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Soble Since: Dec, 2013
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#23427: Jan 1st 2017 at 9:16:30 AM

Gonna have to agree with the Majin Piccolo what-if being kinda bad and uninteresting.

LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#23428: Jan 1st 2017 at 9:19:26 AM

Yeah that's like the Yamcha manga in that it has a character be super awesome with no real substance to it besides that.

I will stand by Hercule's what-if story where he befriends Broly to my dying breath however.

This song needs more love.
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#23429: Jan 1st 2017 at 9:20:30 AM

At least the Yamcha manga isn't meant to be taken seriously...I think?

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#23430: Jan 1st 2017 at 9:27:11 AM

The Yamcha manga is supposed to be a joke. I mean, it's got a kid accidentally taking over Yamcha's body, any seriousness is out the window.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
TyeDyeWildebeest Unreasonably Quirky from Big Rock Candy Mountain Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: How does it feel to treat me like you do?
Unreasonably Quirky
#23431: Jan 1st 2017 at 9:42:53 AM

I actually heard about the Yamcha manga from a Youtube commenter once. It sounded a lot cooler the way he described it.

I've seen fan comics on the web that focus on Yamcha as the main protagonist and make him a better character than Toriyama ever cared to. Some great stories as to where he got his scars and why he has the spirit of a wolf.

There was an interesting one of his origin where Yamcha came from a desert tribe of powerful savages who can transform into beasts!

No beer?! But if there's no beer, then there's no beef or beans!
Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#23432: Jan 1st 2017 at 9:45:26 AM

I really hate how the fandom's default mode seems to be "Shitting on Toriyama."

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#23433: Jan 1st 2017 at 9:45:46 AM

It being a joke does not excuse it from having poor writing.

This song needs more love.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#23434: Jan 1st 2017 at 10:25:30 AM

I really hate how the fandom's default mode seems to be "Shitting on Toriyama."

That's the consequence of irrational attachment.

God_of_Awesome Since: Jan, 2001
#23435: Jan 1st 2017 at 10:28:52 AM

Maybe he shouldn't have shit on this thing we love.

Nah, ha, I don't care, never watched the show or read the manga. It's all been abridged for me, much as it has been for a lot of other anime.

Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#23436: Jan 1st 2017 at 10:39:45 AM

I really hate how the fandom's default mode seems to be "Shitting on Toriyama."

fandom's default mode

Yes. Fans defaulting to "shit on this no matter what" mode. I can understand how that might be a little annoying.

Being hypocritical becuase I don't shit on Toriyama except when he comes up with things that contradict or change things I liked. But I also admire his willingness to let the story be so open-ended.

edited 1st Jan '17 10:44:08 AM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#23437: Jan 1st 2017 at 11:37:38 AM

I give him a hard time, because I think he made a lot of errors, and his Writing by the Seat of Your Pants style meant that a lot of ideas didn't get the development the way they could have, but I like Toriyama.

I mean, I'm here because of his story, even if I'm more aware of things I look at as flaws.

edited 1st Jan '17 1:39:39 PM by HandsomeRob

One Strip! One Strip!
MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#23438: Jan 1st 2017 at 12:47:36 PM

Having just noticed that Uncovering Relationship Status was launched earlier today note  reminded me of this part of Episode 50 where Krillin awkwardly asks 18 if she's already seeing anyone. So... Does this qualify for inclusion in the Funny Moments subpage, since it's immediately followed by Cell interrupting them with a blast and a subsequent "She is." as an answer to the question? Or should it just go in the DBZAbridged.Tropes S To Z page, Dragon Ball Z Abridged E 51, and possibly Krillin's own profile?

edited 1st Jan '17 1:20:28 PM by MarqFJA

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#23439: Jan 1st 2017 at 2:15:44 PM

I mean, if we're not hating on Toriyama, we're hating on Toei for "ruining" the Anime.

Sometimes I question what people actually like about the series given how much energy some put into criticizing almost everything about it.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Eriorguez Since: Jun, 2009
#23440: Jan 1st 2017 at 2:24:43 PM

The people I often see giving shit are those who had been acting as if they knew everything there was to know about the series for over a decade. Guess they are so high on their Word of Dante feeling that they will antagonice anybody who disagrees with them, incluiding the author.

TheMageofFire Since: May, 2012
#23441: Jan 1st 2017 at 2:35:22 PM

Wonder what's going on with Broly.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#23442: Jan 1st 2017 at 2:50:40 PM

I haven't made a serious criticism of Dragon Ball Super anime since they decided to redo the recent films. The Future Trunk Saga had things I didn't care for, but all I needed there were (actual) explanations for certain things.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#23443: Jan 1st 2017 at 3:01:45 PM

[up][up][up] yea, I've noticed Dragon Ball tends to be one of the most hotly debated series ever. So clearly when something that challenges their views of the series, the immediate response is kneejerk.

[up][up] WEN. BROLY!!!!!

edited 1st Jan '17 3:02:32 PM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#23444: Jan 1st 2017 at 3:04:00 PM

[up][up][up][up]Are these same people also likely to be "Dragon Ball should have ended with Frieza" people? Or even better, "Z never should have happened" people? It's just a hunch but I get the feeling those things intersect quite a bit.

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#23445: Jan 1st 2017 at 3:08:10 PM

I'm personally of the opinion that Dragon Ball peaked way back during the 21st World Martial Arts Tournament; that's when the combination of goofy comedy and outlandish martial arts action really hit the perfect balance. It was mostly downhill after that.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#23446: Jan 1st 2017 at 3:10:08 PM

Sometimes I question what people actually like about the series given how much energy some put into criticizing almost everything about it.

As much as I do get annoyed with people "shitting on" Toriyama, I think that's a rather silly thing to ask. Do you think people would get so emotionally invested if there wasn't something they are attached to?

People are most vocal about what they care about. And in the case of people who criticize Toriyama for his handling of the humans (since the Yamcha talk brought this up), it's easy to see what they care about. They got really invested in these characters and it's only BECAUSE they like these characters so much that they are capable of being so negative about perceived injustices toward them.

I mean you'll probably never find someone who disagrees with those fans more than me but I still don't have any trouble understanding where they're coming from.

I can be much more vocal about what I perceive to be this series' flaws because I care about it more than other series. If I don't like a series I don't really give it much thought.

The people I often see giving shit are those who had been acting as if they knew everything there was to know about the series for over a decade. Guess they are so high on their Word of Dante feeling that they will antagonice anybody who disagrees with them, incluiding the author.
Now that just seems like a different argument entirely and I'm having a little trouble parsing what you mean. If it's about Word of God that comes much later after the series concludes, than that's not really arrogance at all. In a lot of cases, especially Toriyama's, later additions can be in total contradiction of what came before. The original author isn't infallible.

edited 1st Jan '17 3:13:47 PM by Saiga

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#23447: Jan 1st 2017 at 3:29:13 PM

As much as I do get annoyed with people "shitting on" Toriyama, I think that's a rather silly thing to ask. Do you think people would get so emotionally invested if there wasn't something they are attached to?

People are most vocal about what they care about. And in the case of people who criticize Toriyama for his handling of the humans (since the Yamcha talk brought this up), it's easy to see what they care about. They got really invested in these characters and it's only BECAUSE they like these characters so much that they are capable of being so negative about perceived injustices toward them.

I mean you'll probably never find someone who disagrees with those fans more than me but I still don't have any trouble understanding where they're coming from.

I can be much more vocal about what I perceive to be this series' flaws because I care about it more than other series. If I don't like a series I don't really give it much thought.

It's not like I can't understand where some criticism comes from. Hell, I'm still not completely over how Gohan has been handled in recent times despite how tired people are of those complaints.

But I start reading some criticisms and it starts sounding less like actual critique and more "things would be so much better if they did things my way". And in that case, I start questioning what even attracted people to the series in the first place.

The line between legitimate criticism and simply bemoaning how things don't play out how you want them too tends to be pretty blurred in this fandom I notice.

edited 1st Jan '17 3:29:41 PM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#23448: Jan 1st 2017 at 3:39:09 PM

And in that case, I start questioning what even attracted people to the series in the first place.

???

It really isn't that hard to like aspects of something while also not liking certain plot or character developments.

edited 1st Jan '17 3:39:15 PM by Moth13

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#23449: Jan 1st 2017 at 3:56:51 PM

I literally just explained how it sounds less like critique and more like complaining how you want things to be.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Darthwyn leader of Inherit from The void Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
leader of Inherit
#23450: Jan 1st 2017 at 4:13:54 PM

The question of how they got interested seems to undermine the the statement a bit.

"Shall I use you, or make you mine... I'm not so sure what I'll do." - Dorthy

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