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Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#19976: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:30:05 AM

Aw I don't get to get to be childish from the sidelines?

edited 1st Sep '16 9:31:14 AM by Arha

Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#19977: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:31:38 AM

[up][up]I'd say several people were getting rather snippy.

Anyway. Back to the actual thread.

... um. Where did that green square even come from?

edited 1st Sep '16 9:32:04 AM by Larkmarn

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LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#19978: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:32:57 AM

[up]Emerald in the stone he carved the ring from?

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#19979: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:33:01 AM

I thought it was grass at first, showing that Cell missed a spot.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#19980: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:34:48 AM

But Kaiser can't draw grass...

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#19981: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:39:45 AM

Sorry, I missed the edit. I was just responding to the first line, not trying to be dismissive of your point.

Edit: Gohan not being impressed by Goku and Cell's fight and Goku giving Cell the Senzu bean is to really hammer in, the fact that if Gohan actually got serious, he'd be in no danger at all against Cell.

Going Super Saiyan 2 actually made things worse, because instead of just finishing him off, he played with him, which lead to things like Cell deciding to self-destruct, coming back "super-perfect", killing Trunks, and crippling Gohan to the point that things actually became a struggle.

Ignoring all this only serves to ham up the "child soldier" analogy that I said I was done directly discussing, but apparently that can't happen.

I'm not ignoring it at all. That's precisely where the Child Soldier narrative came from. The story was written in such a way that the world would literally end if Goku did not weaponize his preteen child. For the fate of everyone, Goku MUST put a gun in his unsuspecting son's hands and send him into battle.

The way this narrative usually works is that the child's decision that he made of his own free will to face danger and save the world is a heroic and noble deed. Dragon Ball presents it as the parent's decision to send his child into danger is a heroic and noble deed, and that's where the problem lies.

If Gohan was fighting because he made the choice himself and Goku was too beaten to stop him rather than because Goku threw him in the ring and went, "Go get 'im, son!" then the Unfortunate Implications wouldn't be there.

And it wouldn't require Goku to somehow fail to notice how much more powerful than him Gohan is, because he already didn't know about Super Saiyan 2 anyway. Gohan can be weaker than Goku and STILL wreck Cell once his battle power spontaneously doubles.

Yes, in the work as it exists, going Super Saiyan 2 causes all sorts of problems. And that hurts the narrative too. Because every choice Gohan makes of his own free will is depicted as wrong.

  • Refusing to fight Cell - WRONG
  • Toying with Cell rather than killing him outright - WRONG
  • Being too intimidated by Super Perfect Cell to fight him immediately - WRONG
  • Getting injured trying to save Vegeta - WRONG

The only right choices Gohan makes in the fight are the ones Goku makes for him. When Goku makes him fight Cell, and when Goku urges him and guides him during the Beam Struggle. Gohan is depicted as a shitty, incompetent excuse for a hero who can only succeed if Goku's holding his hand in the very scene where he's supposed to be rising beyond Goku and proving his mettle as the new protagonist.

Which, again, would be fixed if Gohan was fighting Cell by his own choice, against Goku's wishes, rather than because Goku shoved a gun in his hands and went, "Now go kill some bad guys!"

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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#19982: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:41:41 AM

[up][up]I only said it looked like grass to me at first.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#19983: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:44:11 AM

I thought it was some emerald ore in the rock.

A better question is how all those squares made a circle without Cell noticing. [lol]

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LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#19984: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:48:57 AM

I mean, I never took Gohan winning, as supposing to mean that Goku went about things in at all the right way, anymore than Piccolo being right about him having potential excused leaving him alone in the woods for months. But if we're done with that there's no reason to say more.

Serious question time, is Country really awful?

edited 1st Sep '16 9:50:17 AM by LSBK

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#19985: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:50:44 AM

Bias: Yes!!!!!!

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#19986: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:52:00 AM

I actually like Country. Country is the bane of all music, a blight upon the world, and the fact that it still exists in our timeline is proof that Trunks set out to Make Wrong What Once Went Right all along!

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edited 1st Sep '16 9:52:46 AM by TobiasDrake

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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#19987: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:53:47 AM

There's a few Country songs I remember liking, but I can't call myself a fan of the genre.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#19988: Sep 1st 2016 at 9:58:39 AM

The country I most remember are the ballads. I LOVE country ballads. Riding with Private Malone is one of my favorite songs ever written.

edited 1st Sep '16 9:58:59 AM by TobiasDrake

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WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#19989: Sep 1st 2016 at 10:54:23 AM

Is Ox King still kicking around? Because he's a great grandad now. Dude must be pretty old.

Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#19990: Sep 1st 2016 at 10:56:24 AM

Aside from a very small number of songs, country is pretty awful and wouldn't be missed by anyone worth talking to.

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Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#19991: Sep 1st 2016 at 10:58:28 AM

BUT IT GAVE US THIS:

edited 1st Sep '16 10:59:42 AM by Larkmarn

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LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#19992: Sep 1st 2016 at 11:25:31 AM

Though I enjoy poking fun at Country music fans, I can't take serious the notion that an entire genre of music is unilaterally terrible.

Still, I love the jokes.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#19993: Sep 1st 2016 at 1:50:51 PM

Earlier country music was pretty good, like Johnny Cash and Willie Nelson. Some modern artists like Chris Stapleton are pretty good too.

The rest? Utter bullshit. And I say that because I live in the south and have to live with idiots blasting that shitty excuse for music from the speakers of their Ford F-150's while going out to drive in the mud and shoot guns.

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God_of_Awesome Since: Jan, 2001
#19994: Sep 1st 2016 at 1:51:58 PM

So Country is a genre that suffered the worst from mass production neutering?

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#19995: Sep 1st 2016 at 1:53:51 PM

That's a problem in general with music, not really sure Country got hit by it the worst. But then again, I hate the "all music today sucks, everything before this generation was great" B.S. anyway.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#19996: Sep 1st 2016 at 2:05:47 PM

Most pop music at least has variety. Modern country is just...ugh.

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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#19997: Sep 1st 2016 at 2:10:04 PM

Huh, does Rockstar by Nickelback count as Country? Because that's one of the only songs I remember liking from that genre.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#19998: Sep 1st 2016 at 2:11:30 PM

Nickelback is post-grunge, which is basically the hair metal of alt rock. Never listened to that particular song because I don't have the urge to torture myself with the sounds of a man whose voice resembles a chain smoker passing a kidney stone.

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LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#19999: Sep 1st 2016 at 2:13:54 PM

I was about to say, someone who actually admits to liking something from Nickelback?

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#20000: Sep 1st 2016 at 2:14:35 PM

Rockstar is apparently one of the only Nickelback songs people admit to liking.

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