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openProblems on Music/FallingInReverse Music
A number of examples on the page appear to be troping the frontman himself rather than either his work or performances or describing the real life history of the band using narrative tropes. Can I just remove them and rewrite the salvageable ones or is this big enough to take to a cleanup thread?
- The Atoner: Ronnie after making up with Craig in 2013 and becoming a father, seems to really want to ditch the past "Radical Ronnie" bravado he put on. He also seems incredibly regretful about the time he cheated on his girlfriend, especially as it caused him to see his daughter less. (this one's also a morality trope)
- Even the Guys Want Him: Ronnie.
(fanservice trope applied to a real person, Weblinks Are Not Examples and it's a matter of opinion)
- Jerkass: Ronnie Radke, if this video
is anything to go by. Several other people, including fans themselves, have even called him out on this. The incident where he threw a mic stand into the crowd at a show at Six Flags Great Adventure and managed to both send several people to the hospital and get heavier acts permanently banned from being booked at the park did not help matters.
- His choice of lyrical content is all you need to know Ronnie is a bit of a jerk, with lines like "They'll call me king of the music scene" (morality trope being applied to a real person and the second is both subjective and possibly complainy)
- Large Ham: Ronnie. (also zero context; could be rewritten to describe actual performances by someone who knows more about such things than I do)
- Long-Haired Pretty Boy: All of them, but especially Ronnie for most fangirls.
- Mr. Fanservice: Especially Ronnie and Jacky. (these two have the same problems as Even the Guys Want Him and are also zero context)
- Parental Abandonment: Ronnie's mom left him and his brother when they were young.
- He finally met her again in November 2013. (this is just straight up real life; it could be rewritten to describe songs that talk about his mother rather than the literal events)
- Sex, Drugs, and Rock & Roll: The focus of many of their songs, since they were apparently written by Ronnie while he was in jail and going through rehab. However, he is currently very much sober, and as much can be assumed for the other band members.
- Actually a requirement on tour. Ronnie is Straight Edge now, and doesn't trust himself around substances to the point of declaring them off limits on the bus. I See Stars were thrown off tour in 2012 when their keyboard player was arrested for weed possession. (everything past it being the subject of songs is real life)
- Start My Own: How the band was formed. Ronnie was mad at his former bandmates and swore to become bigger than they were. (For the record, they're about equal ever since.)
- Also why Max left. He'd been attempting to make a band of his own since being thrown out of ETF, and finally they debuted in 2016 as Violent New Breed.
- Jacky started a solo shred/instrumental rock project and eventually left to focus on it.
openOverhauling or deleting the Prince's Associates page Music
I noticed that Prince's Associates is in the complaining cleanup sandbox, and for good reason. However, looking it over got me thinking about how weird the whole concept of the page is. I don't know of another page with that many different creators listed on it that isn't an index, their only commonality being their collaboration with one artist. It was written a long time ago so I don't know the thought process behind its creation, but it appears the original writer wanted simply to tell a story about Prince (hence the entries being in chronological rather than alphabetical order) and didn't think the artists were interesting enough to warrant their own pages. But since There Is No Such Thing as Notability some of them have gotten their own pages anyway, which makes me wonder if we're better off breaking up the whole page and perhaps leaving it as an actual index or a redirect to Prince himself.
I'm not sure of the proper way to go about this, though. Making major changes to work and creator pages doesn't seem to require the same rigamarole as changing tropes, but I'm thinking that this is too drastic a change to just undertake myself. What do you suggest?
Edited by CamassiaopenA little too much real-life troping on Michael Jackson Music
chizo made some absolutely massive
edits to Michael Jackson's main page, and probably edited some of the subpages as well. Most of these are troping the man himself, and also bloated his page description by a crazy amount. Much of the page description can honestly go with the RL tropes, but I wanted to get consensus before firing up the chainsaw.
open Self Report Music
It appears I have let my hatred for sexual predators seep into my edit reasons
beyond a point that is considered socially acceptable. Admittedly, I am not handling the notion of a prolific nonce being allowed any freedom whatsoever very well at all.
I just want to explain that I acted rashly due to my anti-predator bias, compounded by the fact that Ian Watkins—a man who considers molesting children "mega lolz"—could go free in seven years.
I am considering going on hiatus so that I can clear my head.
I understand if the mods feel a suspension is necessary. Hopefully, if such is the case, I can appeal a while after the suspension, when I have a clear head.
Edited by SkyCat32openOne Hit Wonder - for albums as well as songs? Music
supernintendo128 added an example to One Hit Wonder.Rock Music about an artist only known for one album. That term, and the page itself, traditionally refers to artists known for one song, not an album. The article itself describes songs not albums, most references I can find about the term describe songs not albums too. The term for an artist known for only one album seems to be "One Album Wonder". A One Album Wonder is a very different thing from a One Hit Wonder for songs: A "one album wonder" might have multiple hit songs from one album but then never have any others (Hootie & the Blowfish or Lauryn Hill, for instance) and none of those artists are listed on the One Hit Wonder pages.
I removed the example because it seemed to me to be a misuse of the trope and its long-held definition, but now I'm wondering if "One Album Wonder" or something to that effect could be its own trope or own subsection.
What do you all think should be done? Was this Remo Drive example about an album a misuse of the trope, or should One Album Wonder acts be listed in a new subpage? At the very least, I think listing album examples alongside the song examples could become very confusing very fast.
Edited by thelivingtoadopenSelf titled EP Music
I've been thinking of creating a page for a self titled EP by 100 gecs, but the issue is I'm not really sure where that should go since 100 gecs would already be taken by the duo. Would it be a good idea to name it 100 gecs (EP) and then use Wiki Word to turn it into "100 gecs (EP)" or is there a better solution for this?
Edited by GhilshopenMudvayne and Numetal Music
For the last five years or so, on and off there has been an ongoing issue with NuMetal being part of the Mudvayne page. It has been removed a couple of times usually by the same troper BornnofSelf ban evading. They have used various handles to do this, and when they have been found out usually tropers simply revert the changes, generally it has been accepted that Mudvayne are Numetal. Established via various sources including
https://www.revolvermag.com/music/11-most-iconic-looks-nu-metal-stars
The general consensus has been that the band is Numetal.
'
Once again Numetal has been removed from the band page this time by relatively new troper https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Tropers/dognation83
. On both the Mudvayne page and the Numetal page with the reasoning Mudvayne is clearly prog-metal with no links to estabilsh this. I am seeking consensus to revert as this has been an ongoing argument I thought resolved with them being established as Numetal.
openBetter Description Music
I recently thought of improving upon the (rather sparse) page for Ken Ashcorp, and even included him in the namespace for pages needing work. However, seeing no activity for several months, I decided to start working on it myself. The biggest problem I saw with the page was the description - it was in a serious need of updating. I finished my version of the new description, but I think I'm gonna need it peer-reviewed. Is this thread a good place for peer reviews? If so, here are the two versions of the description for comparison.
Edited by AoeAbilityopen Music-Inspired narratives? Music
Honestly, this could be a trope itself. I’m thinking of music-inspired narratives like Cowboy Bebop, Samurai Champloo, Space Dandy, Afro Samurai, Baby Driver, ETC.
Name more music-inspired narratives. Maybe this could be its own article or something.
Edited by TheBryceKrispyopenImage for Music/MeganTheeStallion Music
Andiman keeps changing the Image for the page without a given reason. Said image he changes it to is too big for the page and it’s a selfie. I tried making a thread but nothing has been done about it.
openAdditions to a Music Trope Category - Heavy Mithril & Filk Music
Hello! I'm wondering what the rules are about adding examples to a trope? I know of a few bands/recordings that might be suited to be added to the Heavy Mithril category (ie. Heather Alexander's folk rock band Phoenyx,) and a few that are suited to the Filk category, which are not listed; and I also can add some information to some of the existing listings (ie. the song Julia Ecklar is best known for.) What are the criteria to determine if something is worthy of adding?
Also, I dabble in both genres myself; would it be rude to add my own stuff if I'm realistic about it? It's not very well known, but it does exist.
Thanks in advance!
open Can someone fix the Tofie page? Music
The page for electronic musician Tofie is a complete mess. Half the tropes are misused and are seemingly only there for the creator to gush over how attractive they think the artist is, one of them is a ZCE, and the page isn't even indexed. I'd do it myself, but I have no idea where to start.
Edited by PhysicalStaminaopenChaotic evil automatically a YMMV trope? Music
Was editing the page for Razia's Shadow and tried adding the Chaotic Evil trope to the list of examples, but it automatically turned into a YMMV trope instead of a normal bullet point trope. Is Chaotic Evil automatically a YMMV / subjective interpretation trope? I would have thought if the character being described never has his motivations for an evil deed explained in canon apart from "because he wants to", that would count as Chaotic Evil, no YMMV about it. (For context: the character in question is Barayas the spider, who in the song "The Spider and the Lamps" from the musical Razia's Shadow encourages another character to literally Set the World on Fire without apparently gaining anything from it himself. Lyrics of the song here: https://genius.com/Forgive-durden-the-spider-and-the-lamps-lyrics)
Is there any way to sumbit the Chaotic Evil trope to the examples list without turning into a YMMV trope? Or should I just submit it to the YMMV page?
openBanned user bornofself is back. Again. Music
Oriental 1 is, judging by their edit history, bornofself's latest mantle. Didn't bother sending a message, but it doesn't matter because they're not supposed to be here but still somehow don't know when to quit.
openAwesome/KanyeWest Music
I had to clean up the examples involving Kanye’s political views, but other tropers keep adding it back. I’ll admit I added some myself, but since it’s causing edit warring, I deleted the examples altogether. Should there be a mod warning to prevent any more politics-related examples from betting added back.
Edited by MsCC93openTroping Music Videos Music
Should tropes that occur in music videos (but not the song itself) still be listed in the Music section of a trope page?
openCan my page be moved to the "Creators" namespace...? Music
Um okay, so a while ago somebody made a page on me: TurretBot
Which is fine, keep the page, I don't care. I don't want to disrespect The Fic May Be Yours, but the Trope Page Is Ours, I only did one edit to correct a few factual errors, that's it, and I don't plan to edit the page for any more than that... But I want the namespace changed. The page is currently under "Music", and it should be under "Creators".
"Turret Bot" is NOT a work. That's just my username. And, I do things other than music (the page conveniently leaves out my non-music stuff, but I can post links if you want proof). For all that, I believe the page should really be moved to "Creators"...
So can someone please move the page to Turret Bot for me? Since the page is about me, I feel like moving it myself would be crossing the line, I don't want to get in trouble or anything. Ok that's all. Thanks in advance...
openSome...interesting formatting on Music/TheAgonist Music
Music.TheAgonist consists entirely of zero-context examples grouped by song. Even if the examples had context (which they don't) and were indented correctly (which they aren't), would this method of organizing even be kosher? It just seems to be more unwieldy than just arranging the tropes in the normal way.
I'm not familiar enough with the band to add context to any of the examples, and the few examples with context seem to be misuse, so...uh...what should be done here? I could try to overhaul it myself (the reason I ended up on the page in the first place was because I started listening to one of their albums and liked it), but it would take a while.
openNo Title Music
DJ Jazzy Jeff and The Fresh Prince
I'm fully aware there's a page for Will Smith, and it does mention his his 1987-93 musical discography with Jazzy Jeff, which is partially the reason I'm here. Where would the tropes for the Jazzy Jeff and Fresh Prince era go? Will Smith's main page page is largely centered around his films and his post-1993 music career.
I was thinking about making a standalone DJ Jazzy Jeff & Fresh Prince page for a few reasons:
A) The songs are Troperrific enough to warrant their own page. B) It would save the main Will Smith page from being cluttered with JJ/FP tropes, and C) Allows us to dig into the history of the group itself (Ready Rock C's involvement, New Line Cinema lawsuit, ect.)
But I have a feeling there would be a few here who would find it redundant to have a "second" Will Smith page just for those works with Jazzy Jeff. So I ask: Should I go ahead with making the page, or just leave it be?

I've picked up an interesting project to do here involving filling in the gaps on a band's discography, (Blue Öyster Cult) writing Works pages for LP's which are at present redlinks or not there at all. Happy to do this.
But two questions for the tropers:
i) An LP title is properly spelt The Revölution By Night. I've set the works page up - but it's only in the form Revolution By Night, so it really needs the page name to be edited on both counts. I'm not sure how to do this - inserting an umlaut into a work page title is something that needs to be specifically requested? .
ii) Also, the band's first LP, which needs a works page, is self-titled. But this namespace is being used for all tropes to do with the band in general, as Blue Öyster Cult. Is there a workround in situations like this?
Thanks for help!