TL;DR: the final battle of SMTIVA is against the Capital G god. That thing is too big, too powerful, too omnipotent for mere mortals to take down. But like every other god and monsters in the IVA verse, he too is merely a product of human observation. Humans thought of an omnipotent god judging their life, and that being came into existence.
But IVA also says that over time, with enough push in one direction, you can change the collective unconscious's perception of something. and when it does, because of how observation works, this change in perception is repercuted on the being that was imagined. For example, how Baal went from being a benevolent sumerian (I think ?) god figure to one of the forms of the demon beelzebub in christianity.
So the solution to take down YHVH isn't to beat it in a straight fistfight. It's to observe him and conceptualize him as something that ISN't omnipotent and invincible. in the words of Dagda (himself voiced by the same guy who voices joker, for added irony) "By denying YHVH as the one true god, you dethrone him. You bring him to the level of a mere demon. This is how you'll drag him down from that throne."
After enough party members form an udnerstanding of YHVH by throwing his shortcomings back to him, YHVH loses the whole floating head aspect it's know for and is reduced to some uber-generic JRPG final boss design that incorporates the various plagues fo the old testament, and THAT form can be pummeled away until it dies.
Aside from the fact it's a (probably accidental) good summation of what SMT itself did to the christian god, the idea of dragging down god from it's throne by literally rejecting the reality in which it IS the omnipotent creator, is an idea that goes wonderfully hand-in-hand with p5's concept of cognition and the only reason Satanael shooting yaldabaoth in the face is an equally good conclusion is STYLE POINTS.
Even the name of theme of the second phase of the battle says it all : To Become God's Enemy. It carries this notion of reducing god, or ascending to a point you geniunely represent a threat to such a powerful being, and that doing so is in and of itself the key to victory.
Edited by Yumil on Jan 14th 2021 at 3:09:25 PM
"when you stare too long into the abyss, Xehanort takes advantage of the distraction to break into your house and steal all your shit."That is just one iteration though. Something like Nocturne for instance argues for more extreme solutions to the Yhvh problem. I really wanna see something like Reasons make a return in SMT or put into a Persona context. The idea of embodying contradictory ideas that can change the world and attract followers based on your ideal is interesting.
Persona 4's Shadows are, on the whole, a bad example of Jungian stuff is because they're also a manifestation of what other people think it should look like.
The problem is, the game does not explain this until the very end.
Bewitching Eyesi just finished the sun social link
and
well, one it's the best social link in the whole series, and two it connects SO heavily to the themes of the game and (from what i'm aware) the ending of the game itself (so i happened to pick a REALLY good time to finish the social link)
and three, it made me cry
....
persona 3 is a really, really good game
Edited by EpicBleye on Jan 14th 2021 at 10:48:35 AM
"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-MaeAkinari who's dying from anime disease and writing the picture book.
@Bleye, I think the fun part of the Ryoji twist is that the timing is well-paced enough to make Pharos leaving fade into the background as an event with everything else going on so it doesn't quite seem that important but then it hits.
Oh right. That poor bastard....I'm talking about the Hippo.
I mean, it just dies out of nowhere. That's some depressing shit. Don't give me that its dead body helped people thing. He lost his friend and cried himself to death.
I get it Akinari. You're dying, but don't go making hippos commit suicide man. They ain't done nothing to nobody.
One Strip! One Strip!A bit late, but i think another reason to note why P4 gets more focus on criticism, is Persona 4 tries to focus on topics it just doesn't nail the landing discussing them. namely LGBT issues, but in general, a lot of Persona 4's themes of facing truth falls flatter than intended what with basically all the character's truth's lining up with societies expectations, when widely held society believes being counter to truth (read: reality) would actually be an extremely poignant message. (not to mention relevant still today)
Inversely, P3's theme of death is one of the most apolitical themes you can find. Memento Mori, remember you will die. really hard to mess that up thematically, and just as hard to criticize, so more P3's criticism are mechanical. and P5.... i haven't really played, so i can't really say on it in detail, but people seem to criticize its plot a fair amount too, so shrugs
Edited by I-M-THE-Jetyl-1 on Jan 14th 2021 at 10:52:04 AM
I forgot my password, and I want my old Forum handle back!!!so, i happened to notice a new option popped up under Elizabeth's talk options after i completed our last date and...
"......"
"I... can't do that."
"...As I've told you."
"I don't enjoy refusing your offers, so..."
"Please..."
this is so sad ;~; elizabeth is officially best girl of P3, no questions asked
i really like it. it's sad but it's symbolic of what Akinari was going through and how he coped
and, while i obviously haven't finished 3 yet, i'm like 90% sure that it's foreshadowing to/symbolic of the main character's sacrifice at the end of the game (which, yknow, was impossible not to be spoiled on).
also, on an unrelated note, i'm pretty sure that Ryoji is an homage to NGE's Kaworu. at the very least they share a striking amount of similarities when it comes to their role in the story and what they are.
"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-MaeAs they're both voiced by Akira Ishida in Japanese, it's basically consensus that the allusion was intentional.
FWIW if you play the female MC in Portable you can date Ryoji and he just straight up says 'if you were a dude I'd still be into you'
Bewitching Eyes![]()
That's Akira Ishida stereotype... Athrun Zala, Fate Averruncus, Kuja and so many others.
oooh and finally got through the new year
i'm... going to miss Ryoji.
i actually checked out the ending where you kill Ryoji first... it's honestly sad seeing everyone go back to who they were at the start of the game.
BUT of course, i chose to let Ryoji live and summon nyx. i only got one more month, huh? guess i'm about to spend every day of it with Aigis so i can max out her social link
I wonder what the Velvet room assistant in 6 will be called. We're running out of female characters from Frankenstein.
Bewitching Eyes

How so? I'm not trying to be argumentative; I haven't played SMTVIA.
Nach jeder Ebbe kommt die Flut.