Have a question about how the TVTropes wiki works? No one knows this community better than the people in it, so ask away! Ask the Tropers is the page you come to when you have a question burning in your brain and the support pages didn't help.
It's not for everything, though. For a list of all the resources for your questions, click here. You can also go to this Directory thread
for ongoing cleanup projects.
Ask the Tropers is for:
- General questions about the wiki, how it works, and how to do things.
- Reports of problems with wiki articles, or requests for help with wiki articles.
- Reports of misbehavior or abuse by other tropers.
Ask the Tropers is not for:
- Help identifying a trope. See TropeFinder.
- Help identifying a work. See MediaFinder.
- Asking if a trope example is valid. See the Trope Talk forum.
- Proposing new tropes. See TropeLaunchPad.
- Making bug reports. See QueryBugs.
- Asking for new wiki features. See QueryWishlist.
- Chatting with other tropers. See our forums.
- Reporting problems with advertisements. See this forum topic.
- Reporting issues on the forums. Send a Holler instead.
Ask the Tropers:
openStrange entries in Life is Strange
Life is Strange has three weird entries on the bottom. The first is a fangame, the second are spiritual successors. Can they be cut?
Unofficial but notable works related to this franchise:
- Love Is Strange, a visual novel with characters from the first game made by Team Rumblebee and released in 2016. It jettisons all the sci-fi and tragic elements to focus purely on the Queer Romance aspects.
- Tell Me Why, released in 2020, a non-series game also developed by DONTNOD, with invokedvery similar themes. Due to having a different publisher it officially takes place in a separate continuity to Life Is Strange... but that hasn't stopped fans of the series from adopting it unofficially as an LIS title.
- Lost Records: Bloom & Rage, expected in early 2025, another non-series game developed (and this time self-published) by Don't Nod. Intended as the start of a new independent IP that draws on the studio's experience of making Life is Strange, again with similar themes but officially unconnected to the LiS universe.
openEdit war about a Plot Hole entry in Final Destination: Bloodies
Troper joaquinthehour removed the Plot Hole entry I put into Film.Final Destination Bloodlines yesterday with no edit reason:
- Plot Hole: As it turns out, Erik is not biologically related to Iris, meaning that he should be safe from being targeted by Death. This is seemingly confirmed when he survives the fire at the tattoo shop and Julia is instead the first of Howard's children to die. While it does makes sense that Death later targets Erik in the hospital for interfering with its design due to him trying to save Bobby, it doesn't explain Erik's incident at the tattoo shop if he wasn't originally on Death's list nor why the man with hooks wasn't added to the list after trying to help save Nora Carpenter from the second movie. This is made more glaring considering Death doesn't bother to go after any of the in-laws. One explanation could be that Erik's freak accident in the tattoo shop was just that; a genuine accident where Death wasn't actively trying to influence anything itself and the man with hooks was Killed Offscreen after Nora's death or was spared because he only interfered while being oblivious to Death's design. However, since the film never gives any concrete explanation, it's hard to overlook.
The entry fits because it is a small plot hole, but one nonetheless, and it has been expanded upon by other tropes. I placed it back yesterday, but today they removed the entry again with no edit reason. So, I'm taking it to Ask the Tropers.
Edited by MegaJopenCall-Back vs. Continuity Nod Live Action TV
I came very often upon examples of Call-Back that don't fit for not being plot-significant, and move them to Continuity Nod. As the description of the trope specifies:
- [A Call-Back is m]ore or less a Shout-Out to itself — but if that's all that it's doing, then it's a Continuity Nod; a Call-Back brings back an element that is actually relevant again.
However, on Andor S2E10 "Make It Stop", one such move of mine was reverted by palm529sw, despite the two concerned examples being pure flavor with no relevance at all to the episode. I did PM this editor, but got no response yet.
I'd like to have confirmation that my interpretation of Call-Back is correct, and that I can move the two examples back to Continuity Nod without being accused of edit warring.
Edited by StFanopenAPP Goofy Movie fanfic trope inquiry Film
I’m in need of assistance to determine which trope would best fit this highlight from my fanfic story “Face Off with Principal Mazur”:
PM: Ah yes. Mr. Goof. And the young man who incited that little riot at the assembly last year. G: Now see here. My Max is no juvenile delinquent and did not start a riot at all. PM: And how do you know that? (Roxanne then enters.) R: Because I saw what went on at that assembly. He wasn’t trying to incite any violence. All the other students were cheering for him and his Powerline performance because they loved it. And he and his dad also got to dance alongside the real Powerline himself at his concert in LA. My friends and I were watching, and they obviously impressed Powerline with their own dance moves, and he decided to make it part of his show without any objection. (Mazur just scoffs) PM: Another hijacking. Disrespect. That’s what’s wrong with today’s kids, don’t know when to stop making things miserable for others.
Basically, what this implies is that rather than acknowledge Max and Goofy’s talent and apologize for his misleading exaggeration to Goofy, he just flippantly disregards their dance as “another hijacking” and how today’s kids don’t know when to stop making others miserable.
openreport this user
I know I have probably talked about this before, but I want to report this user, Camilla, for the very nasty and unflattering things she's writing about the Pokemon Journeys character, Goh. You might know her as the author of Infinity Train Blossoming Trail.
She originally wrote the fic as a way to vent frustration at Chloe Cerise not getting enough focus in the series, and due to her belief that she and Goh aren't friends despite evidence in the show that they are. It wasn't a problem then at first, but now it's been almost six years since Journeys began and over a year and a half since it ended. And it's gotten to the point where she's now just using TV Tropes as an excuse to bash the character for how he was written.
TL;DR. My point is, this has been going for a while (too long) and several other users, including myself, have tried asking Camilla to either stop or at least try to tone things down, but she does not listen. I understand this is often a tricky subject, and that when it comes to fanfiction writing, everybody is entitled to their own option. However, there is a fine line between expressing one's opinion of a fictional character, and just needlessly punishing them for something that isn't even their fault.
openI have to bring up M84
He's a good guy and probably means well, but he sees so many bad things on my posts and so he's despective of me and and my posts.
Normally I would just keep the peace, but today after he said I was importing drama after making an innocent comment about how I disagreed with a NOT NAMED faction of people and not in a bashy or complainy way and I knew I couldnt defend myself lest I be thumped so I dropped it, but then I remembered I made a thread in another place and his first post in it is to bash it "Because its bragging" and I again played nice.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=ka1p4935g3od982kf54ktkwk&page=4379
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=17276648190A73099300&page=1#7
The threads in question.
resolved What do I go to change the title of a work page? Anime
I'm considering of changing the main title of "Literature.Bakemonogatari" to "Literature.MonogatariSeries" since Bakemonogatari is only the title for the first arc/season of the series (and the series itself is a bit of a Long Runner with multiple different names for each arc/season and Bakemonogatari is only one of them). It makes more sense for the main title to be the Monogatari Series instead.
However, I'm not exactly sure where I can propose to change the main title. How do I do this?
Edited by RuckusHeartsresolved Potential Edit War Western Animation
Hello, I recently added a fic rec to the Hazbin Hotel section and someone later came back and edited in a “YMMV” about the author, not commenting about the fic itself, making it unnecessary.
It comes off as petty and rude, not to mention false, so I removed it only for it to be added back in a little while later by the same user. I have sent a message to the user but I think a mod should get involved to stop an editing war.
The ones who added the “YMMV” edit back in is Keida.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=FanficRecs.HazbinHotel&page=7
Also I am fairly new to the site so please let me know if I need to provide more information or am putting this in the wrong section.
Thank you.
Edited by TuneGlowresolved Alien: Romulus retcons Alien: Covenant? (Spoilers) Film
The page for Alien: Romulus says that it definitively retcons Ridley Scott's assertion that David-8 created the Xenomorphs in Alien: Covenant by revealing that the Xenomorphs contain the Engineers' black goo.
Fox has seen fit to largely ignore Ridley Scott's assertion that David created the Xenomorphs—at least in regards to the official TTRPG, which was written with the intent of integrating and streamlining all the "canon" material—but I'm not seeing anything in the film itself that contradicts what's shown in Alien: Covenant given that David very expressly used the Engineers' black goo to create the Xenomorphs shown there.
What should be done about those claims?
openStrengthSorceryFinesse is limited to exactly three classes?
In Strength, Sorcery, Finesse, there is this hidden note.
"If your example has four or more types of character classes, than it belongs in either Common Character Classes or Character Class System."
But the trope description itself has full elaborate section about hybrid classes, which suggest that four or more classes would be fine.
So I think either the hidden note or the hybrid section should be remove.
(I adked in duscussion page already, and get the usual silence)
Edited by Kuruniopen''Series/BigLove'' example on MarryThemAll
Marry Them All has an example from Big Love. I don't think it fits because Marry Them All is about Polyamory as a solution to a love rivalry. I had removed the example but it was reinstated. Polyamory in and of itself is already a trope.
Edited by randomtroper89resolved Is there a point to having a Troper Page?
So, idk if this is a weird question. I'm intrigued by the idea of making a Troper page for myself but, I suppose, don't want to do it "wrong", if that makes sense? Why do people make Troper pages? What should I put on it? Is there a particular advantage to having one? Or is it just like a personal cork board to personalize?
openEdit War in Homeward Bound II Film
So in Homeward Bound II: Lost in San Francisco, Valinante added edits that claimed that Chance didn't forgive Sassy and Shadow at all after Delilah leaves him.
Hero Gal 2347 removes and/or alters them with this reason:
- A lot of the segments in Broken Pedestal, This Is Unforgivable! and Laser-Guided Karma seem to be a bit of an exaggeration. Yes, Chance understandably loses his temper over the incident with Shadow and Riley interfering in his relationship with Delilah, but he acts the same way he has for the past two movies when he reveals himself to Shadow and Sassy after the incident with Ashcan and Pete. There's no sign of a permanent grudge.
Valinante readds the This Is Unforgivable! entry.
I removed it with an admittedly rude reason (which i apologize for) and sent them a notifier quoting the Hero Gal's reason (if that's not okay I also apologize.
Valinante sent me a rather rude message that basically amounts to "Chance didn't say he forgave them, so he didn't." and disregards him saving them proving otherwise. And regardless I don't think an optimistic and upbeat movie would have such a pessimistic quality like "no forgiveness between friends".
Is it alright if I take this here? Does something further need to be done?
Edited by RedBerryBlueCherryopenPage quote citing a work's creator?
On Flow (2024), the page quote is sourced from an interview with the creator. The animation itself does not feature any dialogue. Is this suitable?
openRegarding Spoiler Policy for characters in Naruto Anime
Regarding Characters.Naruto, while checking for example, Pain's page, it shows in the description itself a lot about his past and motivations which are revealed quite late into the arc having his decisive fight, and in Madara's folder, in his description, the exact specifics of his defeat are written in great detail.
These are just two examples out of many, and in the folders, there are marked and unmarked spoilers with irregularity. Now, Naruto is an old anime, so I wanted to ask whether to remove the excruciating details in the description and spoiler out the spoilery details, or just leave them alone?
Edited by kuchiki222open Is there a trope for.... Videogame
Is there a trope for video games where developers seem to anticipate a player will try a certain strategy, and design the level to make that strategy more difficult to implement than it seems? Or if they design the level to punish a certain kind of play, even if it's just the player being careless and not anticipating the consequences of their actions? Kaizo Trap seems close, but it's specifically about victory or completion, I'm thinking more in the general course of gameplay. Batman Gambit works but is very broad as a trope, and it may or may not be Developer's Foresight depending on the exact example.
As two examples that would fit what I'm thinking of:
- In Hitman, the water tower on Colorado seems like the perfect spot to snipe targets from. But if you try it you'll find yourself trapped, as the AI will instantly surround the water tower and pin you down there with no hope for escape.
- In Dissidia Final Fantasy, the last level of an optional dungeon lets you challenge your Assist character to access two chests behind them. But if you do that, you'll have no Assist when fighting the boss Gabranth, and he has a very potent EX Mode build (Assists as a mechanic hard-counter EX Mode, but you just killed your Assist).
openIs this natter or word cruft?
Several weeks ago, I made an edit to our page for The Binding of Isaac regarding which parts of the game do and don't meet the qualifications to be considered a Brutal Bonus Level… it's not exactly straightforward in this case. Specifically, this edit right here
. (I wanted to ask about it sooner, but I couldn't for… reasons.) I went pretty in-depth on how Chapter 5 does count as a Brutal Bonus Level for the first 11 or 12 playthroughs, since you have to go out of your way to go there and the game normally ends before then, but once you've formally unlocked Chapter 5, you have to go there to reach most of the game's endings that are available at that point (unless you take one of a handful of later-unlocked routes that circumvent it), and the most "basic" endings available at that point happen at Chapter 5. (Contrast this with, say, Bullet Hell in Enter the Gungeon, which always qualifies for Brutal Bonus Level because, while you can end the game there, you always have the option of ending your run at the Forge right before it or going to your character's Past instead.) However, I have some reservations about the quality of my edit… I'm not sure whether or not I went off-track into Natter or Word Cruft territory by explaining the complicated situation as thoroughly as I did. I'll share what I said and request feedback.
- Brutal Bonus Level: All of the floors past the standard ending point in Chapter 5 count as this, retaining the full-heart damage of the Womb floors while mixing in tougher enemies and obstacles. These include the Chest, the Dark Room, the Void, the Corpse, and the Ascent (plus Home).
- Chapter 5 (Sheol
and Cathedral
) itself is a downplayed case, as it actually is a bonus level before the game has been beaten 11 times (i.e. beating Mom in Chapter 3 for the first time, then clearing Chapter 4 10 times). While beating the game 11 times is the formal criterion to unlock Chapter 5, it's possible to get there before meeting that requirement by using a level skip (such as We Need To Go Deeper!) or getting into the Devil or Angel Room of Womb II. However, once Chapter 5 has been properly unlocked and the Chapter 4 endings are exhausted, Sheol and Cathedral become the standard end-point for a run that doesn't end with the player character dying. The only ways to not enter Chapter 5 on a successful run after unlocking it are to bypass it entirely by warping directly to the Dark Room via a Sacrifice Room or to get into an endgame chapter before Chapter 5 (which means either entering a portal to the Void in the Depths, Womb, or Blue Womb or getting into an endgame that branches away from the main route before Chapter 5 (i.e. Corpse
or Ascent). However, Chapter 6 and the aforementioned Void, Corpse, and Ascent do count as Brutal Bonus Levels regardless of game progression, since they all have special criteria that must be met during a run in order to enter themnote the Chest and Dark Room require Isaac to have taken the correct item (the Polaroid or the Negative, respectively) after defeating Mom and then go to the Chapter 5 that matches that item (Cathedral or Sheol, respectively); the Void requires finding its portal after defeating an endboss, Corpse requires accessing and defeating Mom's Heart in Chapter 3.5 (usually but not necessarily with the Knife Pieces from Chapters 1.5 and 2.5), and Ascent requires taking the Polaroid, Negative, or Faded Polaroid to the Strange Door in Chapter 3 and then obtaining Dad's Note in the special Chapter 3.5 accessed in this way, and not meeting any of those criteria will result in the game ending at Chapter 5.
- Chapter 5 (Sheol
openBadass Decay Playing With misuse?
This was recently added to YMMV.Star Wars Clone Wars:
- Badass Decay: Ventress is first seen to eliminate her competition without even really trying, but in a manner that made her seem efficient and terrifying in combat, which appears again when dispatching Anakin's clone force. However, against Dooku and Anakin himself, she is first handily beaten and then ended up soundly losing in her only other duel, making her seem far from the threat she presented herself as. Possibly justified by the fact that Dooku and Anakin are the only other Force-users she faces in this series, and both have either equal or greater skill and experience than her, with Dooku being a full fledged Sith Lord and Anakin likely having more formal training as a Padawan.
YMMV cannot be played with and this seems a textbook Justifying Edit. But I've seen many other Badass Decay examples where the circumstances are justified, or presented as such by the examples. And Ventress was defeated by Dooku immediately after her showing, is that not too quick to count as decay as this establishes her baseline, powerful but overshadowed by Dooku? And why is it not seen as Ventress's skills being made lesser as opposed to Dooku being established as stronger as the work intended.
I've felt Badass Decay had a lot of issues over this, so asking here what to do.
Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaughtresolved Assistance with Example/Crosswick Anime
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ColdTouchSurprise
Someone added a video to Cold Touch Surprise. Now, the video fits the trope well, as far as I'm concerned. However, whoever added it didn't do an example write up for the series it depicts, and I myself am not familiar enough with the work to be sure I get all the respective details correct.
Would anyone familiar with the series please add the write up and crosswick it?
Edited by QPCwB

The page Characters.Mobile Suit Gundam G Quuuuuu X had a "click to show" image added by user DinoCam1795 to the folder for the character Nyaan where the caption to click to see the image was labelled "Zeon Uniform (spoilers)". While it does warn people viewing the page that spoilers are shown if you click the image, the caption itself was self-defeating since her joining Zeon is a spoiler in of itself (for reference, every mention of Nyaan's role in Zeon is under a spoiler tag). I made an edit to the page changing the caption to read "click to see spoilers" in line with similar instances I've seen on other pages where an image depicting certain appearances is a spoiler with the edit reason "I feel like mentioning it's a Zeon uniform in the caption makes the spoiler warning a moot point.". However, user Kuruni changed the caption back (minus the "(spoilers)" portion) with the edit reason "How can anyone know if they will be spoiled or not without clicking its first? If it bother people so much, why put the image here at all?". In the interest of not starting an editing war, is this fine or should the caption be adjusted in some other way to avoid spoilers?
Edited by Kirby0189