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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#18901: Mar 16th 2016 at 10:58:00 AM

Kaio-sama would know the difference between Frieza and the God of Planet Vegeta

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EchoingSilence Since: Jun, 2013
#18902: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:00:01 AM

Okay so how would you suggest writing around the whole "Destroyed by Meteor" and "Destroyed by Freeza" thing.

Because in the Abridged Series, Freeza just up and lied and said "Wasn't me"

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#18903: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:00:54 AM

Isn't that how they eventually said it in the original?

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Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#18904: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:02:43 AM

I'm going to laugh when Hit turns out to be a non mutant Friezaraceguy. I'll laugh and laugh and laugh.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
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#18905: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:04:20 AM

Yeah, in the original, Freeza lied about what destroyed Planet Vegeta. Still a retcon, but not a continuity error.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#18906: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:04:51 AM

There isn't a good way to get around it. In the manga, Planet Vegeta being destroyed by a meteor is explained by Raditz as he's expositing who he is and why he's here. When Toriyama retcon'd Frieza into it, his explanation for the misinformation is that Frieza lied about his involvement; Dodoria reveals the truth to Vegeta on Namek.

In the anime, Toei had Kaio-sama explain the fate of Planet Vegeta to Goku and added the stuff about the Saiyan God being distraught at the wickedness of the Saiyans - Toei loved pushing the Always Chaotic Evil angle too - which is much harder to get around, because Kaio-sama would know better. The only explanation I can think of for why he would give Goku false information is if he was lying through his teeth in the hopes that Goku wouldn't go after Frieza with some half-baked vendetta.

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WillDeRegio Since: Jan, 2015
#18907: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:08:05 AM

It'd be funny to find out their used to be a Frieza race. Then Frieza wiped most of them out to prevent competition. Or Frieza's home world is prime galactic real estate, slightly scorched.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#18908: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:09:17 AM

Honestly, that second one is exactly what I think happened: the name of Frieza's species is "S.O.L. Species #1".

But that's the kind of thing that should never actually be revealed if true, because Toriyama might decide down the road that he does want to use Frieza's species for something. Actually establishing that they're extinct just to get people to stop asking about them would be an unnecessary limitation on future story potential.

edited 16th Mar '16 11:10:25 AM by TobiasDrake

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wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
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#18909: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:28:45 AM

Stupid monkeys hit by falling rocks. HAHAHAHAHA PS Freeza rulez you

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
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#18910: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:29:29 AM

World building is not something to use haphazardly, yeah I agree.

I would've really liked to have said, you just didn't like world expanding, but...I know it's not true.

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#18911: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:35:11 AM

I love world expanding. I just understand why writers don't always feel the same.

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#18912: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:56:49 AM

I don't like world building/continuity because it seems like (and I like the way it's put in this article) fealty to the tyrannical reign of dead stories.

I personally prefer thinking of stories on their own merits.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#18913: Mar 16th 2016 at 11:59:32 AM

~cracks neck~ Here we go.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#18914: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:00:37 PM

That's just how I feel and think, anyway.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#18915: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:00:42 PM

I can't use that strawman on you though, you just admitted that it's true.

Aww, dangit.

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#18916: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:02:03 PM

And why shouldn’t the film rebel against the series? Once, if a person wished to tell stories, they got up and told stories. Spoken aloud, these stories were ephemeral, changing with every telling. There were traditions, to be sure, but storytellers could be confident that their creative departures would not be seen as errors or betrayals but as the embellishments of a virtuoso performance.

Mass literacy struck a mortal blow against this form of storytelling, and radio, film, and television finished the job. This kind of storytelling lives on (as no art form ever really dies), but only as a curiosity, something to gawk at at a Renaissance festival or take your children to at the public library. Mostly, when we want a story, we reach for a packaged one, a book or a DVD.

The idea of a new voice telling an old story that changes with the telling still exists. We call them adaptations or, when within the same medium, reboots.

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#18917: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:08:33 PM

Yeah, and how many people are mad at the Lord of the Rings films or, more topically, Dragon Ball Evolution for getting the details wrong or changing things?

Which isn't a defense of Dragon Ball Evolution on my part. That piece of shit had so many problems, and the changes were often nonsensical and pointless and often detracted from the spirit of the series, which did hurt the quality, but.

I mean, okay, it's totally fair to argue whether a given change hurts or helps an adaptation or reboot or sequel installment. Certainly there are bad changes.

But the complaint/criticism I'm against is the one that seems to argue that change of any kind is in itself bad. Which is certainly a viewpoint of some people out there.

edited 16th Mar '16 12:12:37 PM by unnoun

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
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#18918: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:13:31 PM

When Neil Gaiman's novella Coraline was being adapted into a movie, he told the writers to not make it identical to the original story. Some changes are good. Coraline added in a character for the protagonist to interact with during scenes that, in the original book, were mostly her talking to herself or thinking to herself, and most people who had read the book were accepting of that addition.

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#18919: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:16:10 PM

Which was a very important change. It's much easier to capture an audience's interest with a solitary character in text than film, because the audience can be welcomed into the character's mind for prolonged lengths of time. In film, it's difficult for a character to emote without having other characters to play off of.

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AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
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#18920: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:19:25 PM

I mean, for all the complaints about the length of Return of the King, Peter Jackson at least showed a good deal of restraint by not going for the entire long as fuck ending with the Scouring of the Shire and all that meandering ending fatigue.

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#18921: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:32:11 PM

I mean, I like the Scouring of the Shire, but I don't think it should have been in the Return of the King movie either.

Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#18922: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:35:35 PM

[up][up][up][up] Though you did have the rabid people upset that they threw male character to save the day because Coraline was so weak

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KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#18923: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:36:57 PM

The Scouring of the Shire's a great sequence, but it really doesn't have a place in the movies.

Oh God! Natural light!
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
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#18924: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:37:35 PM

[up][up]

They had him save her to make him at least somewhat relevant outside of a narrative function, and it was both of them working together, not a simple "dude saves chick" thing that those idiots on Cracked.com say happened.

edited 16th Mar '16 12:37:43 PM by AdricDePsycho

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Ekuran Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#18925: Mar 16th 2016 at 12:38:28 PM

I remember even as a small kid thinking that the whole Scouring of the Shire bit was superfluous.


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