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openPlatonic Life Partners added back in, violates guidelines
I noticed that Platonic Life-Partners was added back in, by Troper jonty1
, to both Leonardo DiCaprio and Kate Winslet's Creator pages very recently (see here
and here
). This is despite the fact that the trope was deleted from both pages circa 2016 and 2019 due to Creator Page Guidelines, most likely due to "Drooling/Gushing" and the trope itself is not associated within the two films they starred in together; see here
and here
.
Since this was added back in, 1) wouldn't this count as an Edit War? 2) Because this violates Creator Page Guidelines, may I have permission to remove the trope from both pages? If so, I'll cite this ATT post as part of my Edit Reason.
Edited by mouschilightopenSeemingly Excessive SelfDemonstratingCharacter pages
Mentioned this in the fairlydead SD Character cleanup thread
and the TLP thread
, where someone suggested I bring it up here.
Basically, Roku Alhazared more or less makes a new SD page a day
, almost none of which really seem to have anything resembling a unique voice and while he clearly puts in a lot of work to them, they're little more than a first-person recap of a character. This seems excessive to me.
I haven't messaged him short of trying to ping him to the SD cleanup thread, but that might not have worked.
Edited by LarkmarnopenProblem Troper
Rtkh 68 has made some very complain-y and shoehorned edits in regards to The Last of Us Part II, and have edit warred.
This entry on this
page, which I've deleted:
"Without the pesky necessity of asking the animators what they thought in the process. Leaks already hint that a lot of people were pointlessly and needlessly made very uncomfortable during a time where a game this nihilistic and depressing REALLY doesn't help with the current climate."
They called the whole game a Self-Insert Fic on the YMMV
page, and added "meanwhile the lead writer turns a scene into a Self-Insert Fic that makes us all cringe until our faces hurt" to the Laconic page.
The Tear Jerker
page has several problematic edits, including edit warring. First all they added was "RIP Ellie and Joel" which is a ZCE and incorrect regardless. It was deleted and they re-added it with "RIP Ellie and Joel, died to a golf club." This was also deleted and they re-added it again with "Rest in Peace Joel, Murdered with a golf-club for wokepoints." This was deleted, and their final re-addition was "Rest in Peace Joel, Murdered with a golf-club for wokepoints." Note these edits were made prior to the game's official release.
The Tear Jerker page also has this entry: "the fact this absolute joke of a game was hailed as a 10/10 GOTY masterpiece by all the official review sources. Metacritic tells the real story."
openNot an example of Idiot Plot? Western Animation
From Idiot Plot - Animated Films:
- The entire Final Battle of Incredibles 2 could have been shortened considerably if not outright avoided, allowing the capture the Big Bad before they fled the ship and preventing the entire crash, had anyone actually targeted the mind-controlling goggles during the fights. It's at least a bit understandable with the kids given their age and lack of experience, but the adults really should have tried just plucking them off instead of running or fighting until the goggles happened to fall off. Ironically the only character who does do this is Jack-Jack, entirely by accident, when reaching for his mom, showing how swift and effortless it really would have been.
In reality, adults did try to remove mind-controlling goggles from other supers as soon as they're freed (of course, with the difficulty of taking away a mind-controlling device from an enhanced human who fights back), and they manage to remove them, they don't just "happen to fall off". It's true that in the previous scenes kids didn't try to remove the goggles, but the entry itself suggests that their age and lack of experience can be a forgiving factor.
Since it's not A story driven entirely by all the characters being idiots that would otherwise take less than five minutes to resolve, but a specific scene, wouldn't that count at best as a Downplayed Idiot Ball, and perhaps not even that?
Bumping because the entry was readded. Edited by gc10
openMemetic Mutation vs. "just memes"
if anyone can help, i'd like some clarification on what should/shouldn't be on a Memetic Mutation entry or subpage.
a few months ago a mod replied as such on the forums
, which suggests to me we shouldn't be cataloging every meme under the sun for a given work (and i believe the actual page mentions something like that). seems fair enough.
fast forward to now, and it seems like i've gotten myself into an edit war with a few other editors on hololive in an effort to follow this. now i'm wondering if they're actually strict guidelines for Memetic Mutation or not.
openAgenda edit?
On In Touch with His Feminine Side, Bulsara 413 has just changed instances of "tomgirl" to "janegirl", though page history shows this is something several users disagree on. Is this agenda-based editing? I thought that the term was considered acceptable, since Christine Chandler, a transwoman, used it to describe herself at one point. Thank you.
Edited by PiterpicheropenDispute on YMMV.Mulan
There is a dispute between myself and Catcher In The Wry on YMMV.Mulan. In short, I removed an entry he wrote, and he took offense to it, PMing me to say he was "annoyed" and that he would take it to a mod. He has not restored the entry, so it's not an Edit War yet, but from the tone of his PM, and of the entry I deleted, I figure it's better to get here first.
The entry was for Unintentionally Unsympathetic and Unintentionally Sympathetic; the first I deleted because it was, to my judgment, factually inaccurate — it stated that Shang gave no instruction (despite the Make A Man Out Of You montage showing him leading the group in exercises, as well as the group improving, clearly implying that his teaching is effective), and that all he did was demand the recruits like Mulan perform expert level feats and scowl when they failed. Basically, the entry seems to assume that the actions shown in the aforementioned montage are literally the only things Shang did with the group, and therefore Shang is an unreasonable bully for not teaching Mulan anything and then being annoyed that she isn't an Instant Expert.
It also had indentation issues, with a second level bulletpoint that just further expounds on Shang's supposed failures.
The second I deleted because it's based entirely on the first — saying Obstructive Bureaucrat Chi Fu is sympathetic because he's right to be critical of Shang's alleged incompetence. As the first entry is factually inaccurate, the second one based entirely on that should also go.
So far he has not yet PMed me over removing his Alternative Character Interpretation (which I deleted because it doesn't actually explain the alternate interpretation, it just sort of trails off with a parenthetical about how what Chi Fu did was justified), but given his reaction to my removal of his other entry, I expect it's forthcoming.
In all, the entries appear to be based less on the content of the work, and more on this troper's personal dislike for the character Shang, which is in turn based on a factually inaccurate understanding of the movie.
open Tropineasily back again
tropineasily recently added both natter and bad indentation in the same edit. Usually I'd just send a notifier and move on, but in this case
I figured it was worth posting here.
EDIT: Also, they're having problems with English again. In this edit
they write "Riju, while the leader of the Gerudo, she's still a young girl, sometimes giggles to herself and plays with her plushies before going to sleep."
openLordGro in TLP
Lord Gro is being incredibly rude and kind of irrational. They're insisting that this
needs a better name, but then he doesn't suggest any new name. He also said "It's not an extravagant demand to use the right terms with the right definitions," except the name does use the correct definition. He also seems to be contradicting himself, changing his argument as the conversation goes on.
It's one of those "I just want us to be correct" sort of back-and-forth nonsensical gibberish. Then he bombed the draft "for irrelevance and garbled definition."
Except the proposal is relevant and the definition is not "garbled."
openConflicting entries on YMMV.MyHeroAcademia Anime
- Americans Hate Tingle:
- Mineta is reasonably popular in Japan, reaching 17th place on the first popularity poll, but many Western fans loathe him with a passion thanks to him being an obnoxious, cowardly, and tasteless idiot whose Dirty Kid antics are a walking sexual harassment suit waiting to happen, and are wondering why the hell it hasn't gotten him expelled, because creeping on women the way he does is taken extremely seriously in American high schools. Most of them are praying for the day where he either 1) turns evil, 2) dies, or 3) turns evil and then dies so he could be replaced in Class 1-A by Shinso. The fact that Horikoshi has openly admitted Mineta is one of his favorite characters doesn't help matters either. Although even he's losing fans in Japan after his extremely inappropriate comment to Eri.
- The Scrappy: Mineta has a sizable hatedom and tends to rank low on popularity polls. This seems to be attributed to his perverted antics, which to a lot of fans comes across as annoying and/or gross rather than funny, and his arrogant attitude and looking down on others (like Todoroki or Bakugo) despite bringing nothing substantial to anything himself. There's also the fact that his character is painfully underdeveloped compared to others, yet, Horikoshi confessed that he is one of his favorite characters, due to being easy and fun to draw, so he tends to get a lot of screentime and page-time compared to other "side characters" in the class. It doesn't help that he's had virtually zero plot relevance at all since his introduction and has very little character development or exploration in the class. Many fans desperately wish (and write Fix Fic where) he leaves Class 1-A and is replaced by Shinso.
The Scrappy and Americans Hate Tingle are mutally exclusive, so one of these entries have to go. The last paragraph in Americans Hate Tingle implies that he's gotten hate in Japan after the Eri incident, but dosen't say anything if he has recovered from that since then, or if it was a temporary thing.
I'm asking here to get a consensus on what to do, I also asked here
.
openSuspicious troper
Throwaway 219 seems to have spent all of their edits removing "negative" tropes from The Last of Us Part II. Normally, that wouldn't be a huge deal, but the account was first active only 4 days ago, and the name itself sounds suspicious. I think he might be a ban evader.
open Unfortunate Unfortunate Implications in YMMV/StevenUniverse Western Animation
Yesterday, Keshali added this to the Unfortunate Implications section of YMMV.Steven Universe:
- While Steven Universe is typically considered a trailblazer for LGBT representation, a lot of LGBT viewers and critics have pointed out its representation is actually pretty horrible
, from its relentless apologism of characters allegorical of homophobes (Homeworld, Uncle Andy) to the only actual LGBT characters being Discount Lesbians. To say nothing on the ambiguity of Bismuth’s racial coding.
- While Steven Universe is typically considered a trailblazer for LGBT representation, a lot of LGBT viewers and critics have pointed out its representation is actually pretty horrible
I have several problems with it. My write-up ended up being longer than intended, so TL;DR, the entry is built on blatantly false information from a website I'm not even sure counts as reputable, and I would like permission to remove it.
- This one's more of a general question, but does PopMatters even count as a good source? A quick look at the site shows it to be a generic news and music review site.
- Saying the Diamonds and Andy are given "relentless apologism" is blatantly untrue for the former and downright nonsensical for the latter. Whenever the Diamonds’ bigotry for Fusion (in this case used as an allegory for same-sex relationships) is brought up, the narrative and characters always treat it as a horrendous way of thinking, to the point that the climax for one of the penultimate episodes has the Crystal Gems fuse with each other in defiance of them and basically say "this is how we live our lives and we're not going to change that, so you can take your hate and shove it". And Andy... is never once portrayed as a homophobe. Old fashioned with a bit of Fantastic Racism, yeah, but he never once makes any comments that imply he's homophobic - in fact, when talking about how his family drifted apart after Greg left, he positively talks about his aunt and her partner (implied to be another woman), and later willingly attends a same-sex wedding with no fuss and has a good time at the reception.
- Regarding the Gems (or at least Ruby, Sapphire, and Pearl) being Discount Lesbians, Word of God - but not the show itself - confirmed that Gems are a sexless, genderless species that appear feminine and use she/her pronouns. Being genderless doesn't mean they can't be lesbians if they want to be, but I digress.
- As for Ruby and Sapphire's love for each other and Pearl's love for Rose being the only LGBT+ representation, this is also false. A lesbian couple and their son frequently appear in the background during the show, one episode has Pearl getting a crush on a human woman who reciprocates her advances, there are various moments where human characters blush or show attraction towards characters of the same gender (or characters they believe to be the same gender in Stevonnie's case) and all of Steven’s Fusions (in this context being an allegory for platonic and familial relationships) barring one use they/them pronouns, and Stevonnie is outright confirmed to be intersex and non-binary.
- Also, the bit about Bismuth and her possible racial coding feels really tacked on. Like, the entire entry talks about LGBT representation, and then randomly drops that sentence at the end without going into it more.
openCurb-Stomp Battles of Death Battle Web Original
It's come to recent attention that the Curb-Stomp Battle page for DEATH BATTLE! has a lot of issues. The page lists a lot of fights as examples, to the point that literally every episode from season six is listed. However, the entries seem to only focus on the post-fight analysis that determined the winner and not how the actual fight played out. The fight itself could be portrayed as pretty even, only for the analysis to point out the discrepancy between the two fighters.
Even if the hosts explain the fight was actually pretty close, those matches will still be listed because the victor had the advantage, which seems like misuse. I tried to clean up entries
that were listed as "downplayed", but they were simply added back
with slight alterations that the hosts were just explaining the loser's strengths. I think the page should focus on the fights themselves, and not rely solely on the post-fight wrap-up. At the very least, the page needs a clean-up.
open Bloody excessive adverts on tvt Web Original
As of today, there's a banner advert popping up at the bottom of the page that wasn't there yesterday - this is new. Seems to be organised by something called "PROPER<>" and however often you hit the X to whack it down and get rid, it keeps coming back and appears every time you switch to a new page. Click on whatever's being advertised, you get "ad closed by Google". Is this new to tvtropes, and how do you get rid of it completely, as it's annoying and intrusive? I mean - ad at the top of the page, ad on the right hand side, no problem, tvt has to get revenue - but ads spilling over into the actual content of the page itself - not acceptible.
openDarkest Hour - too soon?
- The 2020 pandemic of COVID-19, also known as novel coronavirus or simply coronavirus. While the Earth is no stranger to pandemics (with ebola virus, SARS, and swine flu all having taken place within a quarter of a century prior to coronavirus), this particular outbreak led to some of the most draconian anti-spread policies and measures ever, with many countries closing their borders, hospitals scrambling desperately to treat those who have been infected, many jurisdictions enacting self-quarantine/shelter-at-home orders (wherein people are not allowed to leave home unless it is for essential reasons such as work or shopping for supplies), people cleaning out store shelves to stock up on supplies (including toilet paper of all things), many mass-gathering events like Fan Conventions being either postponed or cancelled, schools and colleges closing, and hundreds of thousands of businesses either enacting work-from-home policies, limiting their services (restaurants, for example, barring customers from dining in) or closing up entirely (with all the layoffs that follow), all while the count of those afflicted and those dead from the virus continue to pile up. It may not be the deadliest pandemic yet, but it doesn't discount the massive changes in lifestyle as well as the severe economic damage that will inevitably follow; to put it this way, roadways that are infamous for traffic congestion (such as I-405 in Los Angeles) have become scarily empty (or paradise, for those who hate being stuck in an impromptu parking lot) even during what would otherwise be peak hours.
The "will inevitably follow" means it's speculative as opposed to have happened. We cut some other COVID-19 related stuff here
so there is precedent of it being used knee-jerk. Cut?
DarkestHour.Real Life is the sort of thing that's had a lot of overly reactionary, ROCEJ, and too soon to call examples. Thoughts on a 5 to 25 year waiting period? (I'd go with 25 as we need a lot of context to say if it really was darkest in retrospect.)
openA troper with trouble
There's this newbie who's making pages for their fanfics, which so far is fine, since they follow the rules about only troping objective stuff. They've got some issues, though.
- They use a bit
of Word Cruft even after I explained why that's bad, in typical "This example is an example" fashion.
- They capitalize random
words like "Sociopathy" and "Fanfic".
- There are some YMMV tropes on the main page, like Complete Monster (I removed them though).
- The tropes aren't alphabetized properly either. One page had some misplaced tropes, while the other page had them all in completely random order.
- Also, they don't do indexing even after I sent a notifier.
Usually I'd just fix things myself, but I'm afraid of spoilers for Jojo's Bizarre Adventure and Demon Slayer, two series that these fanfics are based on and that I enjoy.
Edited by MichaelKatsuroopenWeird Folder Titles
While randomly bouncing through the wiki, I ran across Asian Speekee Engrish. Everything seems fine, except every folder has switched R for L (instead of film-live action, it reads "Firm - Rive Action). The trope description is written normally, the examples are written normally (as far as I saw), just the folders have this.
I guess it's trying to be self demonstrating (except this is far more Japanese Ranguage, which is also normal), but it reads very badly, and not even consistently (Other is spelled Othel, which isn't even stereotypically correct).
Would it be okay to simply change the titles, or is there a process to go through?
openUnforgivably rude edit reason
Marco Polo 250 gave the following reason to an edit
: "Then why even bring it up you stupid motherfucker"
If the example argued with itself, they could have easily pointed out how the example contradicts itself without being so rude. And it's also not the first time they've made such a rude edit, calling one troper
a "fantard" and that "no one gives a fuck about [their] opinion" (for which they were sent a rudeness notifier).
open Should JK Rowling's views on transgender people be mentioned on her Creator page?
As much as I hate to kick this hornet's nest, I'm honestly not sure where else to ask, since the discussion on the page itself seems to have died. On November 24th, Troper cerealking
deleted
a section of the article that mentions Rowling's views on transgender people with no edit reason given. I personally think it should be added to her biographical section (though not troped) as since 2019 she's been almost as (in)famous for her outspoken opposition to trans rights as for her other writing. Other creators such as Orson Scott Card who've become notorious for their reactionary views have it mentioned on their page, so why not Rowling?

So troper adonzo
has taken it upon himself to move large portions on MCU related pages.
While I am not necessarily opposed to what he did, I am opposed to how he did it, as he didn't discuss this with anybody and also left some mess behind
Biggest example: The folder for Mack is now double, both here
and here
, with no redirect.
I already PM'd him, but if he doesn't react, can his edits be reverted?
Edited by Forenperser