley Soryu often proves herself worthy of this trope:
- She always criticizes Shinji for being useless, even though she constantly screws up missions with her own stubbornness and pride.
- She blames Shinji for their botched first kiss, claiming that he's rejecting her, when it was her own fault for goading him into kissing her with convoluted and mixed signals, as well as holding Shinji's nose to prevent his breathing from tickling her, which suffocates him. All of which are very unromantic.
- She frequently calls out Shinji for being so weak and vulnerable, despite the fact that, as the series progresses, it turns out she is just as weak and vulnerable as he is, albeit trying to hide it with aggression and temper tantrums.
- She treats all the boys she's around with contempt and considers them perverts and/or idiots, yet she herself engages in very inappropriate sexual conduct with her guardian, Kaji, and consistently makes and commits idiotic decisions and actions that not only endanger her but others.
- She constantly attacks Shinji for not being "a man" or not "manning up", yet she herself is hardly what one would call "womanly".
- While it's partially true that Misato shows Parental Favoritism towards Shinji, Asuka is the last person to call her out, especially when all she wants and craves is to be praised, loved, and coddled.
- For all her complaints about no one caring for her, she herself is shown to care very little (if at all) for the well-being of her teammates, even belittling them after enduring serious trauma.
- She also has the nerve to blame others for rejecting her when she frequently and deliberately rejects, rebukes, abuses, and takes advantage of others.
- She calls Shinji selfish for wanting to save the world merely to impress his father, yet Asuka's own motive is at its core just as selfish as she does it out of a need for validation too.
- She feels entitled to and demands unconditional devotion and praise from anyone and everyone she meets. However, Asuka feels no obligation to treat others with even the slightest amount of respect and decency unless doing so will keep them under her thrall or otherwise advance her interests in some way; she treats virtually everyone around her with undisguised contempt.
- Asuka is also in no position to chew Shinji out for being afraid of getting hurt and being rejected by others, considering that she herself is afraid of getting hurt by others, and especially because she is one of the people, aside from Gendo, responsible for hurting and rejecting Shinji.
- Asuka gets angry and disgusted at Shinji for complaining, claiming that he's always blaming others, yet she is the one who whines and complains more than anyone in the entire franchise and consistently blames or shifts the blame to others for her own faults.
- Asuka Langley Soryu often proves herself worthy of this trope:
openPermission to revert entry on Manga/AirGear. Anime
On Nov. 4th, 2018, I corrected
the Official Couple entry for Air Gear due to being inaccurate to the epilogue chapter.
- Original Version:
- Corrected Version:
- Erivale's version:
- Erivale: I just read through the whole series again, and it's pretty clear that Ikki's date with Simca is two riders who respect each other meeting up for a run and the fulfilment of an old promise, as compared to the overt romantic overtones involved in Ikki's resolution with Ringo. Even during the epilogue itself, Ringo is treated as the woman in Ikki's life, not just a prospective for his affections.
With this in mind, I request permission to revert the edit without risk of inciting an Edit War.
openWeblinks to facebook and image hosting websites Anime
Hi everyone,
While reading the Nightmare Fuel page of Kimetsu no Yaiba
, I encountered an entry in the "Red Light District Arc" (third bullet point, second sub-bullet) which contains two weblinks: one to a facebook page, and one to what I guess is an image hosting website (well, your guess is as good as mine regarding a website called "sportshub" being that kind of website). Both links are used to show screens of what the character looks like in the anime.
From Weblinks Are Not Examples, it seems it is frowned upon to use links like that. Moreover, the entry itself is written well enough to not necessitate those images. Thus I'm contacting tropers to ask if I should remove these links or leave them as is. I know there is a tolerance for some weblinks (namely when linking to songs - and even then, broken You Tube links happen quite often), but I'm not quite sure this qualify.
EDIT: There is another instance of this kind of link a little further actually, under the "Chapter 92-94/S 2 E 10:" bullet point of the same folder.
Edited by NonoRobotopenAss Pull on Jojo Part 6 ymmv Anime
There has been one user argumenting the use of this on the ymmv page of JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Stone Ocean, where they provided arguments for how the plot points that were put on asspull made sense, but later reverted them back because of ymmv.
I find myself confused, cause the points that the user rises sound compelling enough to warrant a removal from them, but idk if most users are willing to agree.
openrequesting an addition Anime
I was surprised that Guts from Berserk isn't on the anime and manga section of the Hurting Hero trope examples. This may sound dumb, but I'm kind of nervous that I'll mess up the formatting if I do it myself, so I just thought I'd suggest instead.
openCan I give the BECK manga its own set of pages? Anime
I'm talking about Beck. It's currently sharing sub-pages with the musician Beck, as well as an unrelated movie. Being a diehard fan of this series, I'd like to make the usual suite of pages for the manga/anime (Character page, Funny, Heartwarming, YMMV etc.), to avoid sharing with the musician and movie. The BECK manga has an official alternate title, "BECK - Mongolian Chop Squad" or just "BECK - MCS", and I was thinking if I could just go for it. Would I be allowed to do this myself? Thank you in advance!
Edited by pottskiopen 12-Episode Anime: still tropeworthy? Anime
I’ve been concerned about 12-Episode Anime for a while now. There are two major issues that caught my attention.
First, I’m wondering whether it’s still tropeworthy in the first place. I suspect this is a very old page, especially since the description mentions the Spring and Fall anime seasons being much more important than Summer and Winter, which was once true but hasn’t really been the case for ~15 years now. There was a time when most new TV anime that weren’t open-ended serials had a standard length of 24-26 episodes, and 12 episode anime in that era were something of a novelty. But things have changed especially over the last decade or so, to the point where almost all new TV anime are being made 12 episodes at a time now, even the ones that are renewed for multiple seasons. So a 12-episode anime in the 2020s is effectively PSOC, nothing notable at all because it’s evolved into the industry standard. If anyone cared enough to add every new 12 episode series that premiered every season we’d be adding over 100 new anime to the page every year.
Second, even if everyone decides the concept itself is still a valid trope, the vast majority of the examples on the page are ZCE, and most of the examples that do have a description are in the ”Given More Seasons” and “Unusual Cases” folders, which are essentially the aversions.
openKaguya-sama Love Is War Franchise Original Sin. Just A Question? Anime
I like to know the reason why are the "fans" are so upset about something like this?
Franchise Original Sin: Kaguya and Shirogane having sex, played entirely for laughs was the last straw for many fans who were unhappy with the humor of the series gradually getting lewder, that the author had gone back on his word of the series not needing Fanservice to instead chase the lowest common denominator. Actually, the early series was hardly 100% clean and wholesome—for instance, a fan favorite gag from the first few chapters revolves around Kaguya struggling not to laugh whenever she hears a word she mistakes to mean "penis"—but in those early jokes the sexual content were framing devices for the actual jokes, based more on character personality: in that case, the actual punchline was seeing the normally stoic Kaguya degenerating into giggling fits about something that really shouldn't be so funny to anyone above elementary school-age. Later jokes dismiss with that and just have the sex itself be the joke—an early foreshadowing to the Kaguya/Shirogane joke that pissed the fanbase off can be found in the Running Gag concerning Tsubasa and Nagisa's relationshipnote specifically, that they're always barely able to avoid being caught having sex in public.
If anything, be feeling honest, there's absolutely nothing wrong about them having sex even if its played for humor. Please give me a proper explanation?
Edited by Droid098

I've seen a yuugame2 around recently. There used to be a yuugame account that made the same sorts of edits they do—long-winded manga-based Yu-Gi-Oh entries with occasional downplaying or putting down the anime, IE
"Enemy Mine: In the manga, after his initial Monster World RPG with them, he occasionally and openly helps the main group, particularly during Duelist Kingdom and Dungeon Dice Monsters, and a couple of times he shows up then willingly gives Ryo back control of his body. After the Monster World arc, he decided that keeping Yugi alive until the Shadow RPG is more beneficial to his plans agenda than outright opposing him as he did in the original RPG. The only reason he openly helps the group is because their adversaries are getting in the way of his own plans, such as trying to kill Yugi and take the Millennium puzzle, and it's also a way to gain Yugi's trust and then easily stab him in the back afterward. He rarely has shades of this in the anime, where he's permanently in-control and impersonating Ryo, and the gang have no idea that the spirit of the Millennium Ring is controlling him."
Some of this entry also isn't true, as Ryo was in control of himself at times in the anime, albeit to a lesser extent, and he was being manipulated in the manga often as well. From the '2' in the account name I was wondering if anything had happened to the original yuugame account, too. The first yuugame went up to January 2.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/el.php?findfor=yuugame
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/el.php?findfor=yuugame2
Edited by lalalei2001