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Rogue7 Squad Leader
Squad Leader
Jul 6th 2009 at 8:49:58 AM

Boy, you did better than me, social link-wise, probably because I was really bad about doing the whole "have a persona of the corresponding arcana to the S-link" thing at first. Will most likely Max Naoto, maxed all the rest of the teammate S-links, Sun (drama), Strength (Soccer), and Devil. I kinda feel like the writers half-assed most of Sayoko's link in the later parts.

It's hard for me to determine who exactly an MC who I haven't guided would go for, seeing as I see him almost as an Afghan Cop. (or whatever the trope for the faceless protagonist is). For me, personally, Yukiko hits just about everything I find attractive in real women, but I can see the appeal of all the girls to someone with different tastes than myself. If I go through and maybe try to play the MC as someone like Kamina, maybe I'd go for Chie, but it'd be hard to dissociate the MC from myself.

My Blog thing
Jul 6th 2009 at 8:50:55 AM

@dkellis: *shrug*

I filled out the compendium my first playthrough, so I don't really know.

Rogue7: AFGNCAAP is what you're looking for. Not the troper.

edited 6th Jul '09 8:51:56 AM by Theoneknownasme

Jul 6th 2009 at 8:57:33 AM

So now I need to grind for levels and money to make sure I've fused the Personae I've unlocked.

Basarin The Lurkabout from Seoul, South Korea
The Lurkabout
Jul 6th 2009 at 5:18:58 PM

Cripes, you people work fast. I only just got past the Void Quest. (not having access to the PS 2 every day doesn't help matters) That being said, though, I practically fell out of my chair after seeing both what the Void Quest actually was and who the boss was. That boss easily made my day right there and then (right until I Mindcharged/Agidyne'd him to death).

Quick question for you all: how often does Igor make an accident when you're fusing Personas? And when he does, are they good combinations or bad ones? I forget the name of it, but Igor made an accident at one point on one of my fusions, and I got this star monster with a single eye in the center of the Fool arcana with really nifty spells (though unfortunately, it's also a case of "No! Bludgeoning/stabbing/slashing! My only weakness!").

I'll find something relevant to put here someday.
Rogue7 Squad Leader
Squad Leader
Jul 6th 2009 at 5:21:56 PM

Ouch, weak to physical. That'd be pretty much useless in my book. So far, it's happened to me once, though. I think I got a cheetah-dude- Ose, I think it was. Forget what I was aiming for.

And I found This link, which has shittons of cool art.

My Blog thing
Jul 6th 2009 at 6:09:15 PM

Honestly, he only made one mistake with me. Unfortunately, I was fusing something fairly innocuous at the time, and was completely unprepared for what I ended up with. . .

It was Legion. Still gives me the shudders.

EDIT: Also, the above link is awesome, but there's (potentially) massive spoilers, so don't look if you trying to avoid that.

edited 6th Jul '09 6:13:18 PM by Theoneknownasme

Basarin The Lurkabout from Seoul, South Korea
The Lurkabout
Jul 6th 2009 at 9:16:25 PM

To be fair, while he is weak to physical, he has skills that triples the physical damage avoidance rate, and has Tetra-something or other that blocks one physical attack; plus, he has agidyne and other nifty spells. Agreed in that he's a very situational persona to use, and I'd rather use Black Frost even though he's almost capped out his skill list.

On another note: while I know that the MC has the "wild card," you really, REALLY have to wonder how messed up his mind is if he's able to procure all that by playing Tetris with his soul...

I'll find something relevant to put here someday.
Jul 6th 2009 at 10:36:44 PM

Fusion accidents: five times so far. Two of them were in a row. The results were Ose (cheetah-swordsman guy, Fool arcana), Decarabia (starfish guy, Fool arcana), Narasimha (another feline-type swordsman-dancer guy, Sun arcana), Shiki-Ouji (white papier-mache-looking guy, Fool arcana), and Garuda (orangey bird guy, Star arcana).

The two-in-a-row were Shiki-Ouji and Garuda, when I was trying to get... I forget, I think it was Ananta (multi-headed snake guy, Fortune arcana). Since I already had Shiki-Ouji and Garuda by then before the fusion accidents, I reset the game and tried again. (Also, I definitely don't re-register the accidents. Like the Decarabia one.)

Usually, though, I leave the accidents be, since they usually come about after several other successful fusions which took me a stupidly long time to get the desired skills on. I can't say whether they're "good" accidents or "bad" ones, since they could have been useful in other circumstances; they're just not what I want right now. I use them for further fusion fodder, usually.

I did learn that when you get a fusion accident, apparently the accident still keeps the inherited skills you were going for, so it's not all bad. I don't know what happens if they can't learn the skills, since I usually try to keep Resist/Null Physical and some sort of heal.

edited 6th Jul '09 10:44:37 PM by dkellis

Jul 7th 2009 at 1:05:22 AM

Just had another fusion accident: wanted Masakado, got Atavaka. Which I already had.

I think the game hates me.

Basarin The Lurkabout from Seoul, South Korea
The Lurkabout
Jul 7th 2009 at 1:36:36 AM

You got to love the other ways the game shows exactly how much it hates the player. For example, the dreaded silver lump request you get from the student in the practice building. I could go back to Rise's dungeon and grind until I find it again, but I just can't be bothered. I'll do it next playthrough. Then again, any request that asks you to find a particular item in a dungeon, the game seems to go out of its way to make sure you never see it again.

And yeah, it was Decarabia. I forget who I was fusing together, but the end result was a very nice mixture of Agidyne, resistances to physical damage, and my first "almighty" damage dealing spell. I've since used him to try and pass on that spell to other personas.

I'll find something relevant to put here someday.
Jul 7th 2009 at 5:51:08 AM

Decarabia is kind of a special case: Margaret needs one with Makarakarn (or whatever it's called), the skill which reflects magic one time. I remember this because the physical equivalent is Tetrakarn, which Decarabia learns naturally.

So if I get it in a fusion accident, no matter how awesome the spells it gets are, chances are it doesn't have Makarakarn, and so I don't bother registering it.

But yes, the game does hate me. I just lost six of my Homunculi when two Mahamaons in a row from a boss hit all three of my party members both times. (The MC has Repel Light, but the boss has Null Light anyway.)

I'm currently trying out the auto-levelling trick, with the MC alone against the hordes of disturbing naked silver babies with flowers on their heads. Led by a guy in a king's robe and a handlebar moustache.

This game can take some weird forms.

EDIT: Also, the surefire way to get a particular enemy to show up: post on a forum complaining that you can't find it.

I was about to do so when I couldn't find one of the Table enemies for the girl needing Lumber, but Googling revealed that someone had already done this, for exactly this reason. I read the post (on the Gamespot forums), laughed, and continued playing the game.

Guess which enemy was the very next one I met.

edited 7th Jul '09 5:53:52 AM by dkellis

Jul 7th 2009 at 10:20:09 AM

Auto-levelling has gotten me to level 97, which I think is probably enough to survive the final boss. I've fused almost all the Personae I can, but I'm left with a measly 75k in cash. I need to get more. (Yes, I've sold everything I can.)

Maybe I can try going through all the old dungeons again, on Rush. I remember the cash inflow being kind of constant throughout the game.

Jul 7th 2009 at 10:26:48 AM

97 is more than enough to finish the game. I think I was only at level 92, 93

 * before I finished.

As for money, yeah, grind some more, sell stuff, do whatever you want to do. The enemies drop more money in the later dungeons, but it's easier to go through the earlier ones. And stuff sells well enough no matter what dungeon you're in.

edited 7th Jul '09 10:28:24 AM by Theoneknownasme

Jul 7th 2009 at 10:35:55 AM

The guides say that the minimum level to finish and not die horribly is 75, while anecdotes from other who've played the game say 80 and above is safe. I just wanted to get Lucifer (level 93, incidentally) into the compendium, but needed both levels (which the auto-levelling took care of) and money (for the Personae to fuse) to do so.

I also haven't fused a few other Personae, but I think I can get at least a couple of them from older dungeons: Queen Mab and Leanan Sidhe. I also haven't fused Tam Lin (never got the chance to), and not finishing Moon and Hanged Man means I can't fuse Sandalphon and Attis. Therefore, no 100% compendium completion this run-through.

Rogue7 Squad Leader
Squad Leader
Jul 7th 2009 at 5:42:21 PM

I was going to max Naoto's link before beating the "normal" boss, but decided "screw it, I'm bored as hell. I'll get it next time." And went to fight him. The first guy went down like a chump. I was dealing with the second one, and he casts debilitating fog and starts buffing. I obviously counterbuff, and when I see that he uses mind charge, start casting reflecting spells and using the items, figuring it'd be better than blocking. Didn't work, I died like a chump. Pissed me off, it did.

My Blog thing
Jul 8th 2009 at 3:32:57 AM

Due to some bad choices early on, I didn't have a lot of status buffing or debuffing spells by that boss, so my habit upon seeing Mind Charge is to guard. I've wasted a lot of turns and opportunities that way, but at least I haven't died.

Finally finished what I could of the compendium (at 98%, missing Sandalphon and Attis), and went through one of the later dungeons for some extra cash. Ended up with about 250k, which I hope is enough to tide me over in New Game+.

I like the ending slightly more than P3, since it's actually happier. More than everyone forgetting everything they've gone through as the MC dies, anyway.

For the next round, I think I'll grab Helel, Lucifer, and Yoshitsune for my workhorse Personae. Since I don't need to raise my social-stats, I can work on either getting more cash through part-time jobs, finish off my Social Links earlier, or go fishing to complete that last damn cat-feeding side-quest.

Random: it's probably utterly impractical in Real Life, but dammit, the Velvet Limousine is pimp.

edited 8th Jul '09 3:41:58 AM by dkellis

Rogue7 Squad Leader
Squad Leader
Jul 8th 2009 at 7:02:10 AM

So last night I went back and did a little bit of grinding- not really because I thought I needed it, but because I wanted some of my Personas to learn various skills- Surt needed Null Ice to eliminate a weakness, Sigfried needed God's Hand, and Loki needed Niflheim. In the process I gained a few levels and found a Gale Pin for Yosuke. another 40% boost to his wind attacks. Which means he's got a grand total of 115% boost, and everything he looks at that doesn't resist just kinda dies. Yukiko, with her higher magic stat and 75% boost, is also good at this.

So the boss (who I call the Eye-Death Star.) was really easy after that. That beam he used didn't hurt much more than your average attack, maybe because I got a chance to debuff him before he attacked and made sure to have rakukaja up. Saved right before the normal ending and got that one. I wish I had a big group of friends who'd run down the platform saying goodbye when I'm gonna be back up there in two friggin months.

My Blog thing
Basarin The Lurkabout from Seoul, South Korea
The Lurkabout
Jul 8th 2009 at 7:02:23 AM

Agreed; Igor knows how to appear in style. Plus, he's pretty much set for an all-out booze binge, judging by the cabinets...

Just got to the underground lab (which feels very retro for some reason), and I've been leveling my characters; I make it a general rule to be within three levels of the boss of the dungeon, and I try to spread out the experience gains as much as I can. I passed on Decarabia's Megido spell to another Persona; while that thing drains SP quickly, it really packs a punch. I also try to make sure that most of my Personas have the group buff spells (at least the defense one), but in doing so, I can easily spend up to an hour in the Velvet Room trying to get the right skills passed on...

I'll find something relevant to put here someday.
Jul 8th 2009 at 9:48:37 AM

When I first encountered the big eyeball thing, my first reaction was "didn't I last see you in Okami?"

It's interesting what my priorities turn into during the early stages of the second run: I kept getting antsy during the early fights because I didn't have access to the Persona Compendium and the awesomeness of Helel and Lucifer. (I also got Trumpeter, since he's the first cheapest Persona I remember with Cool Breeze.) Now that I have them, battles turn into "hit triangle to Rush and wait a bit". (Unless the enemies are immune to Physical, in which case I have to actually start thinking.)

And considering how much trouble I had the first time around against Yukiko's Shadow, this time I specifically geared up for it... which probably explained why it took only two rounds to defeat the Shadow this time. (Persona: Lucifer. First round Mind Charge, second round Bufudyne.)

Summoning Helel, Lucifer, and Trumpeter pretty much wiped out my New Game+ starting funds. I'm leaving my Null/Repel Physical Persona (can't decide between Yoshitsune, which has better abilities, or Rangda, which does the basic job cheaper) until I can actually afford it.

I also wish that I had thought of doing a liveblogging/liveforuming of my first play-through. I'm noticing all the little things from the beginning of the game now. For example, I kind of missed how the first few days of Persona 3 showed your future social links going through their daily lives.

I'm experiencing a minor form of what I call Visual Novel Route Regret, for the Sun and Strength social links: I can only take one of the two paths, which means that I cannot take the other path. Therefore, while I now have a chance to help solve Kou's problems, my prior meta-game knowledge of Daisuke's woes is going to nag at me as the game progresses. Simply speaking, by helping one route, I'm dooming the other route to their Social Link-related neuroses.

Way back at the beginning of the game, I took note of the gas station attendant's comment that they were looking for part-timers. Now, even though I know why the situation is so, I can't help but go "no you're not, you freaking liar! Give me my extra cash and/or social link opportunity!"

And yes, I keep thinking there has to be a better way to get desired skills onto a Persona without spending hours just trying over and over again.

edited 8th Jul '09 9:54:26 AM by dkellis

Jul 8th 2009 at 10:12:46 AM

Re: easier difficulty: It's amazing how much quicker things go in the beginning when you have endgame level powers, innit? Watch out for the Reaper, though (Spoilered just in case you don't know about certain optional boss fights, and don't want to know).

Re: Visual Novel Route Regret: It's an alternate timeline, and in this timeline, Daisuke and Ayane are well-adjusted individuals, with no more neuroses than your typical high-schooler. Yeah, that's it.

Re: Part-time job offers, and the lack of said jobs: But see, you were working with the attendant. It just wasn't a job at the gas station. Izanami needed "lab assistants", after all.

Re: Persona skills: One would think, but I haven't found it yet, outside of maybe a lucky Arcana chance. Disappointing, that.

edited 8th Jul '09 10:14:14 AM by Theoneknownasme

Jul 8th 2009 at 10:25:47 AM

I'd actually forgotten about that optional boss fight. Good thing I've been saving up my Chest Keys anyway. Can I actually escape from it, like in Persona 3 (which is what Fuuka keeps telling me to do, despite the existence of Armageddon/Victory Cry)? Does it turn up at any point in the game, or only after a certain dungeon (and thus a certain minimum level range)?

Endgame level powers are awesome, but expensive. Good thing Lucifer has Spell Master (halves SP costs). Helel has Arms Master (halves HP costs for physical skills), but I'd rather not use that yet.

Something I also learned back in the first play-through: the Chakra Ring halves SP costs for magical skills, but does not stack with Spell Master. I was a little sad about that.

Hanging out with Kou and Yumi this time, instead of Daisuke and Ayane, gives me the feeling that I'm with the Popular Crowd now. It's weird. The Social Link neuroses in P4 are a lot milder than in P3, at least; these could be considered somewhat normal for high school (like Ayane's lack of self-confidence or Daisuke's old crush), compared to "You Killed My Father".

Occasionally, in my more generous moods, I think that the skill inheritance retrying thing is part of the balance: do we want to spend the whole day trying to get all four desirable skills onto the fused Persona? Or will three out of four do? What about two (which is what I often end up with)? What about a lower-level spell, such as Diarama instead of Diarahan? Decisions like that, balanced against available playtime and patience.

Rogue7 Squad Leader
Squad Leader
Jul 8th 2009 at 10:33:09 AM

The whole machanic strikes me as utterly pointless. "Well, there's a chance you could get this certain combination of skills and there's no penalty for failure. Have fun!" It's stupid, and I'd say one of two things that needs a change if Atlus decides to do Persona 5. The other being actually integrating social links into the story.

My Blog thing
Jul 8th 2009 at 10:44:32 AM

With regards to the bonus boss, stolen directly from Megami Tensei Wiki:

The Reaper is an exclusive boss that can only be fought in the second playthrough of the game. In the second cycle,The Reaper can be found in ordinary chests, and upon examining it, the Protagonist is forewarned that a powerful force dwells within the chest, and repeatedly asks the Protagonist whether is he ready to open it. Should the Protagonist chooses to open it, The Reaper will attack the Protagonist, engaging the party to a battle. Similar to its predecessor, The Reaper can be challenged multiple times as long as the Protagonist manages to locate the treasure chest he dwells within.

Defeating The Reaper grants the respective characters their strongest weapons per defeat; however, should all of the in-battle characters had received their strongest weapons, The Reaper instead drops the strongest armor. Occasionally, there is also a rare occurrence where The Reaper drops the Omnipotence Orb, an accessory which voids all attacks excluding Almighty-elemental.

As for escaping, unknown. But it gives you a good enough amount of warning that you won't stumble into it on accident, and it's not particularly hard to get back and forth between save points in P4 if that's the issue.

edited 8th Jul '09 10:49:48 AM by Theoneknownasme

Jul 8th 2009 at 10:51:29 AM

Ah, good. For something as powerful as the Reaper, I'd hate to have to face it without optimum preparation.

Especially since Armageddon doesn't exist in this game. (Probably for the best.)

Currently on Round Two, April 30. To do: get a Repel or Null Physical Persona, so I can go back to Yukiko's Palace and give the Contrarian King the finger.

edited 8th Jul '09 11:00:06 AM by dkellis

Jul 8th 2009 at 10:58:55 AM

That was a ridiculously broken combo. "Oh hay, big-huge spell that kills everything but almost kills you to use it. O hay, big huge effect that heals you and refills your XP. Oh hay, let's make it possible to put both of them on the same Persona." Craziness.

edited 8th Jul '09 10:59:08 AM by Theoneknownasme

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