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DracMonster Since: Jan, 2001
2015-10-02 05:19:27

Maybe the other person was confusing averted? Aversions aren't worth mentioned unless the trope is an expected part of the genre.

It'd be easier for us to judge if you linked to the specific example or posted it here.

GnomeTitan Since: Aug, 2013
2015-10-02 05:21:19

Did you do it like this:

or like this:

The first way is not the way it's supposed to be done (and could elicit the response "Subverted Trope is not a trope"). The second way is perfectly acceptable. The reason for this is that the reader is presumably interested in how the work treats Every Car Is a Pinto, regardless of whether it's subverted or played straight.

Edited by GnomeTitan
Morgenthaler Since: Feb, 2016
2015-10-02 06:45:20

Well, Subverted Trope is technically a Trope Trope, but listing all instances of subverted tropes as its own item in trope lists would be an organizational nightmare. I've heard that there also used to be folders with names like "Tropes used once", "Tropes that are subverted", etc., but they were all canned in favor of alphabetical lists and to just expand on the trope permutation.

You've got roaming bands of armed, aggressive, tyrannical plumbers coming to your door, saying "Use our service, or else!"
JapaneseTeeth Since: Jan, 2001
2015-10-02 07:09:12

@Gnome: Just to nitpick, I'm not sure that that specific example would be valid. A Subverted Trope is when a situation looks like a trope is going to play out, but doesn't. "The car doesn't catch fire" isn't a subversion of Every Car Is a Pinto, it's an aversion. A subversion would be if the driver dove for cover because he thought the car would catch fire, but it doesn't. So if that was the specific example we're talking about, I'd say they were right to remove it, though not quite for the right reason, namely that it isn't a subverted trope. But the statement that "Subverted Trope is not a trope", isn't quite accurate either. I'm pretty sure that listing them is valid because even though the trope doesn't actually happen, it's still being referenced by the work.

Subverted Trope: The work makes it look like the trope will happen, but it doesn't.

Averted Trope

Formatting-wise, the second method is correct.

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GnomeTitan Since: Aug, 2013
2015-10-02 07:58:31

^Yes, I know all that.

I was deliberately leaving out some assumptions, because I was addressing the point of how to list subverted tropes, not what a subverted trope is— which St Fan explicitly stated that they had studied carefully.

But just to make everything clear, the context I was leaving out was something like:

  • Every Car Is a Pinto: Subverted when Bob's car doesn't catch fire after the accident, even though every single one of the 72 car crashes we've seen earlier in the show led to spectacular explosions.

I left out that context because it is not relevant to the argument and would only serve to obscure my point.

Edited by GnomeTitan
Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010
2015-10-02 08:00:32

Here?

Then yeah, the problem is that it should have been:

Rather than:

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GnomeTitan Since: Aug, 2013
2015-10-02 08:07:19

To comment a bit further on why this is incorrect practice:

The fact that a work contains subverted tropes is not very interesting per se. More or less every work does (unless it's very predictable and clichéd). The interesting thing is that the trope Luminescent Blush is subverted, hence it should be listed under that.

Also, imagine how ridiculous it would be if we treated not just subversions like this, but all trope usage:

Edited by GnomeTitan
KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
2015-10-02 08:08:30

EDIT: Posted in wrong place

Edited by KingZeal
StFan Since: Jan, 2001
2015-10-02 09:57:44

I had actually put both examples on the page — the subverted trope on its entry, and a Subverted Trope entry. I can see it can be considered a bit redundant. To be precise, I put on the page My Little Pony: Equestria Girls – Friendship Games:

  • Subverted Trope: When Human Twilight gets to focus on Flash Sentry's face after he gives her back her glasses, you'd expect a Luminescent Blush to light her face, as has happened with Equestria's Twilight in the previous movies almost every time she interacted with Flash. But in truth, it's only the light of her magic-detecting device reflecting on her glasses (the purple glow looks like blushing on her lavender complexion). Indeed, for the rest of the movie, she completely ignores Flash.

From what you are saying here, giving those details under Luminescent Blush would be enough?

crazysamaritan MOD Since: Apr, 2010
2015-10-02 10:38:51

Correct

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
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