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LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#21351: Nov 27th 2016 at 8:31:30 PM

They definitely have three by the time of Super. Shenron straight up says he grants three wishes in the latest episode.

This song needs more love.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#21352: Nov 27th 2016 at 8:31:43 PM

Yeah, their views can evolve on issues. I know phrasing things like that might (understandably) raise eyebrows, but it's true.

Edit: Dammit, in reference to their (or at least Kaiser's) views on rape jokes.

Anyway, the number of wishes doesn't really matter here, they've already shown with Porunga that in the abridged verse the number is more of a guideline the dragons follow and something they have to strictly adhere to. Of course, they haven't annoyed Porunga as much as Shenron.

edited 27th Nov '16 8:34:40 PM by LSBK

Darthwyn leader of Inherit from The void Since: Feb, 2016 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
leader of Inherit
#21353: Nov 27th 2016 at 8:33:53 PM

[up][up][up] Chances of that are definitely high considering those were a while ago and a person's view can change over a period of time.

edited 27th Nov '16 8:34:42 PM by Darthwyn

"Shall I use you, or make you mine... I'm not so sure what I'll do." - Dorthy
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#21354: Nov 27th 2016 at 8:35:16 PM

Well the number of wishes won't be a problem since they're probably never doing Super.

edited 27th Nov '16 8:35:38 PM by Moth13

Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#21355: Nov 27th 2016 at 8:39:47 PM

Problem or not, it's spreading misinformation which is already something that's running rampant in this community. Especially since a lot of people have DBZA as their first exposure to Dragon Ball and wouldn't know better and even those people who have read the manga or watch the anime don't know better (like Kaiser).

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#21357: Nov 27th 2016 at 8:44:11 PM

As far as misinformation goes, I find it hard to care much since it affects literally nothing. Plus I still think you're misinterpreting the specific meaning of what he said.

Alfric Sailing the Skies! from Crescent Isle Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Sailing the Skies!
#21358: Nov 27th 2016 at 8:52:54 PM

If after 50 years have passed and they finally make it to Dragon Ball Super, they remember this, they could probably make a pretty funny joke about Pilaf getting three wishes because he's a slightly newer asshole from the ones who usually summon him, so Shenron lets him have another wish since Shenron is a magical wish granting dragon. Maybe Popo could enable it or something, if they really wanted to push that joke for so long. I mean, I don't watch Super so I dunno how many other characters were there when Pilaf's gang made the wish, so reactions might be limited, but I'm sure there's some room for material.

edited 27th Nov '16 8:54:07 PM by Alfric

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/lb_i.php?lb_id=13239183440B34964700 Alfric's Fire Emblem Liveblog Encyclopedia!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#21359: Nov 27th 2016 at 9:43:51 PM

IIRC, Dende does initially say they only have two wishes thanks to all the bonus content he's packing with them, and then amends his assessment to three but realizes that in doing so he's prevented people from coming back more than once. So him saying two now isn't yet violation of canon, as long as it's three with no multi-res by the time Goku needs a res. Maybe. It's been a while since I read the manga.

In other news, Cell recounting Goku's entire history and explaining the very personal revenge releationship he has with him on national tv is going to make it very hard for Satan to claim later that those blonde guys that Cell keeps paying attention to are nobody important.

edited 27th Nov '16 9:48:22 PM by KnownUnknown

Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#21360: Nov 27th 2016 at 10:22:52 PM

Well, you're right about that much.

Dragon Ball Volume 33, Chapter 393 (DBZ Volume 17, Chapter 199) Pages 124-125

Krillin: "So do we get three wishes like on Planet Namek?!"

Dende: "Uh-huh."

Piccolo: "Will we be able to revive more than one person with a single wish? Can we say, 'Bring back everyone killed by Cell'?"

Dende: "Hmm... Well... That's possible if I make them that way... But then we'll only be able to have two wishes."

As we've gone over before in the main thread, mass revives consumes two wishes but the wording of it makes it easy to misunderstand.

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
LOLypop1224 ...what am I even DOING here? Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
...what am I even DOING here?
#21361: Nov 27th 2016 at 10:35:48 PM

Then again, DBZA also made the timeskip to the Cell Games be a week instead of 10 days. I don't think they mind too much about sticking to the specifics.

I guess it really will come down to what they say when they actually use the Dragon Balls.

The *Legendary* Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant! He is a literal giant f***ing baby!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#21362: Nov 28th 2016 at 2:07:15 AM

I kind of agree that they should be more accurate but who are we kidding, anyone who takes DBZA seriously as a source of information has no hope.

Sorry to interrupt the shit-posting, but the reason the Cell Saga can be seen as Darker and Edgier is because, in the manga, aside from Mr. Satan, there are no jokes. Whatsoever. None, at all. Mr. Satan is only funny for like 2 chapters, which are seperated by the History Of Trunks chapter. The gore and violence is about the same as the sagas before and after it, but the Saiyan Arc had Kaio and shenanigans in the afterlife, the Freeza Saga has the Ginyu Force, and the Buu Saga has Gotenks, Gohan in school and a superhero, and the Elder Kaioshin. Aside from Mr. Satan, the Cell Saga has no comedy in it at all.

That's not true though.

Assuming the entire Android arc starts with Trunks' arrival, we've got Goku's comedic reaction to hearing Trunks' parentage, Goku forgetting Trunks' message immediately after, Bulma's comedic facefault at Goku wanting to fight the Androids, Kuririn's "uplifting" speech turning into him being scared of Vegeta (and Gohan naively pointing it out), Roshi's reaction to having his sunglasses stolen, Goku knocking Chi-Chi through their house, Goku getting flustered over accidentally revealing he knew baby Trunks' name, the way Yajirobe refuses to fight, the dude who gets freaked out by Kuririn and answers his "see anything suspicious?" question with "yeah, you!", Bulma chewing out Yajirobe for not following the others only to find out he can't fly, Yajirobe threatening to toss baby Trunks out of the window of the jetcar and immediately changing his tune when he finds out it's Vegeta's kid, Bulma giving Gohan a hard time about not flying faster when he's awkwardly carrying her and Yajirobe away, Kuririn asking for money to buy a jacket while searching for Dr Gero, Piccolo going FULL tsundere over Kuririn calling him his friend, Yamcha trying to cover up Gohan's absence to Chichi, the reaction the two delivery guys have to their truck being stolen in front of them, Chichi accidentally slamming her front door into Kuririn's face (and his reaction), Bulma's comedic yelling at Kuririn when he calls her, Bulma's mum's reaction to Bulma asking her to look after Trunks while she visits Trunks, the police's expressions and reaction after the Androids smash their car, Goku putting God and Piccolo's names together and annoying him, Yajirobe saying Goku must want to beg him to join the Cell Games, Chichi's reaction to seeing Super Saiyan Gohan for the first time, Goku's sheepish face and Piccolo/Trunks/Popo's face fault when he fails to find New Namek, Goku catching Kaio in a nap, Toriyama poking fun at the trope of characters explaining what happens off-screen (when Goku says, "I'll explain everything", we cut to a panel of Kaio being extremely shocked before Goku says he hasn't said anything yet), Kaio yelling at Goku when he's trying to concentrate on finding New Namek, Goku bitching at Kaio for interrupting his concentration, Goku changing the subject and being shifty when Chichi tries to make him promise Gohan isn't fighting, Android 16 refusing Goku's handshake and his reaction to it, the newscaster for the Cell Games in general ("this isn't a game! I mean, yeah, it's called that but!"), Chichi's friends watching Goku fght Cell and thinking he has bleached his hair, Kaio chewing Goku out for killing him, Gohan realizing Kuririn is in love with 18, Yamcha trying to talk tough about 18 and getting called out on it by Tenshinhan, Gohan innocently trying to cheer up Kuririn when 18 runs off, Kuririn remarking on how cheerful Goku is to be dead, Shenron getting impatient while waiting for them to make their second wish, Yamcha joking about using the wish to get a necklace for his girlfriend, Piccolo getting confused at Kuririn's crush on 18.

And you're also downplaying the amount of jokes Satan/the news crew get in. First, there is Satan's initial appearance before the Cell Games, then news crew interviewing the Z fighters, then the two chapters Satan gets mostly to himself at the start of the Cell Games, then literally EVERY chapter of the Goku/Cell fight has a joke from Satan or the news crew. It's not until Gohan steps up that the Cell Games stop doing jokes, which doesn't last for very long until the fight is over and they go back to jokes for the epilogue.

The largest stretch without jokes starts from when the Androids confront Piccolo on the Islands, because at that point it is a string of continuous fighting until the 10 day wait for the Cell Games starts. And as soon as we hit that period, the screentime is mostly used on jokes.

If you're not going to count the stuff before Cell shows up, then it's no wonder so few jokes are counted - his arrival is the first "shit gets real" moment of the arc, and it's followed up by that archipelago fight sequence that takes up most of the Cell portion of the arc. But Cell showing up really isn't the start of a new arc anyhow, it's just the Android arc moving into its more serious phase.

Even if it were a separate arc, there are still plenty of examples above from just that part. A lot of those don't sound like gags when you remove them from context, but in the manga they have the same comedic styling Toriyama uses for his gags.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#21363: Nov 28th 2016 at 2:44:31 AM

I don't think you had to point out every moment of humor during this thing...

Especially from the start of the saga, because that wasn't gonna prove anything...

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#21364: Nov 28th 2016 at 2:46:30 AM

I didn't NEED to, but it helps

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#21365: Nov 28th 2016 at 5:10:59 AM

Chichi's friends

Wait, back up, Chichi has what now?!

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#21367: Nov 28th 2016 at 5:51:42 AM

Fair enough, now that you mention them, I do remember every single one of those moments. I also remember that some of those aren't funny, some of them aren't framed as jokes, and some are dark comedy illiciting nervous laughter in a dire situation. I admit that I did overplay the lack of comedy, though, the Goku/Kaio concentration gag does always make me laugh. You have to admit, that long time in the middle of the arc where there's no jokes is pretty noticeable, and having the long run of calmer chapters be immediately followed by the History of Trunks chapter, is quite jarringly dark.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#21368: Nov 28th 2016 at 6:05:23 AM

I believe all those mentioned were intended as jokes, the framing is the same on all of them (though some are rather subtle). Whether they're funny is subjective, many of the obvious jokes aren't funny to me.

Trunks: The Story wasn't released in the order it appears in the volume edition. It's stuck at the end of volume 33 for convenience, but was released the week after Vegeta is defeated by Perfect Cell. It had nothing to do with the Cell games gags.

edited 28th Nov '16 6:05:29 AM by Saiga

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#21369: Nov 28th 2016 at 6:07:54 AM

Huh, I didn't know that.

DS9guy Since: Jan, 2001
#21370: Nov 28th 2016 at 6:50:33 AM

I can't remember the last time the series did a Lampshade Hanging on a plot hole or an absurd aspect on DBZ. The two most recent ones I can remember is the TFS version of The Dead Zone where it is pointed out that if those minions had killed Piccolo, those dragon balls Garlic Jr. wanted so much would no longer work and the episode where Android 17 asks how the hell Dr. Gero got his brain into a android. Guess that shows how much it has evolved.

EDIT: I totally forgot about the latest episode with the whole Warrior and Sage class thing with Piccolo even though they are suppose to be pretty much the same person.

edited 28th Nov '16 6:55:27 AM by DS9guy

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#21371: Nov 28th 2016 at 6:55:08 AM

The second was actually explained in the series, though. 19 was create first, and he turned Gero into 20.

edit: But has been mentioned before, it's one of those cases where TFS will sacrifice accuracy for humour.

edited 28th Nov '16 6:55:41 AM by Saiga

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#21372: Nov 28th 2016 at 7:04:01 AM

But 19 had those energy absorb thingies in his hands. How would he hold the brain without sucking all the life juice out and killing him?

Ghilz Perpetually Confused from Yeeted at Relativistic Velocities Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Perpetually Confused
#21373: Nov 28th 2016 at 7:05:48 AM

Wearing gloves?

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#21374: Nov 28th 2016 at 7:05:51 AM

Because he doesn't automatically use them all the time?

doineedaname from Eastern US Since: Nov, 2010
#21375: Nov 28th 2016 at 7:15:08 AM

Didn't he grant three in the Resurrection F Saga of Super, since the Pilaf Gang got both money and ice cream from Shenron after Frieza was revived?

No he only granted them two wishes there.


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