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openMisuse of AssPull? Complaining?
Tavernier just added several examples of Ass Pull to Digimon Adventure tri., all of which beginning with "Man, it sure is lucky that..." I don't think any of these are valid, since Ass Pull is for twists that are not properly foreshadowed; yet these entries are mostly complaining about certain events, as you can see below.
- Man, it sure is lucky that Taichi somehow survived the same fall that left Daigo bleeding half to death—and without a scratch, even! It's like he's wearing armor made of hardest plot. Either Plot Armor or Fridge Logic
- Man, it sure is lucky that Taichi and Daigo somehow fell smack dab into this conspicuous underground laboratory that just so happens to be a bastion of Team Yggdrasil's activities. A rather contrived way to move the plot, maybe; but definitely not a twist.
- Man, it sure is lucky that Taichi and Daigo somehow found the missing 02 kids and Gennai being held captive in stasis. They didn't even have to look that hard! This is a direct consequence of the preceding event.
- Man, it sure is lucky that this underground laboratory in the digital world is apparently immune to the recent digital world reboot. No need to worry about what happens to rebooted humans! Fridge Logic
- Man, it sure is lucky Wizarmon somehow showed up in Hikari's dreams to lead her to Gatomon despite no longer having a connection to either of them since the reboot wiped out his memory. This is both factually wrong and explained in-universe. The character in question is shown to be a spirit in the prequel series, hence why he was not affected by the reboot.
- Man, it sure is lucky that Meicoomon was somehow storing backup data for all the rebooted digimon, hiding it behind an encrypted password. It's nice to know the reboot won't have any consequences. This was actually properly foreshadowed, since Meicoomon not losing her memories implied she had stored the missing data inside herself. And it's also wrong, since the reboot DID have lasting consequences (bringing back every previous antagonist back to life, for example).
Should something be done?
Edited by TantaMontyopen Is there such a thing as a "Trusted Editor"? Western Animation
I've noticed that a troper, in their profile, listed themselves as a Trusted Editor of a specific set of pages here on tvtropes.
I hadn't ever come across that term before. If this a real thing, I'd be curious to know how that role works?
Or is it just a self-proclaimed title chosen by the troper that has no real meaning?
Edited by rva98014openSupernaturaldramasFan
Supernaturaldramas Fan has been doing some bizarre things in some Smallville and Buffy the Vampire Slayer pages.
On the Characters.Buffy The Vampire Slayer Scooby Gang Originals, they deleted several entries on a character with no reason given (they were already restored by another troper).
They created the Analysis.Smallville page and copy-pasted some argument between users from another Wikia site.
They also created the Synopsis.Smallville page just to put a PSA for people not to skip the first 3 seasons, which is not what Sypnosis pages are for.
They put the same PSA on the main Smallville article, which I removed myself for being out of place.
They're also posting both that Wikia argument and the PSA on many of the Smallville discussion pages.
resolved Issues with Unintentionally Unsympathetic on YMMV / The Falcon and the Winter Soldier
So some users seem to really want to fit Karli Morgenthau into an Unintentionally Unsympathetic entry on this page. As follows:
Version no. 1:
- Karli gets hit with this quite hard by the end. Sure, she lost her only mother figure and she's the product of a world that lost half of its entire population for five years, but she's only going further and further into the Moral Event Horizon as the show goes on. It reaches a peak in the final episode, "One World, One People", where she callously decides to kill the hostages, completely forgetting that she intended on using them as a bargaining chip instead. Never mind blowing up the GRC supply depot in the third episode. As a result, not a lot of tears were shed when Sharon, a.k.a. the Power Broker, finally put her down for good.
Version no. 2:
- Karli gets hit with this quite hard by the end. Sure, she lost her only mother figure and she's the product of a world that lost half of its entire population for five years, but she's only going further and further into the Moral Event Horizon as the show goes on. It reaches a peak in the final episode, "One World, One People", where she callously decides to kill the hostages, completely forgetting that she intended on using them as a bargaining chip instead. Never mind blowing up the GRC supply depot in the third episode. As a result, not a lot of tears were shed when Sharon, a.k.a. the Power Broker, finally put her down for good. Then again, it it kinda makes sense when you realize the Super-Soldier serum must have amplified her negative qualities too, just like Walker. She may have been a person with good intentions, but probably nowhere as incorruptible as Steve. In other words, "Good becomes great, bad becomes worse."
And Version no. 3:
- Karli is clearly meant to be a Tragic Villain with a sympathetic backstory and motivations, but many feel that she crossed the Moral Event Horizon too many times for them to buy into Sam and Bucky's view that she is ultimately just some troubled teen lashing out at the world when she commits multiple murders and attempted murders, blows up buildings, takes hostages and tries to set them on fire to prevent them from being rescued, and it doesn't help that she has nostalgia for the time when half the planet was dead and resents the Avengers for restoring billions of murdered people to life. Many see her as little more than a murderous whiny teenager with a childish view of how the world works and almost no empathy for problems that are not her own.
Putting aside that a character can't crost the MEH more than once, I don't feel like proper protocol was followed. as you can see here
, the first version was added in by Your Boy Russell on April 23rd before being edited to the second version by Hissing Aurora 94 the same day. I then deleted it a few hours later because it was a self-arguing entry, telling them to take it to the cleanup thread to discuss it first. Then the third version was added yesterday by Dragon 101. They did not bring it to the discussion thread, or really discuss it in any way before re-adding a version of the entry.
Look, I don't really care if some people don't like one character on the show but this doesn't work, right? At best the entry is bad and needs to be edited, at worst it needs to be deleted for poor curation.
Edited by MinisterOfSinisteropenUnbuilt Trope again Anime
(NSFW)
Few days ago, I removed this Monster Musume entry from UnbuiltTrope.Anime And Manga (originally a two bullets entry).
- Animal-based species are given the strength of their respective animals to match, and examined realistically as well. With the exception of Rachneranote who does know her strength and Lalanote who is fundamentally no different than a normal human outside of her being headless, Kimihito's monster girls frequently have trouble holding their strength back, which results in him getting injured. Should any of them not hold back any of their strength, such as during a full moon, their strength could literally kill him.
My reason is that this one is a plain Deconstruction. As noted in the work page, Monster Musume is Bleached Underpants of Living with Monster Girl (and I would like to add that it's also know as My Life with Monster Girl), itself is fanwork of Monster Girl Encyclopedia, an escapism porn (we used to have pages for it, but it got cut by P5 for lolicon content). In that work, it's noted that monster girls' strenght or pointy bodyparts will never harm their husband thank to their innate succubi mana. Oyakado deconstructed it since Living with Monster Girl with two strips showing how sex with monster girls can leave their mates with scars and marks (I don't think I can provide a link here, am I?).
Today, Tehrannotaur add it back. Claims that "unbuilt trope is that the trope was played with (this includes deconstructed) before it was popularized (and in some case the epitome itself played with that trope). While monster musume wasn't the first monster girl-centric series, it popularized the genre".
But as noted, this one is direct deconstruction to its parent work. It pick an element (monster girls can't accidently harm their husbands) and potray it as how it should be (originally when they get too excite during sex, then Bleached Underpants version expand it to everyday life).
In other words, this isn't the case of "the work that popularized the genre use a trope in unusual way", it's "the work that popularized the genre deconstruct the older work, but the later work follow the older one". Not unbuilt, just a plain deconstruction.
Edited by Kuruniresolved Victoria vandalism Literature
I'm on a self-imposed hiatus due to reasons, but this should be brought to the mods' attention.
Walker 45 has edited Literature.Victoria, calling it "a deranged piece of Nazi propaganda" and the like. They have also made forum posts
expressing overwhelmingly negative views towards the work and saying they will remove all mentions of it from the wiki.
Requesting mod revert of Victoria.
openSuspected Ban Evader
I'm pretty sure Resident Blade Oreboros, who just made this
query, is actually a sockpuppet of Ninten Fire Swag 20, who got bounced over their obsession with making a scene from RWBY count as a "Ray of Hope" Ending... the same thing that Oreboros is talking about in their query.
Also they edit similar pages (a lot of creator pages, Fire Emblem, Supermarioglitchy, etc).
Hate to call someone out while they're literally a thread below me, but... well, it beat accusing them directly on their thread and something just smells fishy.
Edit: Quick fact check, they were actually trying to make it count as a Downer Ending in addition to "Ray of Hope" Ending. Just wanted to correct myself.
Edited by WarJay77openUnintentionally Unsympathetic overly-trimmed?
UnintentionallyUnsympathetic.Comic Books
- Sonic the Hedgehog (IDW): Readers who have taken issue with Sonic's decisions to let his adversaries go have generally also begun viewing him more in this light, arguing that he's become more insensitive towards other characters who have reason to be skeptical of his choices, seemingly caring more about his own righteousness in letting go of his adversaries than about how it may affect everyone else.Specific examples In issue #12, he brushes aside Tails' concerns about letting Metal Sonic go free and that they need to "honor his decision" (which leads to Metal returning to the Final Egg just in time to restore Mr. Tinker back to his Eggman self); in issue #24, he gets into a brief-yet-heated argument with Espio about how they should've better handled the Mr. Tinker situation then and there to ensure he wouldn't commit acts of evil again; in issue #32, he shows that he still hopes that Eggman can change for the better despite the Zombie Apocalypse he had just caused; in issue #44, Zavok himself calls out Sonic for his mercy in merely exiling the Deadly Six back to the Lost Hex (in spite of the torment they put him, Tails and the entire world through in Sonic Lost World alone), with Sonic asserting that he won't "sacrifice [his] principles out of fear"; and in issue #50, he tells Surge that he still believes that even [Eggman and Starline] deserve the freedom to live life for the better. Likewise, upon first meeting Belle during the Chao Races and Badnik Bases arc, he somehow mistakes her for an evil robot (despite looking and acting nothing like one), tries to destroy her and later leave her behind in the middle of nowhere despite his earlier insistence on showing mercy, giving chances and not assuming the worst about everyone and everything. Sonic also comes off to these readers as being more judgmental and condescending than his usual characterization when being faced with opposing views, and emphasizing his own viewpoint as being noble regardless of his allies' own views.Specific examples The case where he claps back at Shadow to remember his own villainous history— despite it being misguided compared to Eggman's self-aware egotism, his redemption not being the result of amnesia, and how Shadow's knowingly atoned for it since— during their fight in issue #6; claiming to "honor [Metal Sonic's] decision" in issue #12 but chastising him for being a "one-note jerk" for rejoining Eggman later in issue #26; the aforementioned heated argument with Espio in issue #24, who was shown to be visibly traumatized by Charmy and Vector's Zombot infections in the issues prior; and spending his fight with Surge in issue #50 brushing off her Tragic Villain nature, quipping and spouting out that he's having "fun" during their battle, and making a speech about why he chooses to give everyone the freedom of mercy, in contrast to how Tails at least tries talking things out with Kit. This tweet
shows a fan reaction of the most recent of these.
This was trimmed to this citing "Trimming down the entry and removing blatant one-sided arguments".
- Sonic the Hedgehog (IDW): Some readers have taken issue with Sonic's Thou Shall Not Kill attitude, arguing that his decision to let his enemies go has had disastrous, unintentional consequences on those around him.
The revised entry fixes the complaining but now fails to explain how it's unintentional/why they were supposed to be sympathetic. What to do? I asked UU Cleanup
but heard nothing back.
openTroper ignoring advices and posting misuses
For a period of time, gamerzillasaurusrex2000 was suspended and had to use the "Help with English" thread. Grammar aside, most examples they asked to be corrected seemed to be misuse in my opinion. I contacted them twice (one time in PM and one time on the forum) to tell them that the examples they wanted to grammar-check seemed to be misuse and I advised them to post them on the "Is This an Example?" thread after having them grammar-checked, but they completely ignored me. Recently, gamerzillasaurusrex2000 was unsuspended and posted all of their corrected example without taking the time to verify if they were valid examples. Here's two
examples
of what I consider complete misuse
, but there's more (notably in Truth in Television) if you look at their edit history starting from when they got unsuspended (Feb 15th). Do you people agree that plenty of these examples are misuse? I wouldn't want to single-handily check all of their edits myself to see if they are valid or not because I may make mistakes myself.
openUncomfortably bashy WMG listing.
I wanted to bring up this WMG made by Idea Master on The Bad Guys WMG page. It starts here, but then goes for a few more posts
. The character in question is a Hero Antagonist in-media, being a cop with the protagonists being crooks. I get that and all...but this seems heavily vitriolic and not fit for both the series and the page, while also feels like just airing out grievances on cops alone, nothing about the character in herself. I haven't messaged them yet, since I wasn't sure how this should be handled.
openEdit War on SuperMarioBros movie
Troper Doctor Sleep originally added the following Deconstructed Character Archetype for Bowser in The Super Mario Bros. Movie:
"Bowser's violent tendencies and delusion that Peach would be into him are deconstructions of video game protagonists like Mario. He gains rewards by destroying anyone and anything that's different to himself and looting their kingdoms for treasure all so he can impress a princess that he sees as little more than another trophy."
This was later deleted with the reasoning that Mario's archetype (in most games) is as a working class hero who rescues a princess—without expectation of a relationship in return—from a villain, which has nothing to do with Bowser being a bully and feeling entitled to Peach.
Doctor Sleep later readded
this entry under Corrupted Character Copy, with some wording alterations (notably still insisting that Bowser is a deconstruction of Mario.) Setting aside the fact that this is misuse because Bowser is not an expy of Mario, is this an edit war?
For the record I think to suggest Bowser in the movie is a "deconstruction of protagonists like Mario" at all is incorrect. Mario as a protagonist does not attack all things different from him, he defends peaceful creatures from harmful ones. He does not do all of this to impress Peach, he usually does it for the motivation that it is simply the right thing to do. And Bowser in the movie does not rove around looting other worlds (he loots just one, because it specifically had something he wanted, and then he heads straight to the mushroom kingdom for Peach.) He is not motivated to attack things because they are "different from him", he attacks things because he is an ill-tempered bully. His entitlement to Peach is not based on him seeing himself as a "hero" to impress her, it is based on wanting to conquer everyone as husband and wife. In the movie, as in the games, he is simply the bad role model to Mario's good one, not an evil version of Mario.
openAvoiding an edit war
So on Trivia.Wednesday I deleted
this entry:
- Creator Backlash: Jenna Ortega has stated how she was strongly against the love triangle between Wednesday, Xavier, and Tyler, believing that's not what viewers would want to see Wednesday involved in.
I removed it after discussing it here
, because Creator Backlash is where they express dislike for the whole work and not just one aspect. Impaler added
this new entry for it
- Creator Backlash: In the “Armchair Expert” podcast, Jenna Ortega reveals she despized most of the writing about her character, like the dialogue and the love triangle.
Jenna Ortega: "I don’t think I’ve ever had to put my foot down more on a set in a way that I had to on ‘Wednesday'. Everything that Wednesday does, everything I had to play, did not make sense for her character at all. Her being in a love triangle? It made no sense. There was a line about a dress she has to wear for a school dance and she says, ‘Oh my god I love it. Ugh, I can’t believe I said that. I literally hate myself.’ I had to go, ‘No. There were times on that set where I even became almost unprofessional in a sense where I just started changing lines. The script supervisor thought I was going with something and then I had to sit down with the writers, and they’d be like, ‘Wait, what happened to the scene?’ And I’d have to go and explain why I couldn’t go do certain things.”
Again this is just one aspect (the writing) rather than the show as a whole like this trope is supposed to be and even then the quote doesn't scream despised. Plus I fail to see how the second bullet is backlash personally. Honestly this feels more like Wag the Director.
Can I get some more opinions on of this counts?
Berserk Button: misusing Nightmare Fuel
openWeird fetishy edit
On a Wiki Walk, I stumbled across Characters.Thumbelina 1994, where I noticed that the folder for Mrs. Fieldmouse described her as "An insanely sexy mouse lady". This edit was made in March
by rastapopoulos.
While it's a different kind of wrong, they also blanked
Characters.Chitty Chitty Bang Bang, a page they created themself.
Not sure if this is needing mod action just yet, but I felt like bringing it up.
openCouldHaveAvoidedThisPlot misuse/edit wars?
Quotes.Could Have Avoided This Plot
Ohvist first added the Suicide Squad quote. I deleted them as "Could Have Avoided This!" Plot is about in-universe characters acknowledging such (I believe I recall asking and being told reviewers doing it in their shows is misuse). Ohvist later added it back. Later Hotaru3 added the NIMH 2 quote. IchigoMontoya deleted both without edit reason. Hotaru3 added both back.
Besides the apparent edit warring, is this misuse if it's out of universe reviewers stating such even within their own shows universe?
openEdit war on Trivia.Deltarune
On Trivia.Deltarune, beanedtron has twice edited the Promoted Fanboy entry to read Promoted Fan, due to the creator it regards being nonbinary. This contradicts the recently-updated policy on gendered redirects
which restricts them to Character Sheets.
We've already sent them a message, but since we're getting Righting Great Wrongs vibes here, we're also putting up a report in case they decide to make a thing about it. and also as a reminder to ourself to actually edit the page once they respond if they don't
open Edit War on Character page of Turning Red Western Animation
Troper Rom Watt added back the Hero Antagonist example for Turning Red for the character Ming despite the majority of Ming’s actions not really coming off as heroic and more of a detriment to Mei’s (the main character) personal growth. Ming was an obstacle and a Karen who inconvenienced others with her selfish actions (she assaulted a security guard that was just doing his job and even destroyed a dome and risking lives all because Mei wanted to attend a concert). This doesn’t sound like a Hero Antagonist at all. She was far from heroic and she had to realize that she was the villain at the end of the movie. I wanted to delete the example, but I want to avoid an Edit War.
Edited by MsCC22open Edit War alert (self report)
Some background first. There are two characters in Mobile Suit Gundam: The Witch from Mercury that fan presumed to be the same character. The first one is Ericht, a 4 years old girl from Prologue episode, and the other is Suletta, the heroine of the show who's stated to be 17. But the recent 6th episode has dialogue implies that the Prolgue takes place 21 years before the main story. So they're unlikely to be the same character.
While it's true that the dialogue isn't explicit that the 21 years old incident is the Prologue, there is no official words that they're the same character either.
So I removed all assumption that Ericht being Suletta
from Characters.Mobile Suit Gundam The Witch From Mercury.
The next day, frankywifeey274 added them back without edit reason
. I removed them again the next day
state that it's speculation and sent Speculation notifier to frankywifeey274. They added it back later, without edit reason
.
They sent PM to me, claims that there is no proof that they aren't the same character and how "The official Gundam wiki" states they are the same and so the page should remain as is. I replied that there's no such thing as "official Gundam wiki", only fans-operate ones. And as I noted, there is no official source ever state that they're the same character at all. Their next PM pull argument from ignorance that there's no proof that they aren't the same character beyond the statement from 6th episode. Again, I replied that Ericht being Suletta is the speculation itself and it was tolerant prior but now the show suggest that it might not be true. There's no further PM and the edit is still there.
So I did start the Edit War. My defense is that it's to remove Speculative Troping, although I realized it might not be obvious to a third party.
HoMM Fan
open Is this website tropeable?
I recently found The Grand List of Overused Science Fiction Clichés while wick cleaning Good People Have Good Sex... and I'm not sure this is actually tropeworthy.
The website itself has no tropes at all, and the subpages are just lists of common sci-fi cliches.
I wasn't sure the best spot to put this, so I took it here to ATT.
openAccidental edit war instigated by me
I was checking the history of Jekyll & Hyde and noticed that an entry on Pure Is Not Good where Hyde declares himself pure and Jekyll the true "Hyde" had been deleted 9 months ago: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Theatre.JekyllAndHyde#edit31680077
"He says "I am you", not "I am pure""
This is true of the Broadway recording, but in the 1994 version
◊ he does say
◊ "I am pure", which you can also hear
in the audio itself. Obviously this isn't true of every version (there's a lot) so I adjusted the deleted entry to clarify which recording it was while also adding more context to said entry, then re-added it when I was done. https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Theatre.JekyllAndHyde#edit34301267
Unfortunately I forgot that I had added the original entry back in 2017, which I'm pretty sure means that I did an edit war: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Theatre.JekyllAndHyde#edit17931303
I apologize for the accidental edit war on my part and accept full responsibility for anything that may occur as a result.
Edited by lalalei2001

The entry on Headscratchers.Incredibles 2 "Why isn't it called The Incredibles 2?" had the following entry:
After this, the discussion shifted to forum like conservation between posters on the purpose and merits of the Headscratchers answers and less on the actual question itself, which seems improper for Headscratchers.
Edited by costanton11