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openTroper not giving edit reasons for removals. Also possibly an agenda.
Grotadmorv appears to be almost exclusively removing Nightmare Fuel examples, without giving any of them edit reasons. Could someone send them a notifier? I don't really know that much of how I should do it myself.
Edited by pikachu17openLimiting vitriol/harsh edits on a YMMV page. Web Original
I’m the creator of a web original project, Diamond In The Rough, a Touhou self-insert fic part-deconstruction part-satire, and I also overlook the trope pages for it.
Recently, there’ve been some patronizing edits, but I’m not sure how to go about it. The edits have some legit complaints, but the wording feels hostile. If I’m not mistaken, the rules for creators on their own YMMV pages are stricter, but at the same time, what if an edit broke TV Tropes’ guidelines, but the creator wanted to clean up said edits while maintaining the essence of the complaints?
Here is the page in question: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/YMMV/DiamondInTheRoughTouhou
As you can tell by the recent edit history (in addition to me hitting enter too quickly and having to redo my edit reason separately), some of the edits were either less-than-flattering or just outright broke the rules. If it’s against the rules for me to edit this, I guess let me know and revert the page, though somebody else will have to clean it all up.
I’d rather leave the person who made the edits out of this since, again, they had common complaints, plus it seems by the fast edits it was done in the heat of passion. I just mainly wanna know what I, as the creator, can do to clean up the language/what I can do in general within the creator’s guidelines.
Edited by SpaztiqueopenShould Ferris (from Re:Zero) Be considered Transgender? Anime
Hi, I'm new to posting here, though I've browsed for longer. I'm a fan of the book series ReZero
, but what caught my interest while browsing the trope page was the fact that in the Re Zero Character Sheet Ferris is listed as a crossdressing boy, yet in the Transgender page Ferris is also listed as a transwoman. I think that these are conflicting statements or something. and a bit confusing? Idk. But I wanted to know whether Ferris should be considered a trans girl or a crossdressing boy.
Now. I personally believe that Ferris is a trans woman having read the bulk of the series. And these are some of my reasoning's as to why. Sorry if this is too long.
- Ferris legally goes by Felix Argyle, but she wishes to be called Ferris. In her introduction she reiterates to her boss that being called Felix upsets her,
and that "It's Ferris, Not Felix." Her birth name is rarely used in the story. This is akin to a trans person's deadname.
- In the side novel EX 1, it is shown that not even Fourier, one of her best friends, was aware that she had another name that she never used,
as Ferris does not like talking about the past, to the point where she doesn't tell people her birth name.
- In the side novel EX 1, it is shown that not even Fourier, one of her best friends, was aware that she had another name that she never used,
- In the English books, Ferris is addressed with male pronouns after her introduction. yet in the japanese version, she frequently uses feminine pronouns, this fact is also stated on the character sheet.
- Most importantly, there is a scene in her side novel Volume EX 1 which shows that for the last 6 years, Ferris has been praying to be a girl,
reaffirming herself everyday when she is alone in the mirror. The Narrator goes on to state that she no longer had to say these words, as they were already apart of the person who spoke them for 6 years.
- There is also a scene in EX 1 which shows that she dreaded coming out to Fourier about her birth gender, as she feared that, like other people, he would no longer want to be her friend.
- Ferris also states that she will never wear men's clothes again. In an interview on Twitter, the Author stated that the one time she wore men's clothes, she actually cried.
- And there is also the small fact that Ferris has been in a couple of video game crossovers that feature them in all-girls casts. I just figured I might add that in.
I know of a popular counterargument that might be brought up. That one is that Ferris in Arc 4 says that "He is a man in heart and soul" according to fan translations of the Web Novel. However, in the Official Light Novel release, This line is omitted and replaced with a line that reads "This outfit is a reflection of my body and spirit." I feel this has a much different meaning than the former line, as the outfit Ferris wears is a girls outfit, and it doesn't seem to imply that she identifies as male. This line is omitted in Volume 10 of the Light Novel, which the author considers to be the final version of the book series. Arc 4 was also released in 2013, when EX 1 and Volume 10 were released post 2015.
All-in-all, these points, alongside other evidence I didn't mention, are why I also think Ferris is trans, and I'd like to know what to make of this.
Edited by SneekshionopenHaving a problem with a thing on the Camp page Film
It's this: "Don't expect it to take itself the least bit seriously."
Now, that may apply with Batman (1966), the works of John Waters, and some of the films in the Marvel Cinematic Universe (specifically Thor: Ragnarok and The Guardians of the Galaxy films), but with all the books and articles I've read on the subject, I've found that part of the page disingenuous. The Universal Monster Movies and the films of Bette Davis and Joan Crawford are very serious but are regarded as camp due to their melodrama, theatricality, and artifice.
I was wondering if it could be changed to something like "The serious becomes silly while the silly becomes serious. And there's no limit to how over the top something can get."
openEdit War in YMMV/Super Smash Bros Ultimate Videogame
A while back I noticed this from YMMV.Super Smash Bros Ultimate:
- This would later be downplayed in Castlevania: Grimoire of Souls where Simon initially displays this attitude towards Alucard, commenting on the dark powers from within him are on-par with Dracula's, only for Alucard to remind Simon that he once fought alongside Trevor Belmont, and comments on both Maria, Shanoa, and Charlotte's impressive abilities in magic.
This was a lone third level bullet "reply" to another example under Memetic Psychopath, which was what first stood out as incorrect Example Indentation. Then looking at the text itself it was all about another game's characterization of Simon and nothing to with Simon in Smash Bros. Ultimate. So I removed
it citing both reasons in the Edit Reason.
Tailikku then put it back
showing misunderstanding of both reasons in their Edit Reason.
I PMed them telling them the reasons the entry is incorrect, but they did not respond. So I decided to bring it up here, and checking the Page History again I noticed Tailikku was the one that added the entry
in the first place, so they're also Edit Warring.
openAcceptable Targets misuse?
- Acceptable Targets: Everyone and everything on the planet, at one point or another, has been lampooned on the show, even the show itself.
- Out of everyone they've ridiculed, favored butt-monkeys include hippies, Ben Affleck (at least until Argo came out), and Barbra Streisand.
My impression is that this that it's about targets audiences find acceptable. But the entry is about the show finding them assertable which doesn't sound YMMV. ALL the Acceptable Targets entries I've seen are written as the work treating them as assertable, not audiences.
Is it YMMV because fan of the work find it such? That's not how they're written and fans of a work agreeing with the works opinions seems like People Sit on Chairs.
The Quiet One (he/him)
openMoving a page to Useful Notes Videogame
A while back (maybe around two or so years ago), in the TLP crash rescue thread, I brought up VideoGame.Game Genie since it lacks trope examples. I said I thought it should be moved to UsefulNotes.Game Genie, since it's a way to tinker with games' code, rather than being a game itself. Only one person responded; Fighteer said he agreed with that idea, but that post wasn't marked as a mod statement (i.e., the post wasn't highlighted in red/pink), so I wasn't sure if I had permission.
Would moving the page to Useful Notes require a TRS thread, or is posting this on ATT enough? VideoGame.Mii was moved to UsefulNotes.Mii earlier this year without TRS, but I don't know if the consensus was gathered on ATT or the forums, so I wasn't sure.
Edit: It looks like VideoGame.Game Shark is in the same boat as VideoGame.Game Genie.
Edited by GastonRabbitopenShenanigans on the Hinduism page
On UsefulNotes.Hinduism, it has a WMG page and the phrase "By fully understanding how those fundamental particles react with each other, they could understand creation itself, and transcend it" is potholed to Does This Remind You of Anything?
Edited by Willbyropen Cleaning up and Updating of the Red Hood related YMMV pages Print Comic
Hey everyone, I wanted to ask for help/feedback about what it should be done about the YMMV pages of both Red Hood and the Outlaws and Red Hood YMMV pages. The pages have been ignored for a long while with only a few tropers showing interest in keeping the entries up to date. One of the tropers that have, unfortunately, shows an obvious negative bias against the series and its writer, Scott Lobdell. I find the current state of the pages to be not only unhelpful for anyone interested in checking the series and/or the character and the personal views expressed to be somewhat out of place. I tried to fix the pages a little a while back, trying to be as objective as possible with my edits but I only succeeded in getting myself tangled in an Edit War with the aforementioned troper. Since I don't want the situation to repeat itself, and I'm still not satisfied with the pages' current status, I ask you for some help in improving those pages.
openRecurring Fanon Character vs. O.C. Stand-in
- Very common in My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic circles.
- The "Background Six" were all characters with absolutely no characterization beyond some slight gags, or maybe a bit line or two. The fandom went wild with them anyway. All of these turned into Ascended Fanon within the show itself in the episode "Slice of Life". These characterizations mostly still persist to this day within the fandom.
- Flufflepuff from Ask Fluffle Puff
- Gamer Princess Luna from Ask Princess Molestia and Ask Gaming Princess Luna
The first example sounds more like O.C. Stand-in they are not fan made characters. The second might count as a persona adopted after they got canon characterization but was commented out as I was posting this.
I’d say O.C. Stand-in should be a separate thing, as such characters aren’t OC’s. But there’s this description from Recurring Fanon Character:
- A reinterpretation of a canon character; these characters are known as the counterparts of the canon characters. The Tails Doll of Sonic R is a robotic doll meant to serve as Tails' Metal Sonic, but is an otherwise Flat Character. Due to its unintentional creepiness, the fans treat as an actual creature of nightmares, which has been the base for many fanworks and creepypasta.
How is O.C. Stand-in separate from RFC? Because OCSI is Depending on the Writer while RFC is a constituent characterization?
And why is O.C. Stand-in not Trivia like Fan Nickname or YMMV if it’s how audiences treat characters? If it is for characters intentionally written to be such do they need proof it’s intentional as opposed to incidental?
openQueer Romance: trope or index?
Queer Romance does indexing, but it's treated like a trope on the page itself, complete with commenting out of ZCEs (which, if it's supposed to be functioning as an index, should not actually be considered/treated as ZCEs)
openWhere to file examples from a show within a show
So I'm crosswicking Card Force Infection and I'm wondering if the examples of tropes in the in-universe card game should go in the Literature folder or the Tabletop Games folder?
It's never been published as a tabletop game, but the author does have a list of the full rules text for all the cards seen so far and enough of the game flow has been discussed in the story that one could put together and play the game, if one wanted to.
... For that matter, should tropes from the in-universe card game be separated out on the work page itself? I did it like that because I thought it looked nicer, but on reflection I'm not sure if it's the "correct" thing to do and I can't think of another game-within-a-story that's theoretically playable but not actually published like this one is to compare against.
Edited by wingedcatgirlopenMore YMMV/StevenUniverseFuture issues.
- Unintentionally Unsympathetic: Garnet, Pearl, and Amethyst, even with the fact that Steven is growing up, continue to treat him like they did at the start of Steven Universe. At several different points, they are seen glossing over his emotions, such as during "Together Forever" when Garnet doesn't give Steven help when he asks (and claims that "there was no future where he didn't propose despite Ruby and Sapphire directly egging Steven on to propose to Connie), and Amethyst glossing over Steven's concerns in "Guidance" when he pointed out they were treating the newly-immigrated gems like they did on Homeworld (though she turned out to be mostly right, Both Sides Have a Point). And "Snow Day", when they repeatedly ignored the many signs that Steven did not want to play with them, as well as the fact that they never directly apologized to Steven while he was himself onscreen (like he did to Cactus Steven in "Prickly Pair") in "I Am My Monster" or "The Future" over their Parental Neglect or how he was their Living Emotional Crutch, instead just acknowledging it while he was in his Kaiju form. Or acting "tough" in "The Future", without considering how acting like they didn't care their child was leaving may have affected Steven emotionally. Steven may have not brought it up most of the time, but is it any wonder he's angry with them?
1. It fails to explain why they were supposed to be sympathetic despite the circumstances. 2. It outright states they realized they were in the wrong in "I Am My Monster", the point of the series was showing how they treated Steven hurt him. The "never directly apologized to Steven while he was himself onscreen" seems too minor and nitpicky to count when at least 90% of this was intentional. This is the second case of UU issue on the page
.
I also asked UU cleanup
but this seem an easy fix and bigger issue so I'm asking here as well.
openMisuse of Author Existence Failure on several pages?
A number of pages relating to Power Rangers has Author Existence Failure for actors that have passed away, but my issue is that while the show as a whole is ongoing the seasons they were a part of are long over and with seasons more or less self contained now, there's very little chance of their character coming back anyways so listing this trope seems pointless.
Another issue is the addition of The Character Died with Him too, with Power Rangers Never Say "Die" in place it's very unlikely any character (especially those from older seasons) would ever be revealed to have passed on so again it seems like an unnecessary trope to have.
So should these tropes be deleted, edited in some way, or just left alone?
Edited by AkibaPurpleopenDefusing possible edit war.
Woodsy Grabass 2019 re-added this HateSink entry
on Characters.MCU Kilgrave after I first rewrote it, and then cut it when someone familiar with the show suggested In the Hate Sink thread that the author intent was too ambiguous to confirm that Kilgrave was meant to be despised above all else.
- Hate Sink: He's both the primary villain of the piece and this trope. The man is so despicable, and he destroys so many lives, that the main draw of the story is waiting for him to lose. This is drawn out by the existence of Hope as a Damsel in Distress that needs to be saved at the cost of sparing Kilgrave, but she specifically kills herself so that his destruction can become the sole motivation of our Main Characters. It doesn't help the fact that his entire character is a portrayal of Rape Culture, Toxic Masculinity and Male Entitlement.
Furthermore, the entry as reverted possibly violates the Rule of Cautious Editing Judgement by using political buzzwords, instead of the straightforward and buzzword free entry that I rewrote before I cut it.
- Hate Sink: Kilgrave is presented as an immature, misogynistic, possessive creep and sexual predator, as well as a petty, entitled, hedonistic individual who regularly mistreats other people for his amusement. Any superficial charm Kilgrave has only serves to underscore his unpleasantness.
If Woodsy has proof that Kilgrave, above all else, was meant to be hated, I want them to discuss further. Evidently I forgot to link to the HS thread in my edit reason the last time.
Edited by SkyCat32openWillow from Buffy the Vampire Slayer should be listed as Unintentionally Unsympathetic Live Action TV
I know she's already listed as a Woobie, Destroyer of Worlds but I think she should also be listed under UU.
For starters, she attempts to destroy the world and her friends just because some killed her girlfriend. To top it all off, she hocks herself up on dark magic despite knowing the implications. It's not for her to decide if the world needs to be destroyed or not yet the show paints her as a tragic figure despite her attacking her friends. To me, she comes off as petty and traitorous and the forgivenss and redemption she gets is completely undeserved
Edited by deathnoteFNBOI58openWMG in Fridge
We're not allowed to put what is essentially Wild Mass Guessing on Fridge/ subpages or entries, right? Square Peg Round Trope says this is the case with respect to Fridge Brilliance, at least, but I want to make sure. Note that Fridge Horror can also be a source of this; Fridge Logic doesn't suffer from that so much as overlap with Headscratchers.
These entries are what stick out in my mind:
Fridge Horror
- One popular theory posits on whether or not Mei was most likely molested when she was younger given her mannerisms and predatory ways towards Yuzu from the beginning. This is especially made worse when in one instance of trying to offer sex towards Yuzu after she learned that her father wouldn't return to the academy, she claims that she would be gentle as that was Yuzu's "first time."
- Given how it's later revealed that Mei is mimicking the behavior of others, this further reinforces this theory. The "I'll be gentle" comment was likely said to her or something she witnessed before.
This is explicitly noted to be a theory, and the example indentation violation for the sake of natter is not helping its case. The spoiler tag, by the way, is in the page itself and was not added by me.
Under Fridge Brilliance:
- How did Carne ever develop his stand? He can only summon it if he is killed off, so how did anyone ever discover his power? Why, is possible The Boss himself discovered it. He was possibly going to kill him but Epitaph warned him of Notorious B.I.G, so he changed his mind and turned him into a member of his elite squad.
This is clearly guessing. If this was in the story, it would have probably been more explicit. Nothing in the story indicates that this happened as described. Also, Carne did manifest his ability before he died, it's just that this was seemingly overlooked before the anime adapted the relevant arc for some reason.
resolved Edit War ...Death Battle again Web Original
In Jul 23rd 2019, qwigly added this to DeathBattle.Tropes A To C as an example of Bloodless Carnage.
- In the span of Weiss Vs Mitsuru, Mitsuru actually manages to draw more blood from herself (via the Evoker) than she does from Weiss
In Jul 27th 2019, ironcommando edit the entry to following, with "Evokers don't draw blood." as edit reason.
- In the span of Weiss Vs Mitsuru, nobody lands any bloodletting hits despite both combatants being impaled at two different points of the battle.
Today, qwigly edit it back with "Someone probably should have told Torrian that, as there is very clearly a blood effect when she fires her Evoker." as edit reason.
- In the span of Weiss Vs Mitsuru, Mitsuru actually manages to draw more of her own blood than she does of Weiss's, via the Evoker..
As someone who played Persona 3, I can confirm that it doesn't draw blood. And rewatching that episode of Death Battle, it's not really look like blood either.
openFound on WesternAnimation/Driven to Suicide
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/DrivenToSuicide/WesternAnimation
- My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic:
- In the episode "No Second Prances", a very distraught Trixie Lulamoon attempts to perform a dangerous magic trick involving launching herself into a manticore's mouth alone. Her assistant Starlight Glimmer would have teleported her to safety, but Starlight learned the only reason that Trixie acted nicely towards her was so that Trixie could one-up Twilight Sparkle. Even worse, when Trixie reveals that she genuinely likes Starlight, she makes the mistake of adding in that "beating Twilight Sparkle is just a bonus!", which only angers Starlight more. Thankfully, Twilight is able to convince Starlight to help Trixie just in time to make the stunt go off without a hitch. While Word of God has confirmed that Trixie going on with the show was not a suicide attempt — there are a few subtle cues in the episode that make it clear Trixie's life wasn't in danger — it was still enough for it to be a popular fanon due to Trixie's Friendless Background.
So... not driven to suicide, then.
Remove?

I was looking at Creator.Funimation and found it odd that it was spelled properly, as I had always known it as FUNimation. I popped a wikiword request in but then looked down, actually read the page and saw it said previously known as FUNimation Productions and FUNimation Entertainment. Since I don't see any way to cancel the request myself, I wanted to post this so a mod would know it was a mistake on my part.
Edited by sgamer82