Doom

Plot Twist: the people behind Doom secretly watch porn movies for the plot.

You can always check out the Doom Bible. Juicy plot and character details!

Tom Hall originally wanted developed plot and setting and characters but John Carmack and John Romero disagreed and they won in the end, firing him in mid 1993. Shame really.

There were attempts throughout years to make a Doom Bible WAD but nobody succeeded. There's Doom Delta but that's just gameplay stuff.

Tom Hall's characters would live on in Rise of the Triad

Of course then Romero would make Daikatana which tried to have its own plot. Which was oen of its many issues.

Daikatana was a case study of why sometimes having a soulless publisher demanding results and putting their foot down isn't always a bad thing.

It's funny how much Doom (2016) reminds me of John Wick in some ways. A series where I really appreciate the action and the violence and the world building, but find the constant dick sucking of the main lead by the other characters to be grating and tiresome.

I am not sure what to make of that last part you said so I'm not gonna bother.

Also on John Romero, give him credit, he grew humble and better over the years.

I wonder what does John Carmack think of reboot and Eternal, since John Romero and Tom Hall appreciate and approve of the direction.

I am really, really curious about the story DL Cs which will feature new perspectives and gameplay changes. I can see a survival horror involving a normal UAC employee or scientist hiding from demons.

The possibilities... and if they do well enough, even more. I can see a What If? take on Doom Bible. Four marines enjoying a game of poker before it all goes to shit.

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 6:44:10 PM

Is it really so weird to adore everything about Doom aside from how it treats the main character?

That he's a demon killing machine...? Duh. Demons revere him and are scared of him. Aside from that, by time you wake up on Mars, everyone is dead except Olivia and Hayden.

Hayden shows respect but he still screws you over and very much disapproves of your methods. Not that it matters, his tampering with Crucible had severe consequences and he's in shambles... either by DS or someone else, that remains to be seen.

In Eternal there could be that "constant dick sucking" but from Phobos scene they all show massive fear of DS and stay the fuck out of his way. Dude just wants to kill demons and save mankind after Heavens decided he's a lost cause.

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 7:12:11 PM

What I mean is the characters going out of their way to remind you of how badass the Doom Slayer is. The logs in hell felt especially egregious for this.

What logs? Slayer's Testaments? They are showing genuine fear and respect for someone thoroughly pissed off. In case you forgot, Seraphim did bless DS with even more strength, power and endurance. It does explain his near infinite stamina, especially after he wakes up after so long.

Not sure how everyone at UAC does the same as well. Like really not sure. What characters going out their way? Hayden? Hayden knew about DS and what he's capable of, which is why he led the expedition to get the sarcophagus to Mars UAC facility.

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 7:31:27 PM

Yes, the Slayer's testaments. Reverence and fear, especially coming from demons, translates to the audience playing as "badass".

It's frustrating that I love the game, but because I don't like this aspect of the game it sounds like I hate the whole thing.

Edited by GNinja on Jun 15th 2019 at 5:32:26 PM

Which again I am trying to wrap my head around it. You take issue he's a true One-Man Army? Same was in the original.

He really did drive them to the brink of extinction until they dropped an entire temple of him. And they really knew better than to wake him up, which is why they fought ferociously hard when Hayden and soldiers came for the sarcophagus.

Now that Heaven is involved in sequel, I wonder how it will evolve.

I take issue with how the one man army nature of him doesn't just speak for itself. I don't need long epic speeches pontificating about how terrifying the Doom Slayer is. The forces he's facing don't really get any speeches putting them over like that. I want to buy that the forces of hell are powerful and awesome.

Now, one could say "Well, look at what hell actually does. We see how powerful they are." But, we see how powerful the Doom Slayer is too, but he ALSO gets the epic speeches talking about how scary he is.

It's also completely optional and you can walk away and not listen to the speeches if you don't desire to do so. Nobody is forcing you to listen to them (or read in logs)

And fyi it's not like in John Wick where the characters will shill the character on screen and force you to skip. Once again: completely optional here in game, freely ignore those stones.

It just establishes some things about demons and how they perceive DS as well. It nicely established what he did before he woke up from eons of being inside a coma. He really did drive demons to near extinction, which is nice. It's just additionally a piece of lore... I will say this, it's sad they didn't actually show DS battling the Hell's Mightiest Titan. I'd love a prequel DLC with it as the boss.

Again, what's the issue exactly? I am serious

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 7:44:35 PM

It's mainly that I want the forces of hell to be a worthy, dangerous foe. Not just in the gameplay (which they are because the game can be really challenging), but in the storyline too. I feel the game puts a lot of emphasis on the power and unstoppability of the Doom Slayer. Which is frustrating when I'm playing a game where I want to feel like I'm fighting an enemy that's worth a damn.

Edited by GNinja on Jun 15th 2019 at 5:45:28 PM

You came to the wrong game then, you're expecting something different than what it is.

And again, I think you're deliberately missing out the part where the temple was dropped on him and trapped him inside a sarcophagus. The demons are going across many realms and in Eternal... invasion of Earth happened. Look at it. Billions dead, it's a bonafide Hell on Earth

It would be egregious if Doom Eternal happy ending, demons are all dead, DS and Heavens are partying and all that crap. No. That's not gonna happen. Story's still not done

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 7:54:06 PM

but the game IS genuinely hard. From a gameplay standpoint it achieves the feeling I wanted of being up against a powerful force.

I LOVE THE GAME! I need to repeat that.

I didn't ignore the part where he's sealed away. I disliked how fans read that scene as an act of cowardice rather than cunning.

Cowardice? Guess there's always first time hearing for everything.

As for game being hard... maybe, maybe not. You get eventually used to skills and can trivialize stuff. With upgrades for weapons you make threats jokes which annoys me. I watched a Nightmare walkthrough by Patolog TV and he made a joke out of the difficulty. Such skill... it's beautiful.

Also to add: in Doom 64, Doomguy stays in Hell, vowing to never let any demon rise again after beating Mother Demon.

They really should increase demon count by four to ten times, like OG Doom.

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 8:17:10 PM

I mean.. literally any game can be made to look effortless if you get really good at it. That doesn't change the fact that the game is legit challenging on higher difficulty modes.

Maybe. What if you get Rich Get Richer rune and Armored Offensive? As long as you have 100 or above armor points, you have infinite ammo.

Chainsaw is utterly broken because if you use it against a Baron, you neutralize a high tier enemy without effort. There's also ammo drops it provides! Fuel isn't too rare either.

Plasma Rifle's stun bomb is also horribly broken as well and can stun everything except bosses.

Super Shotgun is also horribly broken when you unlock final upgrade, shooting one shell with power of two!

Not using any of it is willingly imposing challenge on yourself rather than "game's so tough, you need all of these just to make a slight difference".

Sure, upgrades are fun but I feel game doesn't adapt/change to choosing such upgrades.

These are some serious oversights I hope they take into consideration for Doom Eternal.

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 8:42:09 PM

I would like to point out that at this point DS is a personal witness to not one, not two, but several demonic invasions, especially with the implication that he is the same guy from OG Doom. The lore doesn't exactly make it clear, but the possibility is always nice.

The forces he's facing don't really get any speeches putting them over like that. I want to buy that the forces of hell are powerful and awesome.

So that's your villain guy side talking again, basically; you don't like the Doomslayer being played up as The Dreaded because you feel it decredibilizes the forces of Hell as villains. But here's the thing: the forces of Hell, in this universe... just aren't interesting villains. They're just Always Chaotic Evil monsters to kill and fight. And we don't need to hear about how fearsome they are because of course they are, they're fucking demons! the incarnation of evil. If you want a big compelling antagonist, that's literally the worst game to go to.

The Doomslayer, on the other hand, his entire concept is that you're playing as what Demons fear, and that's what makes him compelling as the protagonist.

What Theo said.

This is honestly the wrong game to go to if you don't want the mc to be an immortal Demon Slaying badass.

You can clamor for an AU in which the roles are reversed or something. I remember Hugo Martin, game's director of reboot and Eternal said, it's supposed to be a power fantasy in which you revel in being badass and killing demons.

I feel like you can fit that criticism on Doom 3 better because the mc marine there, unlike DS, is supposed to be a rookie who just got to Mars but somehow he gets the hang of demon killing and in the end kills Hell's Mightiest Warrior. DS on other hand has years and years and years of experience. Thinking about it, it can be also applied to original Doom but you already start the game with a pistol after being reassigned to Mars after Doomguy assaulted his superior and game is definitely not piss easy as Doom 3 was.

Argent D'Nur still fell, during that time he might've been a young rookie. He might've gotten himself almost killed many times but proved he's got what it takes, experiencing all sorts of shit and Seraphim blessed him for his efforts against the demon hordes.

Edited by Dhiruxide on Jun 15th 2019 at 9:30:49 PM

Was he a rookie, though? There's an in-universe theory that he's the leader of the Night Sentinels at least, IIRC.

And if he was a rookie in the Night Sentinels, wouldn't he be wearing the same armour as his knight-brothers?

...shit. I forgot some details, I think it was meant to be up to intepretation? Maybe he did wear but what about the unnamed wretch who made him the hell-forged armor?

I gotta check codexes again.