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unfortunatezorua from the old, in the new yesterday (Five Long Years) Relationship Status: Wishing you were here
#60576: Jan 13th 2021 at 11:56:11 PM

Wouldn’t go so far as to say crappy if it’s not the PSP version we’re talking about, but yeeesh. The battle system’s tedious at best.

Well, that’d be jus’ a waste. Why would ya want to deprive the world of such anomaly as yourself?
EpicBleye drunk bunny from her bed being very eepy Since: Sep, 2014 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
drunk bunny
#60577: Jan 14th 2021 at 12:28:13 AM

oh. wow. uh, thunder call sure breaks the game in half huh

"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-Mae
Nikkolas from Texas Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#60578: Jan 14th 2021 at 3:15:19 AM

[up][up] Wait are you saying the PSP version is worse than the PSX one? I played the PSX one, it was slow as balls so the P Sp version at least runs better and has some of the Nu Persona artistic flair instead of ugly old generic menus.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#60579: Jan 14th 2021 at 3:23:06 AM

Its funny because Persona games get MUCH better gameplay later, while their writing becomes more questionable

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
darkabomination Since: Mar, 2012
#60580: Jan 14th 2021 at 5:01:39 AM

I like the negotiation mechanics they added to the usual SMT formula. It's still really neat how your party members in all three games have their own personal commands to interact. In 5 it's way too easy and simplified.

Nikkolas from Texas Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#60581: Jan 14th 2021 at 5:15:51 AM

Negotiating was interesting in P2. using it to grind for cards kinda ruined it though because talk about repetitive to the point of melting your brain.

[up][up] P2 was honestly kind of a fluke in the writing department. It's not like Atlus was writing masterpieces in the 90s and then something awful happened. They've written great games since then and bad games since then.

P2 is just something special.Kinda like Xenogears.

Edited by Nikkolas on Jan 14th 2021 at 5:16:11 AM

PhoenixAct Since: Feb, 2011
#60582: Jan 14th 2021 at 9:37:00 AM

Speaking of P 3 P, I love the game, but does anyone else find Rio's Social Link a bit suspect? And I'm not just talking about the fact that it involves Kenji

I mean...

I mean, it treats Rio as being in the wrong for being really into her chosen sport and wanting her team to practice hard and be competitive, and seems to treat her as being unfeminine for not being too interested in romance. Then when she seemingly stops caring about being competitive and is content to stand around gossiping about boys during practice it's treated like a good thing.

Maybe it's just me, but I found it kinda eyebrow-raising.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#60583: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:02:20 AM

No, that's perfectly in line with recent criticisms of Hashino's writing.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#60584: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:05:37 AM

There's probably a lot of that in P3 that just went over our heads.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#60585: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:09:09 AM

That's a trend i've seen elsewhere in japanese fiction where women falling into more conventional feminine gender roles is treated as a sign of maturity. It's dumb.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#60586: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:15:54 AM

So I read over her social link...

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the issue that she was too strict in her sports to distract her from her feelings for Kenji to the point of alienating the team? And the social link was about her team helping her confess?

Ita still very good, but not as bad as it initially sounded.

[up] For what its worth, Western influences in Japan have caused more women to actively refuse to settle down with a partner and pursue their own passions...for better or worse since most of them live with their parents as a result.

That's why there's so many meme about Japan's declining birth rate, people are refusing to settle down and have children.

Edited by BlackYakuzu94 on Jan 14th 2021 at 1:16:59 PM

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#60587: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:18:23 AM

re: P4 and 5 criticism: In short I feel a lot of it is due to the perception that a good bit of the life-sim elements were designed with the intent of pulling in a particularly toxic wing of Japanese fandom culture.

While these trends began with 3, I suspect it not being critiqued in this way nearly as much is due to the fact that your character dies at the end and thus won't actually get to enjoy being God Emperor of High School for very long.

[up] Japanese women have it drilled into their head non-stop that you can have a family or, a career, not both... leading to predictable consequences when more and more choose "career."

Edited by HamburgerTime on Jan 14th 2021 at 12:25:56 PM

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#60588: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:23:14 AM

[up]Yeah a lot of it is that.

In P4's case specifically my main problem with it in retrospect is that I feel it doesn't execute on its main theme of "pursue/accept the truth" very well at all. Yumil had some good posts a long while ago that talked about this more in-depth, but essentially most of the reveals about the dark secrets the party members are hiding are underwhelming and play into some questionable imagery/implications, just to start with.

Meanwhile there's criticisms to be made about 5 but I feel it definitely sticks the landing better on a thematic level, and 3 definitely does as well.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Jan 14th 2021 at 3:24:12 PM

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#60589: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:36:53 AM

Remember when being an Otaku was considered a badge of honor, but then we grew up and realized there was probably a reason they were looked down upon so thoroughly.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
powerpuffbats The crabby fussbudget Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The crabby fussbudget
#60590: Jan 14th 2021 at 10:46:45 AM

Japan is also very “traditional” minded. That might explain some of the writing issues that characters like Chie have. Basically it’s Values Dissonance at its finest.

AAAAUUUUGGGHHHH!!!!
Yumil Mad Archivist Since: Mar, 2016
Mad Archivist
#60591: Jan 14th 2021 at 11:41:42 AM

[up][up][up]I'm guessing you meant this one and that one, I suppose.

But yeah, It might be the biggest thing that weirded me out going into p4 last, THE game about the shadow selves, THE game about "accept the truth no matter how painful it is" : it's that... The Answer did the shadow selves better than 4 did ? Futaba in p5 did shadow selves better than 4 did ? Shadow Yu, anime exclusive, is a bettter done shadow than all of the shadows of p4 ? How does one fuck up that bad ?

Edited by Yumil on Jan 14th 2021 at 8:41:57 PM

"when you stare too long into the abyss, Xehanort takes advantage of the distraction to break into your house and steal all your shit."
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#60592: Jan 14th 2021 at 12:01:02 PM

Shadow Yu in particular floored me a little when I heard about it, because it definitely sounded like something that should have been in the game in some way but just wasn't for some reason.

Nikkolas from Texas Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#60593: Jan 14th 2021 at 1:04:38 PM

The first totaku most gamers knew was Hal Emmerich and he was a cool dude.

Kakuzan Let memes die. Kill them, if you have to. from Knock knock, open up the door, it's real. Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Let memes die. Kill them, if you have to.
#60594: Jan 14th 2021 at 1:25:57 PM

[up][up] Now that's just silly! Who would want actual introspection in a game ostensibly about introspection of the true self? Nobody, that's for sure! Such a thing would get in the way of my self insert character who weirdly straddles the line between being an actual blank slate and having an actual personality. I prefer having shallow main characters I can completely project myself onto as an average dude because self awareness is scaaaaaaaaaaaaaaary.

In all seriousness, I know we always go back to discussing power fantasies and such since the topic is intrinsically linked to properties with this kind of format, and I think what some people who get angry when this is brought up forgets is that it is a neutral term in theory. It is just that since power fantasies have a weirdly narrow view of what they are allowed to do, the conversation tends to keep circling back to the same broad topics.

Edited by Kakuzan on Jan 14th 2021 at 4:27:16 AM

Don't catch you slippin' now.
Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#60595: Jan 14th 2021 at 1:46:04 PM

P4's great but I had one really large objective issue with the game: Specifically, the fact that since teammates could be social links, thus their actual character development wound up being divorced from the game.

The writers had to write for characters that were at level 1 or 10 in terms of their social link at any given point in the gameplay. So in scripted scenes they had to be... kind of a tabula rasa in that regard.

As a direct corollary, the characters' resolution to their social links basically had to end with "and then they decided to stay in Inaba, because otherwise you'd lose a party member."

Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
lu127 Paper Master from 異界 Since: Sep, 2011 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#60596: Jan 14th 2021 at 1:54:43 PM

Which could have been easily resolved with "I've decided to follow this path that takes me away from Inaba after I finish high school". None of your party members is a third year so this would never happen during the time the game covers.

"If you aren't him, then you apparently got your brain from the same discount retailer, so..." - Fighteer
EpicBleye drunk bunny from her bed being very eepy Since: Sep, 2014 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
drunk bunny
#60597: Jan 14th 2021 at 1:55:16 PM

plot stuff!

oh, chidori is out of the hospital?? chidori no :c poor junpei, poor chidori

oh, and strega is alive, somehow, cool, and SHOT JUNPEI???? omg

and chidori.. died... that was actually so sad omg. but junpei blasted a motherfucker oh my god

yknow.. strega would really feel like more of a threat if there was more than just two of them. like, we have eight people and a dog on our side... just like hold him down and punch him. takeya doesn't even look like he eats enough to fight back.

"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-Mae
Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#60598: Jan 14th 2021 at 2:07:39 PM

[up][up] A-yup. Instead we get them all independently deciding "yeah, the status quo is good enough!"

Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#60599: Jan 14th 2021 at 3:00:45 PM

[up][up] Surprising he can even shoot straight and without dislocating his arm every time.

Wake me up at your own risk.
TrueShadow1 Since: Dec, 2012
#60600: Jan 14th 2021 at 3:06:30 PM

[up][up]Yeah, Strega never feels like an actual threat since they're vastly outnumbered. Their boss battles are piss easy, too.


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