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WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
2022-08-07 13:38:09

I know Orchard is one of the writers of that fic, but do these videos actually influence the narrative, or is she just justifying their decisions? Because the YMMV page shouldn't just be "the creator said this is the right opinion".

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
2022-08-07 17:44:04

They were thought experiments using her work as an example. I assume misuse as it's not actually The Sith Resurgence being heavy handed in that regard but the separate videos.

miraculous (Apprentice)
2022-08-08 03:56:24

I also really dont like using the ends justify the means unironically on an entry?

Thats been the cause of tons of horrible things because someone thinks their right.....

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
StarSword Since: Sep, 2011
2022-08-08 10:35:50

^Yeah, no kidding. That example should probably be changed to Author Filibuster or something of that nature.

Trust me, I'm an engineer!
WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
2022-08-08 10:40:16

Yeah, exactly. It's a misuse of the trope and just assumes that because the creator said it, it's correct.

Edit: So, on a hunch I dug into the history and this example has weird history. One version of it without the links was posted by morpmorp, who if anyone remembers, was suspected to be Lily Orchard or at least a meatpuppet. Then that was deleted in TRS cleanup, only for this new example to be added by riddlerfan a few days ago, a relatively new account, but with this being the only entry that really feels "off" to me. So... yeah.

Edited by WarJay77 Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
miraculous (Apprentice)
2022-08-08 14:26:02

Can we get an IP check than?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
2022-08-08 14:55:41

If you want. I'm not fully convinced that Riddlerfan is actually related to the Lily Orchard drama, but it is always a bit odd when a new account does something like that as one of their first edits, ya know?

We could also just message them and ask why they added that example, but ya know, if they're ban evading or something they wouldn't admit it...

Edited by WarJay77 Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
StarSword Since: Sep, 2011
2022-08-08 15:11:04

As long as we're talking about that page, this example for Anvilicious also probably needs to go:

  • Anvilicious: Holdo and Aliana both agreeing that even if there is light left in Kylo Ren, they aren't obligated to reach out to him on that basis alone, and that even if he were to redeem himself, someone would likely kill him for his past actions regardless, is a rather blatant effort by the author to write off a character, they personally dislike, as a lost cause.
This is more describing Take That, Scrappy! than something related to An Aesop.

Trust me, I'm an engineer!
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
2022-08-08 15:25:22

^I question if Take That, Scrappy! can apply to those the author personal dislike but are otherwise too popular to count.

I already PM'd them letting them know SANTBD is no longer a thing. I haven't heard anything back.

That also added Unintentionally Unsympathetic to the page (I cut it as misuse, failing to state how the character was supposed to be sympathetic), so there's that.

nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010
2022-08-08 15:49:20

"If you want. I'm not fully convinced that Riddlerfan is actually related to the Lily Orchard drama, but it is always a bit odd when a new account does something like that as one of their first edits, ya know?"

If we're dealing with a page that has already attracted possessiveness from the author through a meatpuppet, I think an extra degree of suspicion is warranted. I agree that an IP check is a good idea.

StarSword Since: Sep, 2011
2022-08-08 16:38:51

^^First similar Audience Reaction name I could think of. 🤷‍♀️ I'll grant it isn't an exact fit: the fic was clearly written by somebodies who disliked the sequel trilogy in general, but Kylo Ren being a cruddy villain is one of the more frequently cited criticisms. But my main point is that the example it isn't exactly hammering home An Aesop so much as how much the authors dislike the canon character. So, cut? Y/N

Trust me, I'm an engineer!
riddlerfan Since: Jul, 2022
2022-08-08 16:49:55

Hey everyone! I'm not directly related to Lily drama, but I did watch those videos and I thought that they applied. The reason for that is that YMMV is a place in which different interpretations of a trope by the fandom can be discussed, and if the comments on the video are any indication, many readers of the fanfic liked the moral. I will accept judgement on the entry being removed but I have a question: why aren't the videos accepted in YMMV? I thought it would be similar to an interview in which the author talks about their intentions with her work, Lily talks about how her views on morality are very important to her fanfic and so I thought that they could be used to represent the point that this is the way the moral is handled in her work

WarJay77 (Troper Knight)
2022-08-08 16:55:19

The example was bad because it didn't even explain it from an audience reaction standpoint, it just said "Lily Orchard said this", and putting on the YMMV page implies that the creator's opinion is the fact about how we should feel.

Well, that and Some Anvils Need to Be Dropped isn't a trope anymore...

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
riddlerfan Since: Jul, 2022
2022-08-08 16:57:01

Oh yeah, I understand SANTBD not being a trope anymore

Thank you for answering, will keep this in mind. Sorry for the trouble!

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