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WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
2024-10-20 11:51:40

Yeah, it's not kosher to delete examples like that based on a disagreement. As I often say with regards to UU and US specifically, we don't need to think the fans are right to report on their reactions.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
KrspaceT Since: Apr, 2011
2024-10-20 11:53:05

How would that work in regards to edit wars though? Like with an edit history as I described, if I had put it back on my own would that count as an edit war?

(I legit don't know)

WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
2024-10-20 11:55:57

I don't think it'd be an edit war? You didn't add the example; I think you're detached enough. But you may as well chill here for a bit to get consensus, and then re-adding is perfectly fine with a link.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
CanuckMcDuck1 Since: Sep, 2023
2024-10-20 12:29:50

Yeah, it seems like the user is taking the entry to heart and acting holier-than-thou about it in the edit reason. I think they could be re-added, because like it’s said elsewhere on TV Tropes, documenting doesn’t mean approving.

Do not mess with creatures which you do not understand.
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
2024-10-20 13:06:18

The entries they removed in question.

  • Unintentionally Sympathetic: Several readers have vocally expressed sympathy with Homura, and the unfair way that save for the likes of Naru Osaka, she is treated as as if she is evil for actions that were caused, by many viewers, as a result of mental torture, misunderstanding, and otherwise being far from the right state of mind in the original source. The fact that Kyubey, who is responsible for creating the conditions of Rebellion in the first place, is somewhat ignored to focus entirely on Homura further highlights this.
  • Unintentionally Unsympathetic: Sayaka's irrational, blind hatred that leads her to teaming up with a genocidal maniac hell bent on destroying everything because Homura... .makes them relive middle school days. In retaliations, she joins up with Joker, a morally depraved villain, who aims to bring about the end of everything, just to take revenge for Homura for trapping them in a loop of relative peace and happiness. Though this ends up subverted later on with the reveal she was faking it.
    • Fantine gets a mention for doing what exactly everyone condemns Homura for, without suffering any kind of repercussion for crippling an immensely helpful ally in Homura. And unlike Homura, she doesn't have the same Freudian Excuse of a Trauma Conga Line, making her look exactly as bad as almost everyone claims Homura is. Madoka would later call out Fantine for her hypocritical actions in Chapter 66. This makes Fantine have a Heel Realization that she is no different from Homura.

Fantine is valid as her calling out is an after the fact fix. Sayaka I don't know if it was after the fact so cut for now. Homura seems valid as written.

GastonRabbit MOD (General of TV Troops)
2024-10-20 13:32:46

That edit is from last month, and they received a notifier for deleting YMMV entries a week later.

Anyway, deleting YMMV examples because you disagree with them is against the rules, so go ahead and restore them, since it seems like this was just a matter of disagreement.

Edit: I just put them back myself from copying and pasting from the above post, aside from fixing the Example Indentation (since lone second-level bullet points aren't allowed).

Another edit: Also removed a stray period and removed Word Cruft.

Edited by GastonRabbit You can't just say "perchance".
KrspaceT Since: Apr, 2011
2024-10-20 13:49:20

Well that was simple. Rbook doesn't seem to come on site often so I don't think he'll respond here in all likelyhoods, the edit is back up, and now I have an answer about if an edit like that counts as an edit war or not to put back.

So, this case require anything more discussed?

Edited by KrspaceT
Theriocephalus Since: Aug, 2014
2024-10-20 18:25:57

Hmm. I could see why the entries as-written could be seen as taking a judgemental tone regarding the work's contents, though. I'm not familiar with the work, but the way they're written out seems to lean towards saying "this character's motivations are silly and superficial" instead of "fans feel that this character's motivations are silly and superficial". Especially this bit here-

Sayaka's irrational, blind hatred that leads her to teaming up with a genocidal maniac hell bent on destroying everything because Homura... .makes them relive middle school days. In retaliations, she joins up with Joker, a morally depraved villain, who aims to bring about the end of everything, just to take revenge for Homura for trapping them in a loop of relative peace and happiness.

-is definitely written as a way to communicate a specific personal judgement over how the work's characters behave, and if this is meant to say that the readership as a whole makes that judgement instead of the editor... then it's not really clear.

Rbook's edit was still inappropriate, but I'm not hugely surprised that someone would have a knee-jerk reaction here, since this is less reporting and more... well, editorializing, which we shouldn't do precisely because it leads to personal opinions or emotion getting tangled into things. I wouldn't mind seeing this reworded slightly to make it a bit more neutral.

Edited by Theriocephalus
WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
2024-10-20 19:24:29

I mean, that's often how UU examples are written. It's not great writing by any means, but you'd be hard pressed to find a lot of examples that don't seem judgmental, if only because negative reactions are inherently going to be judging the work. I don't mind trying for a rewrite, but it's not particularly bad by UU example standards.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
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