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Ask the Tropers:
openNo Title Music
Burzum has a Crowning Moment Of Awesome page. I know that musicians are allowed to have YMMV/crowning/etc. pages, but this is the full content of the page:
- If half the stuff people said about Euronymous was true (Threatening rivals, stealing ideas, pushing Dead to even further self-harm and eventually suicide) then Varg finally standing up and giving the bastard what he deserves certainly counts.
- Then again, Varg is an absolute bastard who would naturally try to make himself look better in the situation.
Even ignoring my own personal thoughts on everyone involved, it seems to me like putting a Real Life murder on a CMOA page is rather inappropriate and a pretty blatant violation of the Rule Of Cautious Editing Judgement (and the second part is just plain natter). Permission to blank the page?
openNo Title Music
Need to unlock a page. https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Tearjerker/XJapan
seems to be locked, and I'm guessing it was so for being rumors about the band itself or something (because I don't even see why it would be locked otherwise).
Petitioning for permission to recreate as being about the band's songs and lives since even Gackt has his own dedicated page on Tear Jerker/Music and, with songs such as Art of Life and Tears and Without You and Jade (and shows like the 1992 On The Verge Of Destruction shows - the last their original bassist played as a member - the 1997 Last Live - the last show before a breakup that lasted for 10 years - and the 2010 Yokohama show - the original bassist came back for what would be one of the last shows of his life) they do deserve a subpage.
openNo Title Music
How do I redirect to the music namespace without doing full page name?
I'm trying to clean up the redirects on X Japan and its members' pages, but there are two problems here.
First is a basic potholing issue - let's say, I want to put X Japan and have it as a pothole from "one of the first Visual Kei bands" with the text showing as "one of the first Visual Kei bands" with the pothole.
The second issue is related: I want Hideto Matsumoto to show up as "hide" in most articles. How do I do that without creating a redirect on the article itself (I can only imagine what a problem for the wiki having that redirect might be... since obviously everything that uses the word "hide" is NOT going to be referring to the late X guitarist) and without doing hide which directs to the old "main" article before it was moved to the music namespace. Similarly I want to have Tomoaki Ishizuka as "Pata" in most pages per stage name as standard.
Hopefully someone can help with this and I wasn't too confusing about the issue.
Edited by RevolutionStoneopenNo Title Music
Is it OK to do a Self-Demonstrating Article when it would fit the topic very well?
The reason I'm asking is that I want to make SEIKIMA-II not a redlink but a valid article about the band and tropes relating to it. I think self-demonstrating would work INCREDIBLY well here, since a huge part of SEIKIMA-II and its fandom was/is their "legend" and "mythos" about being demons from the moon who landed upon the earth.
Point being, would it be too Fan Myopia to write the article as self-demonstrating *if* as well as self-demonstrating it was accessible? I think that some hybrid of self-demonstrating + accessible is actually the only way a workable article could be made about them because they were one of the few Visual bands *never* to break character until their disbandment. (In fact, to this day, no one knows the lead singer's birth name at all - just his stage names of "His Excellency Demon Kogure" / "Demon Kakka.")
Also, the case of the page needs to be fixed for SEIKIMA-II to read Music/SEIKIMA-II.
openNo Title Music
So I'm curious about something.
If someone real claims he was involved in a Scam Religion, is that "in universe" enough to mention on the person's page as a trope? As in, the person involved in it, himself, denounced it as a scam to the point of having an outright press conference to beg people not to join it and announce his lawsuit against it? Of course, I'm not saying listed as an objective trope at all, but just to list the trope, with the trope description being something like "Scam Religion: Invoked Trope: Person left religion claiming that it was a scam, sued it for fraud, and requested no one buy or pay attention to his works created for it. (Citation here)"
The reason I'm asking is because it's a limited circumstance, and it's not saying objectively that the religion involved (no, it's not Happyology, or a mainstream religion btw) is a scam, it's saying that to the person involved, he felt that it changed his life much for the worse and he felt that it was a scam that took his money and labor and time, to the point that he felt compelled to write at least one song about his experience leaving, file suit, etc. Nor am I seeking to list it as an example on the Scam Religion page itself.
(ninja'd)
Edited by RevolutionStoneopenNo Title Music
DJ Jazzy Jeff and The Fresh Prince
I'm fully aware there's a page for Will Smith, and it does mention his his 1987-93 musical discography with Jazzy Jeff, which is partially the reason I'm here. Where would the tropes for the Jazzy Jeff and Fresh Prince era go? Will Smith's main page page is largely centered around his films and his post-1993 music career.
I was thinking about making a standalone DJ Jazzy Jeff & Fresh Prince page for a few reasons:
A) The songs are Troperrific enough to warrant their own page. B) It would save the main Will Smith page from being cluttered with JJ/FP tropes, and C) Allows us to dig into the history of the group itself (Ready Rock C's involvement, New Line Cinema lawsuit, ect.)
But I have a feeling there would be a few here who would find it redundant to have a "second" Will Smith page just for those works with Jazzy Jeff. So I ask: Should I go ahead with making the page, or just leave it be?
openSome...interesting formatting on Music/TheAgonist Music
Music.TheAgonist consists entirely of zero-context examples grouped by song. Even if the examples had context (which they don't) and were indented correctly (which they aren't), would this method of organizing even be kosher? It just seems to be more unwieldy than just arranging the tropes in the normal way.
I'm not familiar enough with the band to add context to any of the examples, and the few examples with context seem to be misuse, so...uh...what should be done here? I could try to overhaul it myself (the reason I ended up on the page in the first place was because I started listening to one of their albums and liked it), but it would take a while.
openCan my page be moved to the "Creators" namespace...? Music
Um okay, so a while ago somebody made a page on me: TurretBot
Which is fine, keep the page, I don't care. I don't want to disrespect The Fic May Be Yours, but the Trope Page Is Ours, I only did one edit to correct a few factual errors, that's it, and I don't plan to edit the page for any more than that... But I want the namespace changed. The page is currently under "Music", and it should be under "Creators".
"Turret Bot" is NOT a work. That's just my username. And, I do things other than music (the page conveniently leaves out my non-music stuff, but I can post links if you want proof). For all that, I believe the page should really be moved to "Creators"...
So can someone please move the page to Turret Bot for me? Since the page is about me, I feel like moving it myself would be crossing the line, I don't want to get in trouble or anything. Ok that's all. Thanks in advance...
openTroping Music Videos Music
Should tropes that occur in music videos (but not the song itself) still be listed in the Music section of a trope page?
openAwesome/KanyeWest Music
I had to clean up the examples involving Kanye’s political views, but other tropers keep adding it back. I’ll admit I added some myself, but since it’s causing edit warring, I deleted the examples altogether. Should there be a mod warning to prevent any more politics-related examples from betting added back.
Edited by MsCC93openBanned user bornofself is back. Again. Music
Oriental 1 is, judging by their edit history, bornofself's latest mantle. Didn't bother sending a message, but it doesn't matter because they're not supposed to be here but still somehow don't know when to quit.
openChaotic evil automatically a YMMV trope? Music
Was editing the page for Razia's Shadow and tried adding the Chaotic Evil trope to the list of examples, but it automatically turned into a YMMV trope instead of a normal bullet point trope. Is Chaotic Evil automatically a YMMV / subjective interpretation trope? I would have thought if the character being described never has his motivations for an evil deed explained in canon apart from "because he wants to", that would count as Chaotic Evil, no YMMV about it. (For context: the character in question is Barayas the spider, who in the song "The Spider and the Lamps" from the musical Razia's Shadow encourages another character to literally Set the World on Fire without apparently gaining anything from it himself. Lyrics of the song here: https://genius.com/Forgive-durden-the-spider-and-the-lamps-lyrics)
Is there any way to sumbit the Chaotic Evil trope to the examples list without turning into a YMMV trope? Or should I just submit it to the YMMV page?
open Can someone fix the Tofie page? Music
The page for electronic musician Tofie is a complete mess. Half the tropes are misused and are seemingly only there for the creator to gush over how attractive they think the artist is, one of them is a ZCE, and the page isn't even indexed. I'd do it myself, but I have no idea where to start.
Edited by PhysicalStaminaopenAdditions to a Music Trope Category - Heavy Mithril & Filk Music
Hello! I'm wondering what the rules are about adding examples to a trope? I know of a few bands/recordings that might be suited to be added to the Heavy Mithril category (ie. Heather Alexander's folk rock band Phoenyx,) and a few that are suited to the Filk category, which are not listed; and I also can add some information to some of the existing listings (ie. the song Julia Ecklar is best known for.) What are the criteria to determine if something is worthy of adding?
Also, I dabble in both genres myself; would it be rude to add my own stuff if I'm realistic about it? It's not very well known, but it does exist.
Thanks in advance!
openImage for Music/MeganTheeStallion Music
Andiman keeps changing the Image for the page without a given reason. Said image he changes it to is too big for the page and it’s a selfie. I tried making a thread but nothing has been done about it.
open Music-Inspired narratives? Music
Honestly, this could be a trope itself. I’m thinking of music-inspired narratives like Cowboy Bebop, Samurai Champloo, Space Dandy, Afro Samurai, Baby Driver, ETC.
Name more music-inspired narratives. Maybe this could be its own article or something.
Edited by TheBryceKrispyopenBetter Description Music
I recently thought of improving upon the (rather sparse) page for Ken Ashcorp, and even included him in the namespace for pages needing work. However, seeing no activity for several months, I decided to start working on it myself. The biggest problem I saw with the page was the description - it was in a serious need of updating. I finished my version of the new description, but I think I'm gonna need it peer-reviewed. Is this thread a good place for peer reviews? If so, here are the two versions of the description for comparison.
Edited by AoeAbilityopenMudvayne and Numetal Music
For the last five years or so, on and off there has been an ongoing issue with NuMetal being part of the Mudvayne page. It has been removed a couple of times usually by the same troper BornnofSelf ban evading. They have used various handles to do this, and when they have been found out usually tropers simply revert the changes, generally it has been accepted that Mudvayne are Numetal. Established via various sources including
https://www.revolvermag.com/music/11-most-iconic-looks-nu-metal-stars
The general consensus has been that the band is Numetal.
'
Once again Numetal has been removed from the band page this time by relatively new troper https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Tropers/dognation83
. On both the Mudvayne page and the Numetal page with the reasoning Mudvayne is clearly prog-metal with no links to estabilsh this. I am seeking consensus to revert as this has been an ongoing argument I thought resolved with them being established as Numetal.

A couple of questions about musician pages.
I know that the policy has been changed that things that happen offstage or that aren't a part of lyrics or promotional videos are no longer allowed on band or musician pages. I'm not trying to challenge that policy, so please don't take this as trying to start a fight over it or chip away at it., but I do have a couple of questions...
1) If something happens offstage has a direct impact on performing, is it allowable to mention? I'll list one clear-cut example and two more gray ones for this.
The first actual example: one of the two primary creative members of a band dies (Munetaka Higuchi of Loudness, for this example). Is it OK to list Author Existence Failure as a trope applying to the band in a case where the dead member was a founding member, lyricist, and played a vital role? Obviously he didn't die onstage or in a performance, but it happened, and made some major changes to performances and more.
As another actual example, at least two bands I can think of have been subject to a Frivolous Lawsuit over their name, and therefore had to change their names slightly (X to X Japan and Versailles to Versailles Philharmonic Quartet. Both suits were definitely that trope. Is it okay, in that case, to list Frivolous Lawsuit as a trope applying to the musicians?
As a hypothetical (and far more gray since it could be seen as libelous) example: a member leaves a band mid-tour due to an arrest or to go to rehab. The tour gets canceled (which is definitely an impact on performance if there ever was one). Would Off the Wagon be all right to include in the page?
2) Are interviews and documented statements allowed? As in, for example, I know that we don't want people calling, say, Justin Bieber a Jerkass, but let's say there's someone who did a published interview and was like "Man, I was really an asshole." Is it allowable in *that* instance to list Jerkass with a link to the person himself saying he was one?
This question's wondering if there's an "In-Universe" equivalent on musicians that would allow for some things about them as people IF they are invoked by the musician himself or herself (and could therefore arguably be seen as part of performance, because in Visual Kei, for example, interviews ARE part of performing)