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EddieValiant,Jr. Not Quite Batman from under your bed. Since: Jan, 2010
Not Quite Batman
#1: Oct 21st 2010 at 1:59:26 PM

Isn't it about time this guy came back? He's one of the most iconic "pop literature" villains of all time, and I'm rather fond of him.

I think that, if we take away the implication that his evil nature is a reflection of his race, he'd be a great mustache-twirling mastermind once more.

Anyone agree?

"Religion isn't the cause of wars, it's the excuse." —Mycroft Next
Jordan Azor Ahai from Westeros Since: Jan, 2001
Azor Ahai
#2: Oct 21st 2010 at 2:24:01 PM

I've read about the original stories, but haven't had a chance to read them. From what I gather, he does seem to be an interesting character as an early example of a Noble Demon Magnificent Bastard.

I don't know how interesting the character would seem today though on account of "Seinfeld" Is Unfunny. Ra's al Ghul in Batman is essentially Fu Manchu by another name, and the Bond villain (not just Dr. No) takes a lot from him.

Hodor
EddieValiant,Jr. Not Quite Batman from under your bed. Since: Jan, 2010
Not Quite Batman
#3: Oct 21st 2010 at 3:23:42 PM

Exactly! He's the great grandaddy of all those guys. He needs to make a big comeback, and he needs to be given the chance to stand out.

"Religion isn't the cause of wars, it's the excuse." —Mycroft Next
lordGacek Since: Jan, 2001
#4: Oct 22nd 2010 at 5:38:14 AM

But this should go to the Film section, shouldn't it?

Madrugada Since: Jan, 2001
#5: Oct 22nd 2010 at 11:30:00 AM

Fu Manchu was around long before Grindhouse.

EddieValiant,Jr. Not Quite Batman from under your bed. Since: Jan, 2010
Not Quite Batman
#6: Oct 22nd 2010 at 2:10:25 PM

[up] I thought [up][up] was being sarcastic...

"Religion isn't the cause of wars, it's the excuse." —Mycroft Next
Nobodymuch Since: Jan, 2001
#7: Oct 23rd 2010 at 9:09:27 PM

Well, the whole point of Fu Manchu was that he was fighting against European dominance of China (and Asia in general). Hasn't that boat done sailed for anything except period pieces?

Poopsi Since: Sep, 2009
#8: Oct 28th 2010 at 8:48:12 PM

Period pieces and political ads ;)

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#9: Oct 28th 2010 at 9:26:58 PM

Do a modern take on Victorian times, a la Sherlock Holmes, then.

toiletbomber 納豆 post-processor from Nowhere in Everywhere Since: Jun, 2010
納豆 post-processor
#10: Nov 4th 2010 at 1:36:33 PM

^^LOL! No. Fu Manchu stands well on his without comparison to Sherlock.

Zephid Since: Jan, 2001
#11: Nov 4th 2010 at 2:03:09 PM

That is true, but I horribly love Victorian fiction crossovers like Anno Dracula and The League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen. Seeing Fu Manchu with Moriarty, for instance, is just pure nerdgasm. And if they're convincingly and faithfully written? Even better!

Fu Manchu's never really died as a character. Dr. X from The Diamond Age was pretty much a postcyberpunk Expy. Ra's al Ghul has been mentioned. The Mandarin from the Marvel Universe is based partly on him.

edited 4th Nov '10 2:09:12 PM by Zephid

I wrote about a fish turning into the moon.
Moogi A Mediocre Khan from everywhy Since: Jan, 2001
A Mediocre Khan
#12: Nov 4th 2010 at 2:35:45 PM

I'd love to see a new take on the character, free of the Unfortunate Implications. I mean, the guy's just freaking awesome. Let him have his due.

https://www.facebook.com/emileunmedicatedanduncut
FarseerLolotea from America's Finest City Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Tannhaeuser Since: Apr, 2009
#14: Nov 13th 2010 at 2:02:42 AM

Zephid (et al.), have you read Cay Van Ash's Ten Years Beyond Baker Street? It is a Fu/Holmes crossover, and rather a good one. For those who want Fu without Holmes, Van Ash also wrote The Fires of Fu Manchu.

edited 13th Nov '10 2:03:18 AM by Tannhaeuser

ThatOtherGriffin Since: Aug, 2010
#15: Nov 14th 2010 at 10:06:59 AM

How about a TV series starring a modern-day version of Fu Manchu... Written by Steven Moffat?

...

Somebody call him now.

edited 14th Nov '10 10:08:23 AM by ThatOtherGriffin

Bananaquit Since: Jan, 2001
#16: Nov 14th 2010 at 1:39:14 PM

I'd love to see a new take on the character, free of the Unfortunate Implications. I mean, the guy's just freaking awesome. Let him have his due.

I once conceived of a short film about a Fu Manchu Expy who was the good guy, while the Nayland Smith Expy was the bad guy. I never went anywhere with it, though.

Zephid Since: Jan, 2001
#17: Nov 15th 2010 at 5:56:12 PM

@Tannhaeuser: No I have not, but I will very soon. Thanks!

I wrote about a fish turning into the moon.
JackMackerel from SOME OBSCURE MEDIA Since: Jul, 2010
#18: Nov 16th 2010 at 4:45:51 PM

I'm Asian and I wouldn't raise a fuss. Honestly, those who see Charlie Chan and Fu Manchu as SYMBOLS OF WHITE RACISM are kind of off - Manchu, though evil, wasn't without mercy and was a very cunning and Worthy Opponent (at least, from what I've read of The Drums of Fu Manchu.)

He'd make a great comeback in serial TV or a movie - maybe comics, but they already have Mandarin.

Half-Life: Dual Nature, a crossover story of reasonably sized proportions.
Poopsi Since: Sep, 2009
#19: Nov 17th 2010 at 4:45:27 AM

... by an astonishing coincidence, I began reading Fu again this week, without having seen this thread

Tannhaeuser Since: Apr, 2009
#20: Nov 20th 2010 at 2:24:04 AM

Jack Mackeral, the later Fu books are not quite so bad, but the early ones tend to be much more racially charged — perhaps not so much about Fu himself as about his servants. It is a bit disquieting to see Arabs, Burmese, Chinese, Haitians, and any and all non-Northwestern Europeans treated as one big ol' Always Chaotic Evil "Eastern race."

Charlie Chan along with Mr. Moto and others of their ilk, I think, are rather different. They are very positive depictions of Asian people — especially when one considers that there is a hint that their culture actually makes them better. (After all, who comes off as smarter — Charlie or his very Americanized children?) I would like to see some Asian actors in some of these parts. (I understand there have been some Chinese Chans made in Hong Kong — anyone know if they are on-line anywhere?)

DoktorvonEurotrash Lex et Veritas from Not a place of honour (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#21: Nov 20th 2010 at 3:13:36 AM

[up]Saying that the Chinese culture is better than the Western one is still an unfortunate implication.

I've never read the Fu Manchu books, but if I find it, I can link to a blog article that explains in detail how the books are full of racism towards Asians.

Poopsi Since: Sep, 2009
#22: Nov 21st 2010 at 2:50:46 AM

The books are as chauvinist, as they come. It doesn't really need an essay to notice, as a casual skim through any of the books will be telling enough. The novels are entertaining, though, if you can stomach those themes.

Gray64 Since: Dec, 1969
#23: Jun 27th 2011 at 10:21:47 PM

I find it amusing that Ming the Merciless from Flash Gordon was based on Fu Manchu, as was Ra's Al Ghul from Batman...both even have allegience-challenged daughters, just like Fu Manchu...

FurikoMaru Reverse the Curse from The Arrogant Wasteland Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
Reverse the Curse
#24: Jun 28th 2011 at 12:03:37 AM

In the early Oughts there were rumours of a less-racist revamp of Charlie Chan with Lucy Liu in the starring role. I was actually kind of disappointed it never happened.

A True Lady's Quest - A Jojo is You!
Gamabunta Lurker that doesn´t lurk from The very end o the world Since: Feb, 2010
Lurker that doesn´t lurk
#25: Jun 28th 2011 at 2:06:34 AM

I believe that racism is an unfortunate implication in almost any work up to the middle of the twentieth century, applied to whatever race/ culture the author isn´t part of. From the portraits of african people in the original Tarzan novels, to Cervantes' treatment of the Gypsies in one of his Exemplar Novels (sorry if I don´t get the translation straight, english isn´t my first language), HP Lovecraft´s treatment of women and anyone who isn´t caucasian, and so on to an almost unending etcetera.

However, one should be capable of reading through those novels and judge them according to their literary value, not the unfortunate implications they carry. Otherwise, one could be losing sight of many valuable compositions, despite humanity having mostly outgrown some of their premises (such as 'The Merchant of Venice' by Shakespeare).

By the way, does anyone know of an online bookstore that sells those books? They appear listed in Amazon, but out of stock :(

Suffer not the witch to live.

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