OK, enough of this, we've had this argument a thousand times.
- Moe is a dumb and vague term as it is, even moreso when used as a genre classification.
- Some people find K-On and similar shows boring.
- Some people find that kind of show entertaining.
- None of the above people are wrong.
- Trends are trends, nothing is consuming the industry from inside-out.
- Legend Of The Galactic Heroes is better than all your chinese cartoons anyway.
The end.
edited 15th Sep '11 3:56:07 AM by Noimporta
Meh, Legend Of The Galactic Heroes doesn't sound like my thing. Doesn't help that Smokie/Excelion keeps making it seem like the best thing ever along with Hajime No Ippo.
Asuras Wrath, a game inspired by anime and manga on the other hand....
edited 15th Sep '11 4:51:55 AM by Demongodofchaos2
Watch Symphogear
We know that.... Moe, instead, is a style. But most slices-of-life all have moe characters, which is the cause of the confusion between the two.
I like moe characters... as long as they are in the right anime....
...a little brother should belong to his older sister, right? - Orimura Chifuyu
I stand corrected...
SUBBER'S NEWS! SUBBER'S NEWS!
May GG's team dies.... except the translators, before they get to Persona 4
...a little brother should belong to his older sister, right? - Orimura ChifuyuNew Furuba!
JO had a bit of a problem mixing this ep because of the kitties. X3
And any Crunchyroll release is automatically of Horrible/Crunchy Subs....
@Excelion: Ah, but this is dancing around the issue. Is moe something that the people who make anime are aware of? Yes. Are they trying to create characters and shows that invoke the moe response? Of course they are. And the question that raises, of course, is this: Is this okay? Should they be doing this?
Claiming anything else, like your little image does, is deflecting this. Technically everything that's said there is true - but as far as explaining the real issue, it's lying by way of omission.
edited 15th Sep '11 5:35:20 PM by Sporkaganza
Always, somewhere, someone is fighting for you. As long as you remember them, you are not alone.If that is what sells, then yes. It IS what they should be doing.
You have to forget your personal preferences and remember that animation is not cheap. Why shouldn't they make characters/shows that people will call "moe" if that will bring in money for the company and artists?
Yu hav nat sein bod speeling unntil know. (cacke four undersandig tis)the cake is a lie!I have problem with all those moe shows. However, my complaint is not directed to the creators, but rather the current Japanese market that demands and fuels such trend. I am assuming that Japanese don’t have much problem with all those moe things as much as western fans do.
Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
I never found any of your former post about moe. Please tell me why you hate moe? Or the market that demands such?
I want to post this as a separate thread, but I know that because of CERTAIN TROPERS (you know who you are), it will go down to hell quickly so I'm just posting (not so rational) explanation on my (not so justified) dislike toward the genre (just to be sure; for the love of God, don't tackle me with the semantics, I'm already sick of it and just can't be bothered)
I have to admit that I can’t really come up with any solid argument against moe. Using character designs that would invoke endearment from the audience…on paper, it doesn’t sound so bad and sounds like a mere artistic choice. I speculate that it results not from the hatred on that specific genre but mixture of different reasons that might come across as insubstantial to some of you guys. I’d like to remind you guys that this also explains my dislike toward current harem genre as well.
No matter what kind of convention or trend it is, if it keeps following same formula over and over, it gets rather tiring. In many of the examples and shows with similar demographics in mind, some elements, like obligatory bath/beach scenes involving groping among females, breast size discussions, and whathaveyou. I hate many of the moe shows because they don’t have other redeeming values of their own. In case you haven’t noticed, my tolerances for fanservice plummets when there’s nothing else going on. Azumanga Daioh is the show that codified and popularized much of the aforementioned conventions. However, not only they were, at least compared to its less subtle imitations, downplayed, it had more than enough humor to make things interesting on its own. That’s the reason why I like Lucky Star and Nichijou (I’m only at the third episode but damn, it’s hilarious); they have redeeming value of their own.
Second is that in many of recent harem and moe shows, male characters are either non-existent or portrayed as fools. This is a far less substantial and more personal examples in that I’m a male and not seeing them having active or respectable role in series rather displeases me. Not having a male cast, that much I can handle (my favorite series of all time include ARIA and Azumanga Daioh and that should tell you enough) but seeing them looking like idiots, like in, you know, almost all harem series from this decade? Contemptible. I understand that there are more female consumers nowadays (although confusingly, more and more Japanese women enjoys shonen manga as well and I have no idea what the fuck to make of that :/) so having more female centric series I can understand. Then again, I don’t have any info on Japanese anime consumption demographics. I don’t know who those shows are supposed to appeal at. :/
Of course, there’s just some bits of nostalgia. I miss the time when the market was dominated with (as far as I know) shonen action series that empathized on manly actions and explosions. When that disappeared, also did the shows with more mature subject matters, such as Cowboy Bebop, Monster, Black Lagoon, and Full Metal Alchemist, which nowadays are pushed aside in favor of moe shows. Sure, you might call me out for liking actions and explosions, but at least those are more universally accepted than catering to cuteness. Also, think about it. What kind of shows did bring more world fans to anime? It certainly isn’t moe shows.
I hope this explains to you guys my dislike toward moe genre. Even if it doesn't, now you all know how I think about it.
edited 16th Sep '11 1:04:16 AM by dRoy
Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
Nobody responds or erase this... I'm reading. And this is his view: so you won't be able to do anything about how he looks at it.
EDIT: Done... But people: DO NOT RESPOND AND CAUSE A FIRE.
@dRoy TY for the clarification.
edited 16th Sep '11 1:04:57 AM by djmaca
...a little brother should belong to his older sister, right? - Orimura Chifuyu![]()
So basically, you dislike massproduced shit that uses pandering to sell without any substance. Fine, so do I, but it's not limited to "moe".
For that matter, Aria is also "moeshit", but it's still one of the best anime out there. And not "despite being moeshit", but also not "because of being moeshit". It's simply a quality that becomes 'negative' only when there's nothing else. Like explosions. And why? Because it becomes cheap entertainment that doesn't actually have anything to say or tell and no feelings or ideas to convey. That doesn't make the qualities that tend to be abused for this negative in themselves. If there's that much moeshit you like (Like the KEY adaptations, Aria, Azumanga), it can't be that bad a "genre". Claiming that those you do like are suddenly "not moeshows" is a completely worthless and also wrong statement.
And yes, I'm using the word moeshit to refer to the bunch, and no, I'm not trying to insult it (whatever "it" may be).
Refer to this.
◊ To be honest, if it wasn't for a single studio consistently putting out shows that generally appeal to western fans ("mature/thought-provoking/bla") despite earning very little for it in return, we would have much, much less of said kind of anime to begin with.
tl;dr stop deviding anime by styles and genres in what you like and don't like and become a pretentious elitist weeaboo who only cares about quality, like me~
Murrl LustFatM

Still, I think it's more important the level of the actual show than "how hard it was to make".
And is that misconception the problem, since most of these shows have their unique characteristics and all, but they simple say that it's "just another moe show" and that it's evil and it's destroying anime becuase everything is some moe crap, even if less than a fifth of the shows that air each season can be considered as Slice of Life.
Personally I prefer a show with no plot than one with a plot filled with holes and What An Idiot moments, plus I like to see things develope in a way I would expect to react or see others react to it in real life, which is the point behind a Slice of Life show.
edited 15th Sep '11 2:28:11 AM by shark33