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nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010
Fighteer MOD (Time Abyss)
2011-12-07 07:22:47

The Shout-Out page itself has this to say:

"In modern times, almost every larger film, video game and so on intentionally references some other work, making the phenomenon nearly omnipresent."

"Remember, a Shout Out is intentional. If a character just happened to use a similar turn of phrase to another work, that's just a coincidence."

Word of God is useful because it proves the intentional part. Anyone citing a Shout-Out example should be prepared to back it up with proof that it was intended.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
MagBas Since: Jun, 2009
MagBas Since: Jun, 2009
2011-12-14 08:50:36

Well, i am moving the quote of Fighteer to the thread.

tsstevens Since: Oct, 2010
2011-12-14 15:39:20

I personally list anything I think is either a rather nifty coincidence (like Kim having the same fashion sense as Buffy) or a clever Shout Out like Sam being Kim's boat pilot when she wears Sam Fisher's spy outfit. But that's just me.

Currently reading up My Rule Fu Is Stronger Than Yours
CaissasDeathAngel Since: Oct, 2010
2011-12-15 11:21:58

If it's a cooincidence, it's NOT a shoutout. By definition, a shoutout is deliberate. The difficulty is that it's not always possible to tell, but if it can be reasonably surmised that the same thing merely happened in two different works then it should not be listed.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.
tsstevens Since: Oct, 2010
2011-12-15 13:12:56

Okay. Another Kim Possible example: her ringtone is similar to the one heard in 24. That would probably qualify.

Currently reading up My Rule Fu Is Stronger Than Yours
eX Since: Jan, 2001
2011-12-15 17:50:38

No, it wouldn't. If it is a Shout-Out, it should be obvious, not just similar.

tsstevens Since: Oct, 2010
2011-12-16 02:41:57

Hmmm, okay...I see a lot of Shout Outs that are either well hidden or just coincidences, especially if we are to apply a hard and fast rule that they have to be blatant. For example Ripper (one of Archangel's crew in Mass Effect) is supposedly named after Giles in Buffy. So again if there was some type of guide then that would help lead to better examples.

Currently reading up My Rule Fu Is Stronger Than Yours
eX Since: Jan, 2001
2011-12-16 03:12:18

That is because Shout-Out is one of the most abused tropes, thanks to Fan Myopia. Fans tend to overestimate the popularity of a specific work, based on their knowledge of it, though most Shout Outs are indeed only coincidences.

For something to be a reference to something specific, the reference must be unique, or at least mainly associated with the work in question. In your Ripper example, Ripper is a way to generic word as that it could be a Shout-Out on its own, without any other similarities (the character in question in librarian, belongs to a secret organization or has a British accent).

Edited by eX
tsstevens Since: Oct, 2010
2011-12-16 04:35:16

Okay...one more, this time from Saints Row.

One mission has you hijacking a plane, then when it blows up you fight in mid air, in a tank. Just like The A Team. A Shout-Out? Or do we need the character saying "I love it when a plan comes together" to cement the reference?

Currently reading up My Rule Fu Is Stronger Than Yours
Fighteer MOD (Time Abyss)
2011-12-16 07:15:17

It would help. The question is whether they came up with that scene as a deliberate homage or simply because someone thought it would be cool. This is why Word of God is so useful.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
tsstevens Since: Oct, 2010
2011-12-16 10:40:01

I'm going to start doing a sweep of the site to work on what can legitimately be seen as a Shout-Out and what can't. I'll just take it slowly at first to gauge how it's accepted.

Currently reading up My Rule Fu Is Stronger Than Yours
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