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resolved Technology Marches On example seems invalid
Minor spoilers for the movie ahoy.
On the Hard Candy Trivia page, it says:
"Technology Marches On: Hayley's inability to find porn in Jeff's apartment is seen as damning evidence. Today, she would just assume he watched it online."
Doesn't anyone reading this think "wait a minute?!". The movie is clearly set in the present day (2005 at the time). We see Hayley searching his unlocked computer. She then says to him (according to the shooting script and I remember her saying it in a very similar fashion in the movie itself):
So, obviously she thinks he can download his illicit material online, as anyone would logically presume he could in the well-into-the-internet-era of 2005. She finds a disc in the safe marked "Stuff" which highly implies that's precisely what he's hidden. There may also be physically printed photos of young girls which he took himself, but that's immaterial here. He also could have very well just "enjoyed" the material he found online without downloading it as a private stash. The point is, the second sentence of the example looks to be invalidated, thus invalidating the entire entry. There's no technology marching on here, it would play out exactly the same if the movie was to be released today (whether the safe's illegal material is stored on a CD, an SD card or whatever). Even if he wanted to encrypt it on his computer, that would have been about as feasible back then as today (read: pretty damn feasible), and the police (or Hayley) would still throw resources at it to decrypt it as actionable evidence.
Am I correct here? Or am I missing something?
Edited by FlashStepsresolved Should I put this into TRS?
I've been reading through Animated Shock Comedy and noticed that many of the examples tend to comment on its quality. Whether if it's gushing about the inclusion of character development, or discussing about negative or divided viewer reactions.
Examples in the page that show this:
- "Sausage Party has plenty of Character Development and a solid plot, but it still sold itself on being the first 3D computer-animated feature to get an R-rating. Viewers are divided on its quality, with some feeling that it tried too hard to shove crude humor into every available place it could find."
- "Hoops, another Netflix cartoon. The main character is a completely unlikable Jerkass, and the humor is very crass, with lots of dick jokes and extreme amounts of F-bombs from its VERY foul-mouthed protagonist. While jerkass protagonists are hardly rare in this genre, this one's sheer obnoxiousness garnered the show many negative reviews, and likely led to its swift cancellation."
- "A lot of the humor in Rick and Morty is extremely sophomoric, with phallic imagery, burp/fart jokes, pop culture references and violence galore; however, much like Bojack Horseman, it plays the consequences of a lot of these jokes completely straight for the sake of furthering the story and developing the characters, who even at their flattest are much more fleshed out and three-dimensional than a good deal of the show's contemporaries..."
Basically, I think the trope tends to attract both complaining and gushing that I think examples should be rewritten to be less YMMV.
What do you think?
Edited by RuckusHeartsopenUsers keep ignoring NREP rule regarding Harsher in Hindsight
A few days ago, a major controversy regarding the firing of a voice actor from SMG4 has resulted in some users putting an Harsher in Hindsight entry on this page.
On Feb 28th 2024 at 10:33:12 AM
, Luigi Kart DS added the following edit:
- There's a moment in "SMG4 Are You Okay?" where SMG4 enslaves a bunch of Toads to make content for him, and is cancelled when SMG3 exposes him. A year later, Glitch Productions found itself in hot water when numerous former employees spoke out about the work environment
.
Later that same day
, I removed it after consulting with the hindsight cleanup thread, because it was agreed that the controversy is still ongoing.
On Feb 28th 2024 at 11:22:49 PM
, Tropers/yoko6969 added a similar entry:
- One of the scene from "[1]" includes SMG 4 manipulating Toads to make videos, while SMG 3 is recording an "SMG 4 Exposed" video. Replace SMG 4 with Kevin, and we can get the main problem of Glitch Productions which is mismanagement from the CEO himself
.
Further edits were simply format fixes and did not remove the entry.
On Feb 29th 2024 at 3:10:49 PM
, I also removed that entry as well, citing that the event is still ongoing and thus an entry is not needed right now.
Later that same day
, Electric Logan also added an entry towards the ongoing controversy:
- One of the 2020 Collab skits had Boopkins be beaten up after his awful singing. That ends up being justified after his voice actor, Kevin, would be ousted for mistreating former employees, specifically animators, of Glitch Productions.
(To be clear, SMG 4 was not part of the allegations & is safe)
Needless to say, I think we should reprimand the users over here who keep adding entries towards an ongoing event while also ignoring the No Recent Examples, Please! rule and probably lock the page for good measure, since it's beginning to attract negative attention.
Edited by Siegfried1337resolved something wrong with the Baldur's gate 3 Origin Characters page? Videogame
Specifically this one. Checking the history of the page or the edit page, i can clearly see there is content here. But when i try to look at the page itself... it's blank.
resolved Moving character to a different page Literature
I'd like to move Shen Jiu's character profile from Characters.The Scum Villains Self Saving System Demon Realm And Other Characters over to Characters.The Scum Villains Self Saving System Four Main Sects. Currently he's just under Other Characters, but I think he should really be under the Qing Jing Peak section as he was literally the leader of said peak before his (presumed) death, at which point he exits the story. (I'm explaining this to clarify that there are no conflicting affiliations or anything so I don't know why he's been placed under Other Characters.) Am I allowed to go ahead and move him?
Edited by ZaperexopenWhere to put some LMM examples? Literature
Lucy Maud Montgomery's page
has a few examples from the Chronicles of Avonlea books. It's specified that all examples from books that have their own pages don't count. The thing is, the Chronicles books are explicitly in the world of Anne of Green Gables, even if Anne only makes a few cameos. So what do we do?
Option 1. Move the Chronicles examples from Maud's page to the Anne page and add a note to Maud's page listing all 11/12 (it's complicated) books in the Anne series, all three Emily books, etc.
Option 2. Split off all miscellaneous Maud short stories into their own page, including the Chronicles books, preserving Maud's page for the authoress herself and recurring tropes only.
openVisualNovel/VideoGame split on trope pages. Videogame
If I want to crosswick/add a Visual Novel example in a trope page and it doesn't have a Visual Novels folder or subpage, should I create it myself, or should I put the VN under Video Games?
In the case that the Video Games folder already contains some VNs, is it better to move them to a new Visual Novels folder, or to leave it like that and add my example there?
Edited by animuacidopenPage Revert for Lobo
Recently, the page for Characters.DC Comics Lobo (which used to focus just on Lobo) has been turned into a redirect for Characters.Lobo (which is for Lobo's supporting cast), presumably as part of the new policy regarding Character-Specific Pages.
However, it seems like the actual content for the former page was not moved at all, meaning there are absolutely no tropes listed for Lobo. His character folder links to his character page, but because of the redirect it now just links to itself.
Can I either a) get a page revert for Characters.DC Comics Lobo or b) just have the content that used to be on Characters.DC Comics Lobo moved to Characters.Lobo?
Edited by chasemaddiganopenFemale protagonist from P3P Videogame
So I was on the Persona 3 YMMV section and came across this entry, edited by Key Will Jay:
- The female main character herself is rather divisive. Some love her inclusion for providing an interesting "what if" scenario (and with the main theme of Portable being the butterfly effect, this also fits) and for her personality contrasting with the male main character while still keeping the "masking feelings" theme. They may also like how some of the less interesting Social Links get replaced with S.E.E.S. members. Others see her as unnecessary and believe she ruins the game's themes of overcoming despair and accepting death with said alternate scenario and personality, and dislike how SEES is made obviously friendlier in her route (a criticism fans of older titles sometimes level at newer titles in general). The memes and exposure surrounding her also induce Hype Backlash for non-fans and those that have played the console version but do not try Portable, calling her overrated. It was bad enough that when an alleged lead regarding a theoretical remake mentioned cutting out Portable content (which turned to be reality per the reveal of Reload), the fanbase split between those calling it a worst-case scenario and those celebrating the removal.
I’m not as active in the fandom but do people really fight over the female protagonist? Because I’ve never seen much divide over her. In fact, I’ve only seen people express their disappointment of her being excluded from Reload.
Edited by Superdude96resolved Start of an Edit War/Possible Sockpuppet? Western Animation
Hello! So I recently posted this in the "Is this an Example?" thread, and haven't really got replies, though they have been leaning to my side.
I found something that screams shoehorning from a biased source.
From the YMMV page of The Owl House:
- Broken Aesop: The Series Finale has two major ones;
- Earlier in the series, the show railed against the concept of a Chosen One, and said that people should carve out their own paths. Just before the climax however, it's revealed that the remnants of the dead Titan has been actively helping Luz in learning Magic and has picked her to be the one to stand up against Belos. Guess what? That makes her a fucking CHOSEN ONE!!!
- After Belos is defeated and no longer a threat, he starts begging for Luz to save him from death, saying that is she doesn't, she'll be just as "evil" as the witches, and "We're Human, we're better than this!", only for Eda and friends to push Luz aside, smugly say to Belos "Well we ain't!" and then gleefully stomp him to death and laugh, proving that despite everything the show preached, in his final moments, they proved that everything Belos said had some merit of truth to it.
Two huge problems with this. First, it's very clearly overly hostile and biased against the show judging by it's language, and attempting to whitewash Belos by suggesting he has a point. Secondly, both examples are taken completely out of context to form a rhetorical strawman. The first one isn't an example because she wasn't born with any special destiny. She only got the Titan's approval due to being her kind and loving self, especially to his son. The second is just plainly absurd. It's attempting to play moral judgement on some of the people who have suffered the most under the genocidal psychopath, when he had just made his second attempt to commit genocide against their species.
I took the liberty of removing the example from the YMMV page. Now that would be fine on it's own, even if I heavily disagree with it... If it weren't for this entry literally being a copy paste of something that was posted on the main page of the show which the troper Gamermaster removed. The weird part is that it was copy pasted onto the YMMV page by an entirely different user, and the first user has a total of two edits on their entire edit history, both of which are super hostile to modern Disney properties. Later on the person who posted it on the main Owl House page posted it right back on the YMMV page exactly as is without going to the "Is this an Example?" thread, and added further shoehorning. I removed those too... but now I am wondering if this is some sort of sockpuppeting situation due to the reasons listed above. At the very least it could warp into an Edit War.
openPosting a link to content you've created
Hi. I just recently published a video on YouTube
that provides comprehensive coverage of all the known Dub Name Changes, Sudden Name Changes, and Inconsistent Spellings of the LEGO Adventurers toyline. I had hoped for this to be a useful resource for LEGO fans and I was considering linking to it on the toyline's article and/or the characters subpage, i.e. "For more in-depth coverage of all alternate names and their original sources, see this video."
However, I get the impression that this might not be proper etiquette and could be perceived as shameless self-promotion, which is definitely frowned upon. On one hand: yes, I am promoting something I've made... but on the other hand, I'm only doing so because I want it to be a helpful resource for others, and what good is a resource if no one knows it exists? So, before I add any links to this video, I wanted to check with Ask The Tropers and see what's the right thing to do in this situation.
Edited by PeabodySamopen Sylviemations
Sorry if this isn't important, but Sylviemations seems to have a problem with laziness and getting other tropers to do the work for them. On this ATT query
, a few days ago, they asked why there wasn't a characters page for Numberblocks, and when I told them that there used to be one before it was cut for being a stub (read: having nothing but a load of empty folders), they complained that I cutlisted it instead of filling it out myself (despite me not being familiar with the work and only complying with the policy that we cutlist stub pages if no effort is made to improve them after the OP is notified). Multiple tropers tried to talk to them on the ATT thread, about how to create a page, policy on ZCEs, and the fact that pages need to have at least three non-ZCEs to stay. Then today, they created a page for the first time
...and it was a one-line stub that consisted entirely of the following sentence:
I’m too lazy to make this page someone else do it
resolved Using ChatGPT to help answer Headscratcher questions
Is it ok to directly cite answers generated by this program in answer to a question posed on a Headscratchers page? In this case, I had searched the work's wiki pages for relevant information, but it had nothing more to offer than the work itself. Furthermore, as it can be hard to do a granular search using a search engine for a very specific question like the one (for the work) I have in mind, and in the absence of any other troper stepping up (to date) to answer the question, AND as the answer appears to hold up (doesn't show any typical AI-anomalies or peculiar interpretations of the content), I don't think there's any harm to this approach?
Edited by FlashStepsresolved The Flash AudienceAlienatingPremise Issue
I'd like to report an edit war that's occurred in the YMMV page for The Flash (2023) over whether it qualifies for Audience-Alienating Premise. On January 28, Link Mario Samus removed the entry on the grounds that he felt it came across more as a Tainted by the Preview (due to the details mentioned having primarily more to do with meta and behind the scenes stuff than the actual premise itself). On January 29, Estvyk added it back under the claim that it's simply a case of Audience-Alienating Premise overlapping with Tainted by the Preview. Finally, on February 14, Link Mario Samus removed it again with an edit reason that could be interpreted as rude despite not necessarily being wrong. While I'll concede that I don't know if any discussion occurred between them via PM before or after any of this, I'm nonetheless reporting this edit war so that they can have the chance to come here to present their case.
openHow should I handle spoilering on my page? Web Original
Self-explanatory. I want to put ROYN as an example of media that uses certain tropes in their respective pages, but the format of the series makes it hard to handle this, so how should I handle this?
Edited by GammaRaulresolved There's something wrong with MagnificentBastard.WesternAnimation and MagnificentBastard.ComicBooks
Note: I already posted about this in the bug query
, but I didn't get any response, so I'm reposting it here in the hope that it will be noticed by someone and also made a few changes to the post.
A few days ago, the Sandboxes which are used to make changes MagnificentBastard.Western Animation and MagnificentBastard.Comic Books were swapped to their respective pages in order to make edits to them because they are locked.
However, it seems like something's wrong with the pages, as the changes shown within the edit history aren't reflected in the page source, causing there to be no changes to the pages themselves. For instance, an Error on MagnificentBastard.Western Animation that caused it's subpages to not be indexed is repeatedly
shown to
be fixed
in the edit history, but the Error is still on the main page itself.
From checking the history of these page, it seems like the issue started on December 17th, 2023 for the Comic Books page and on December 31st, 2023 for the Western Animation page.
If anybody notices other pages with the same problem, please leave them in the comment section. Furthermore, if somebody has an idea on what's causing the glitches to occur and/or how to solve this problem, please mention it in the comments so this issue can be resolved.
Edit: Moving this back to query bugs
Edited by jlvs200sopenWMG: guesses about 'meta' production elements?
Bringing this over from the WMG cleanup thread
:
It's well established that WMG shouldn't veer into Real Life Troping about musicians and other creators, but do we have a consensus view on 'meta' WMG, speculation about casting and production rather than about the work itself?
We've got a few WMG pages that speculate about these topics — which character an announced actor might be playing, which creative team will work on a comic or who might direct a sequel to the film.
Should these be in scope for WMG? Or is it purely for discussing the fictional elements of the work?

i was looking over the YMMV.Charlottes Web page (mainly trying to find an edit I made, but not important to this query), and noticed that the Ensemble Dark Horse example just simply listing Templeton and nothing else had been already back-and-forthed over by different users:
i was going to re-comment it out again, but i don't want to fumble myself into edit-warring over it...