TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Doesn't fit with the Elemental Power titles: Dark Is Edgy

Go To

SomeSortOfTroper Since: Jan, 2001
#201: Nov 17th 2010 at 10:00:57 AM

How long has Casting a Shadow on there? Please tell me three days.

shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#202: Nov 17th 2010 at 10:13:22 AM

Less than 24 hours.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Wulf Gotta trope, dood! from Louisiana Since: Jan, 2001
Gotta trope, dood!
#203: Nov 17th 2010 at 10:16:59 AM

Did...did we ever decide to split Shadow from Darkness?

They lost me. Forgot me. Made you from parts of me. If you're the One, my father's son, what am I supposed to be?
shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#204: Nov 17th 2010 at 10:21:34 AM

I think that's supposed to be the next crowner but we can only link one at a time.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
RhymeBeat True colors from Eastern Standard Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
silver2195 Since: Jan, 2001
#206: Nov 19th 2010 at 6:22:57 AM

How do you move a page?

Currently taking a break from the site. See my user page for more information.
Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#207: Nov 19th 2010 at 6:39:36 AM

Copypasta the old one onto the new page, then do the same with the old pages subpages. Then go through all the wiks and change them to the new page. After everything is done, turn the old page into a redirect.

Fight smart, not fair.
SomeSortOfTroper Since: Jan, 2001
#208: Nov 19th 2010 at 9:47:29 AM

I find it easiest to just do it in this order:

  • On this thread, open up the old page on a new tab.
  • "View" source on the original. Ctrl-A the page.
    • go back to the normal view
  • From this thread, open up the new name from the crowner, to make sure you have the right spelling and order.
  • Edit the page and ctrl-v the text in.
  • From the old name, open up the indices, subpages, discussion and "related to" list.
    • Change the indices first. Then use the info from the subpages and discussion to tranfer them over.
    • Set the old name to redirect.
    • Then fix the wicks.

I'm going to ask a mod to lock the crowner. There's quite a few wicks so the thread should probably stay open. This may also be the best place to talk about the split since we can see how things are being used as we go over the wicks.

edited 19th Nov '10 10:14:06 AM by SomeSortOfTroper

Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#209: Nov 19th 2010 at 9:57:40 AM

Crowner has been locked and unhooked. Holler if/when you want a new one hooked.

Deboss I see the Awesomeness. from Awesomeville Texas Since: Aug, 2009
I see the Awesomeness.
#210: Nov 19th 2010 at 10:07:16 AM

Minor note, it's ctrl+v not p. Ctrl+p is print screen.

Fight smart, not fair.
SomeSortOfTroper Since: Jan, 2001
#211: Nov 19th 2010 at 10:24:17 AM

No clue what you're talking about.

I'm against a "darkness" "shadow" split. I haven't kept up with the discussion well but they aren't even very well differentiated terms scientifically, never mind in story telling, metaphors and elemental thematics. I mean hey, how are we going to deal with translated works where you can't be sure which they were calling it originally. The only wick I fixed was about the yami-yami fruit from One Piece. The guy can manipulate gravity and it's One Piece- least likely dub agreement ever.

If there is any basis for a split, it would be in finding a set of abilities and another set of abilities that form two orthogonal classes. Some people get to pick from group A or group B, very little crossover occurs and you can find that group A gets labelled darkness, in a sense distinct from shadow, and so forth. "Darkness" and "shadow" manipulation don't mean so mcuh themselves. They normally enact themselves by e.g. big grasping shadow hands.

edited 19th Nov '10 10:27:35 AM by SomeSortOfTroper

shimaspawn from Here and Now Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: In your bunk
#212: Nov 19th 2010 at 10:30:02 AM

No, we aren't splitting Darkness and Shadow. We're splitting Evil from Darkness/Shadow.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Rhatahema Since: Sep, 2010
#213: Nov 19th 2010 at 2:16:26 PM

[up][up] Not that this needs to be the final draft, but here is the post outlining how I think the page should be split.

Again, I'd like to push for a soft-split before we vote on a definite split. The argument against the split is that these two tropes overlap as often as they're used, so we need to determine if that's the case. When I sorted the page myself, I found it was easy to pick out examples of only shadow manipulation, but that many other examples were harder to classify, since the examples didn't elaborate on the nature of the "dark" energy or how it was used. It'll take a group effort to classify these examples.

edited 19th Nov '10 2:17:36 PM by Rhatahema

Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#215: Nov 19th 2010 at 9:13:34 PM

Evil and shadow are always lumped together in games under "Dark" "Darkness" or "Shadow" element (Is there any game that has both as differing elements?). Since this is an elemental trope I think it should stay as is.

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
Rhatahema Since: Sep, 2010
#216: Nov 19th 2010 at 11:28:36 PM

[up] While shadows and negative/dark/unholy energy may be classified as the same element in many video games, this isn't a video game exclusive trope. There are plenty of examples of shadow manipulation in other media that have nothing to do with the "dark" element.

If we split Negative Energy from Shadow Manipulation, they can still both be listed under the Darkness element on Elemental Powers (which I think communicates your point that they are often lumped together).

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#217: Nov 19th 2010 at 11:46:20 PM

Can someone soft-split it so we can see if we need to hard-split it? (Assuming we can get any meaningful division between "negative energy," "shadows," and unclassified Dark Elemental.)

edited 19th Nov '10 11:47:16 PM by Ramidel

Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#218: Nov 20th 2010 at 1:34:41 AM

The very existence of the Dark Is Not Evil trope implies we should split it.

Raso Cure Candy Since: Jul, 2009
Cure Candy
#219: Nov 20th 2010 at 1:54:22 AM

Still its all about the element itself, not where it comes from. Only one trope gets listed on the Elemental Powers page as its element's main page and then the rest branch off as subtropes.

Soft split maybe but breaking it up will just lead to a mess and more confusion with Black Magic.

edited 20th Nov '10 2:01:05 AM by Raso

Sparkling and glittering! Jan-Ken-Pon!
Cider The Final ECW Champion from Not New York Since: May, 2009 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
The Final ECW Champion
#220: Nov 20th 2010 at 12:02:23 PM

Light The Way to Darken-The-Mood.

Well if dark is edgy, then you know, death, low visibility, energy absorption, are kind of moody? No? I guess Casting a Shadow is good enough.

edited 20th Nov '10 12:04:23 PM by Cider

Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#221: Nov 29th 2010 at 1:36:56 PM

[up][up][up] Yeah, but -any- of these can theoretically be used in a Dark Is Not Evil sense. Including Hellfire, Deals With The Devil and The Power Of Pain.

ExpiryBot Since: Dec, 1969
#222: Jan 12th 2011 at 11:04:07 AM

This thread expired after 60 days of inactivity.

Add Post

Total posts: 221
Top